When is it OK to leave a child alone at home?

[Cfr]

My eldest dd is 10, and I occasionally leave her at home on her own for a few minutes, usually when I take a younger one to football, so I'm talking about 20 minutes at the most. I thought that this was fine, and dd is certainly resonsible enough, but I was shocked when I mentioned this to a very good friend to find that she was horrified. She thinks that I'm risking being 'caught' by social services and that I should find out the legal implications. She also assumed that this means that I will leave her in the house all day while I'm at work, but clearly she's not ready for that yet. I really believe that children need to be given responsibility in small amounts and then it can be increased as they get older. Surely it would be worse to suddenly leave her for a full day when she reaches 14, or whatever the appropriate age is considered to be?
I have since mentioned it to other friends, and found that many like me are leaving their 10-yr olds for short periods (mainly girls, though), but some are adamant that it's dangerous. As one friend said, anything could happen in the few minutes that your away. I disagree - my dd has strict instructions on what she can and can't do, and is very sensible anyway.

Does anyone know what the legal position is? And what have others done with older children?

Cfr, I think that's a really interesting question, and I, too would like to know more. As you say, leaving a child alone in the house is something that you'd want to introduce gradually, not suddenly leave them for a day as soon as it's legally OK. I have a feeling 14 is the legal age - but then isn't 16 the age they can legally start babysitting? rather a big jump in responsiblity in just 2 years, IMO.

There's also the possibility that if your 10 year old managed, for instance, to start a small fire in the house during the 10 minutes you were out, by calling the fire brigade, your absance would be seen as neglect and would automatically come to the attention of the social services. I really don't know if this sort of thing happens, but it worries me, also.

I started doing this when my daughter was about 10, thinking that at 11 she was going to have to take herself off to secondary school so it would be a good idea if she got used to being responsible for herself in her own home. I'm just starting to do it with my nearly 10yr old son - taking his brother off to gym (5 minutes away) and leaving him in front of the TV etc.

Having said, that, you do need to lay down some very firm rules. I concentrated on don't answer the phone (use the answerphhone - pick up if its me or dad only), don't open the front door - and then found out that the first time I let her bring a friend home when no one else was there (aged 11), they decided to do some history homework and fake a Tudor document by dipping paper in tea and setting fire to the edges - they nearly set fire to the kitchen! This was confessed about 6 days later. I never thought to say don't play with fire ...

This one has come up before - there is no legal minimum age that you can leave a child alone in the house or unattended. However, should the child come to harm, you could be prosecuted for neglect. It is illegal to leave a child under the age of 10 in a room with an open fire, we have some really bizarre rules in Britain! Scotland differs, I think, but don't quite me it is 5 years old.

Babysitting can be undertaken at any age, but the NSPCC recommend 14, my daughter has sat every week since she was 13, and has attended a full first aid course with me.
On leaving your own child, it all depends on the child. You know your child. My children wouldn't have a babysitter from the age of about 11, so I would get a student to take them to the cinema or such like, which made them more ameniable to the idea.

I have left them regularly since the age of 12, they are now 14 and 15. You just need to make rules, like no boiling kettles, cooking chips, using sharp knives etc. Go over rudiments of first aid with them, list contact numbers, make sure a neighbour knows that they are on their own, that you can be contacted other than mobile, it always happens that there is no service when you need it most! Don't think your eldest child is the most responsible either! My son at 11 was far more sensible and aware than his older sister and still is when it comes down to common sense!

Apparently my (very horrified) friend said that she'd heard of a 14 and 12-yr old who had been left alone and tried to fry chips and started a fire ... but I mentioned this to my dd and, of course, she said she would never fry chips (we don't have a chip pan). In fact, I always ask her to carry on with what she is doing while I'm out (usually watching TV or doing homework).

I too have ground rules - don't answer the door, don't pick up the phone unless it's Mum or Dad, and I am also careful never to leave the oven on while she's alone in the house (which I do if the house is empty).

As far as I'm aware, prosecutions only happen when there is obvious and extreme neglect, ie when parents leave very young children for 2 weeks or so. My dd walks to school on with her friend (5 mins walk, one minor road to cross), which also carries its dangers. Strangely enough, the particular friend I've mentioned (whose views on parenting are generally very similar to mine), has let her 6 and 8-yr old play out alone now for a couple of years, despite the fact that they once disappeared off to some shops which were off limits.

