Two days of misery - what should I let go and when do I need to be strict?

[MissStrawberry]

I think I expect too much of my kids though I am told by DH and my best friend I don't. And it has got me nowhere as they are still rude, stroppy, argumentative, etc.

Yesterday my 8 year old ran away as he felt his older sister and brother don't like him. Those few minutes when I looked for him and realised I didn't know where he was were horrific and I nearly lost the plot. They have been arguing, sniping, bickering with each other and answering me back and arguing with me almost all of the time for the last two days.

We have been out both days. We have been together. It isn't like I have been ignoring them while I drink wine and not taken them anywhere or bought/given them any treats.

I am told siblings argue (mine are boy 12, girl 10, boy 8) but honestly it is almost all of the time. They are also very rude to me and I am rendered speechless so need to know what to say as clearly the message isn't getting through.

Sending you sympathy... You're not expecting too much of them, but it doesn't sound like they are listening to you and respecting your authority. I would personally get the two older ones on their own, sit them down, and give them a stern talking to about their brother running away - he is the youngest, they are the older, (slightly) more responsible ones. If they have made him feel unhappy and unloved then they need to grow up, start being more considerate to each other, and accept responsibility - or else expect to start having treats and freedom taken away. Show your youngest ds some love and affection too, and make sure he understands how frantic and upset you were that he ran away, and how much you love him. If you're not sure how to handle the situation and how to get them to respect you, you could try getting some advice perhaps from a book - "How to talk so kids will listen" is very good (on Amazon). Certainly getting frustrated and snapping or shouting doesn't usually work very well in that respect. My dc's are younger so I can't give more specific advice I'm afraid, hope things improve for you though.

My dc's are younger so I can't give more specific advice I'm afraid, hope things improve for you though.. Me too but still a lovely post benji.

And very helpful too, thank you very much.

Just had them all stropping and they were all told that the consequences were going to be if they carried on being mean to DS2. Wondering now though if it was fair to say DD can't go to a birthday party this afternoon as it feels like I am punishing the birthday child.

I will be talking to them about how DS2 is feeling as it is really upsetting to see and they don't miss out by having a younger brother. We still do everything. They just don't like having a third less of everything. Well tough.

I would be tempted to sit down with all of them and make some rules.
By doing it together they can point out the things that make them unhappy, it gives everyone a stake in keeping to them and should make it seem less draconian. Really thinking about rules (and punishments for breaking them) as a team makes it all inclusive.
They are all old enough to deal with making up the rules and helping you enforce them!

I can see how that would go but I will try.

The older two will moan about DS2 wanting to join in and how "he spoils their games."

He would say how they don't like him "and that is why I ran away." How they don't let him join in.

They will continually answer me back and argue about why X can't do this and Y won't work as DC will do X etcetera.

I just suggested DS1 was old enough to set an example to DS2 when he was being rude to me and DS1 ignored me. DS2 is in the kitchen now doing as I asked calmly though.

I would be very strict about the rudeness. Zero tolerance in fact.

My husband and I agreed at the beginning of our relationship that rudeness/discourtesy/disrespect can easily become everyday currency and it does affect your quality of life. We have pretty much stuck by that so why would I accept less from my children?

Basic courtesy and respect does not mean that you have to agree with everything or that you should not be allowed your point of view. It simply means that you express your argument with a degree of respect.

It's hard to draw back the reins if your children have slipped into a pattern of rudeness but I'd make a start now. I'd explain all of the above and introduce a few basic rules which they will understand.

Those rules would be;

I'm not going to agree to any request until you ask properly.
I'm not going to listen to your point of view until you speak to me politely.
I will withdraw privileges/pocket money/whatever if you speak to me rudely.

Sounds draconian but I could not live with rudeness.

Not draconian at all and something I really need to stop.

I am trying to stay calm but finding it really hard when every single time I speak to them they answer me back or argue.

This sounds so familiar, although my children are younger (2 and 6) and I have the complicating factor of fairly recent marriage break up which must be playing into his behaviour. Also never underestimate the factor of the school holidays and the lack of routine.

My youngest is too young to make a family conference rule setting feasible but I think I am going to have to get that book as I am seeing shades of his fathers temper in ds and I really don't like it. And then I think, am I really seeing h in him or is this completely normal 6 year old behaviour which I am over reacting to? It's so difficult.

Much sympathy.

My MIL said the other day "that's what children do" and it annoyed me as it felt like she was saying I should know this and why don't I but I haven't had children before and wasn't a mum before!

I think you need to divide them up a bit by arranging for their friends to come over/for them to visit friends sometimes. Not all at once perhaps but if one child is out the other two might play better or if a child visits then you will change the dynamics of the group. My children play together quite well but enjoy a break from each other and enjoy time with me on their own what e n the other child is off somewhere else.

Yes, I sometimes send one to my MIL and that helps.

This afternoon I will just have the 2 boys if DD goes to the party.

There was a very interesting article I one if the papers at the weekend on sibling bullying and how it gets ignored etc , if you google " sibling bullying " it will probably come up .

Thanks. I'll take a look.