My problem now is that I feel I am being judged harshly for something which I was previously comfortable with.

I have also heard 14 is the legal age, but this seems ridiculous when they walk to school on their own from at least 11, and are usually going out meeting their friends by themselves too.

Alibubbles, sorry I hadn't seen your post. Has this been discussed before? I couldn't find anything when I looked. I quite agree that you know your own child, and not all children of 10 would be responsible enough to be left alone. In my case I can't see my second child being ready until he's in his mid-forties!

My neighbour's daughter used to babysit for us from around 14, on condition that her parents were in if there was an emergency. At first we actually went for dinner to their house while the daughter sat for us, which was an excellent introduction. She also used to spend time helping me with the children after school, so she knew them really well. She has (very inconsiderately!) gone off to uni now.

Alibubbles, sorry I hadn't seen your post. Has this been discussed before? I couldn't find anything when I looked. I quite agree that you know your own child, and not all children of 10 would be responsible enough to be left alone. In my case I can't see my second child being ready until he's in his mid-forties!

My neighbour's daughter used to babysit for us from around 14, on condition that her parents were in if there was an emergency. At first we actually went for dinner to their house while the daughter sat for us, which was an excellent introduction. She also used to spend time helping me with the children after school, so she knew them really well. She has (very inconsiderately!) gone off to uni now.

Cfr, I shouldn't worry about your friend's reaction - as you say, she lets her kids play out in a way you wouldn't, we all have different standards. Yes, "anything could happen in a few minutes" but suppose people have a really long garden and go out to hang out washing or do some gardening for 10 or 15 minutes, leaving the kids in the house, what's the difference?

When my eldest was 8 I would not let her play outside the backyard; my youngest, now 8, rides his bike (wearing a helmet, and not on the road) to friends' houses up to half a mile away. (He is supposed to ring me if he goes into someone's house, if we need to find him in a hurry.)

As Alibubbles says, the legal position is very cloudy. It's OK as long as nothing goes wrong, apparently. Considering the occasional cases where parents go off to Majorca or somewhere and leave their kids behind, I don't think we need to feel too bad!

(He also stays home alone if I have to go out for a bit - he really hates shopping. He is also instructed not to answer the door and he hardly ever answers the phone anyway.) (Neither do I, much, these days, cos it's never for me!)

I wouldn't worry about what other people say, cfr, do what you feel comfortable with. The thing is I think children are far too mollycoddled today. Sometimes we try to rush them into to grown up things, but hten baby them whe it comes down to being independent. When I was a child we lived in the midle of the New Forrest, we used to leave home at about 9 in the morning with a packed lunch and we wouldn't come home till five, we were only 8 and 10 years old. We'd go off on our bikes, amongst all the pony watching tourists. We never came to harm.

It was very unfortunate about Sarah Payne, but I admire her parents for letting the children be children, we used to do the same, roll around in the farmers hay fields until we got chased out!

We also used to sit in the guards van on the train on the way to school, he used to give us sweets!! He'd let us sit on his lap in the drivers chair!! Any alarm bells ringing, not then for us or any of our parents! We were all of 11 years old! And did this for the next 7 years, with nothing untoward happening.

I used to leave home at 7.am, it was dark, catch a bus t the next village, catch a train at 7.20 into Brighton, change lines to the Portsmouth line and then get off near Hove and walk another 20 mins. We did the reverse in the evening and didn't get home till 5.30 and if the trains were late our parents never wonddered where we were, No phones in those days, and this was only 28 years ago (okay a long time ago, for some of you babies!)

It amuses me that we run our kids everywhere whilst at Primary school, then all of a sudden, they're on the public bus to school, what a shock for some children, if they got used to it younger, they'd be able to cope a lot better and not end up in Amersham like my daughter and her friend did aged 14 when they just got on the first bus going the right direction and didn't realise it was on a loop!! I made them stay on it until they were going the right direction so they coculd learn fom it. It would have been easier and quicker to go and fetch them from Watford, but what would they have learned - Mummy always bails us out!

I let my son go to London, it worries me, he goes to Camden Market, he's 14. I let him walk home 2 mile from the station up a dark country lane, he says it's no big deal. I do offer to fetch him, but he enjoys the exercise. Okay, he has a phone, and will always let me know where he is etc. BUT, I still worry, it wouldn't be natural, a complete contradiction of my own feelings about childhood, but there you are! That's enough from me!

My ds is 9yrs and I have only left him alone twice. Both times in the last 6mths. And both times I was walking to the local shops with dd and he didnt want to come. I was gone both times for aprox 15mins and I gave him a list of don'ts.
ie; Don't answer the door to anyone.
Don't answer the phone.
Don't GO in the kitchen AT ALL!
Don't go upstairs AT ALL!
In fact I told him to stay on the couch watching tv and if he has to go the loo he must use the one downstairs. I was afraid he might fall down the stairs{}

I know this list seems ludicrous . After all he has survived these 9yrs without causing a fire or falling down the stairs. But I still virtually ran all the way back home.
Sob! I just don't want him to grow up. I want him to stay my little boy forever.

Alibubbles. Your childhood sounds idyilic. Just like the Famous Five!
I would love my son to have a similar childhood but I just cannot relax whilst he's out of my sight. I have only recently let him go to his friends house around the corner. I give him my mobile so I can ring him. Although I hate doing that. He is under strict intstuctions never to use it himself.

This will sounds awful,so please don't take it personnally any-one and please don't worry about your kids ,I'm just being neutrotic. But does any-one worry that their kids will do the stupid things you did as a kid. Looking back we did some really dumb things. my sister and I used to light fires in the attic. We'd also go for bike rides on the moors, and I remember being picked up by my parents at twilight because I hadn't come home and I didnt have any lights on the car. And going to the travelling fair on my own. But my parents would always give us an interrogation before we went out... who were we going with, how were we getting there(and home) and at what time.

Callie, thanks! I did have a lovely childhood, I really enjoyed being a child. other things we use to do were going to the 'swamp' and playing in the streams. We also had an old dinghy boat that we used to muck about in, NO parental supervison at all!! We use to see how far we could walk into the pond before water came over the tops of our wellies! We used to ride on our bikes around the common over pheasants nests popping the eggs. We used to pick blackberries and sell them to the greengrocer for 6d a punnet, and also get up at the crack of dawn to pick mushrooms to sell, living always next to airfield, they always grew in great abundance for some reason. We also nicked daffodils from someones garden and tried to sell them on the roadside. I don't think my parents knew about that!

I was an air force brat, so we had a lot of freedom on airbases and I suppose it was considered safe. We were always with other children.

When I lived in Cornwall, I learnt to swim by jumping off the quayside in Padstow, aged 5 years old, the instructors said jump! we did and invariably went through the rubber rings we had on, if we didn't surface they then looked for us! We bobbed about with the boats and fishermen.

We had bikes that had no brakes, I still remember the disgusting green pussy scab on my elbow from falling off! Also we were all very bright kids, doing 11+ a year early and things like that. We all loved school, I had a friend who I would change clothes with when we got to school and wear each others all day long until hometime for some reason!

I try so hard to give my children a taste of my childhood, I succeed to a certain degree, my son has seen parts of London I wouldn't visit, then he hs no preconceived fears or ideas, so goes in eyes wide open!

There are things I've done that my kids will never experience, like I know the names of all the flowers, trees, birds, clouds etc. We sailed all summer, could read the weather and so on. Mind you my husband doesn't but then I suppose he was a townie!

I don't actually consider myself any different from any other kid of my time, although I did have a fairly priviledged upbringing, I can remember my parents being'hard up' sometimes, but the coveted present was always there. It's only now I realise that they must have tried really hard to do this. I can never remember being disappointed or sad about anything. I must have been very lucky, but I thought for a long time that everone else had the same kind of upbringing.

helenmc - just laughing at the lighting fires in the attic thing. Fantastic. We use to make fireworks, bangers, with matches, cotton wool, tin foil and candle wax. But lighting fires in the attic is fantastic!

Gosh, I feel like a wicked witch for keeping my children locked up, now. I never left my boys on their own until they were 13 or 14, partly becuase I didn't trust them not go up into the attic and fire-raise a la helenmc. My older DD, coming up for 15, has been left since she was 12-ish, but she is much more sensible. I'm now in the curious position of having people asking her to babysit for them, while I still think she is too young to babysit her own sister!!!

As a matter of interest, a friend had the Social Services on her doorstep, because her 11 yr old was left for 20 minutes a day, due to work arrangements. She got the third degree and they were pretty ruthless with her, coming back to check out the childcare arrangements she'd had to make. Not a nice experience especially as she's a wonderful, caring mum.

As everybody has said I feel that one knows ones child. I had the same approach as Copper and tried to prepare my daughter for the responsibility of secondary school by leaving her alone for a short while (with lots of rules) and gradually lengthening time alone and later allowing her to go with friends into town. Our next big adventure is to allow her to go into the nearest city with a friend (Bath 15 miles away) but although we have discussed the possibility with her she has said that she is not ready yet. Which is fine. However, I do agree with others that children need to learn responsibility and whilst as a parent one will always worry one has to allow them some freedom and independence.

Cfr, you and your daughter sound very sensible to me, and have obviously thought out the ground rules here. You alone know your child and are happy she is responsible enought to be left at home for short periods on her own.
She presumeably occasionally walks home from school on her own and she is far safer in your home than the walk to school and I am sure your critical friend deos not object to her walking to school by herself.
Interesting that none of us think it is in the least risky for your daughter, but are more concerned with social services finding out!
Anyone here work for social services? In fact, does anyone here have first hand experience of social services? They get such a bad press it is hard to believe it is all true.

I'm not sure how I feel about the whole leaving kids alone thing...I?m not sure of the legalities of it, but I think the ?acceptable? age depends a lot on the individual child. Some children become independent at a younger age than others ? and some have more commonsense too! As Winnie says, I think you know your own child/ren better than anyone and how responsible they are, and how far you can trust them to do the right thing. I guess if you see how they go for short periods, once you feel you can trust them you will probably be more comfortable with doing it. My kids are only 5 and almost 3, so leaving them is not an option yet; maybe once they are about high school age, hard to say until we get there! But I don?t think I would be comfortable at the moment leaving them with a babysitter who was younger than 17 or 18, especially at night.

This is a bit off the subject but - my mum was a working mum and my brother who is 4 yrs older than me was my "carer" after school and over school holidays. It never really worried me then, but it kinda freaks me out now that mum used to leave us at home alone and even let us go into the city on the train by ourselves to see a movie - he must have been 12 to 15 at the time. Obviously we never came to harm (altho I recall running across the road after my brother in the city and being narrowly missed by a motorbike - mum still doesn't know!)

On a sad note, I recall in the news here recently an 8 year old died after getting burned in a fire while her mum went to pick up her son from soccer practice, leaving her with her older sister (I think she was 11 or 12) and younger sister (3 or 4) - and an open fireplace. The fire somehow spread into the room and she (the 8 yr old) was trying to put it out and got caught in it. Obviously it wasn't a good idea to leave them with the open fire burning, but I think as well as teaching your kids not to play with fire, it's also important to tell them that if a fire does start for any reason and they can't put it out within a few minutes, to call the fire brigade and get out of the house as quick as they can, or go to the neighbours and ask them to call. Make sure they understand that you value them far more than the house!!! I imagine this poor girl thinking that she would be in trouble if she didn't put the fire out, even though it was obviously too big or out of control for her to do so.

Accidents happen, it?s dangerous to imagine they can?t - if kids know what to do when things go wrong it can prevent a tragedy...basic first aid, exit routes from the house, where keys are kept, emergency phone numbers (on speed dial if you have it), a meeting place away from the house (eg a trusted neighbour). Sometimes the simple things that we know or remember can make all the difference in a crisis!

What in interesting discussion this is turning out to be. My son will be 8 in a few months, and now he is in the juniors, I am beginning to feel my baby is fast becoming an 'older child'. So it's really good to hear how parents of older children cope with things like this. And Alibubbles, lovely to hear about your childhood. Like you, I really want my son to have the same sort of freedom I had as a child. Mind you, I was bought up a townie, so my childhood was not as free range as yours!

We've always had a fairly liberal view about my son playing out - though within strict boundaries. I was beginning to get the impression that few mumsnetters let their 7/8 year old children play out or independely visit neighbouring friends houses (telling us where they are), so it was really reassuring to hear what you had to say, Janh.

Our son has about the same free rein,but a smaller area of activity. Put that down to geography. We don't let him cycle by himself on roads yet, just because, IMO, his road sense is not good enough faced with the traffic our streets attract. I have just started to let him go to the local supermarket alone. He absolutely loves buying a bag of groceries for us.

He sometimes spends 10 minutes alone in the house when my husband goes to pick up our toddler from the nearby childminders. Because we have a toddler, it is unlikely dh and I will be able to leave them alone together for years, even if our oldest son is responsible enough by himself.

One problem we have encountered is this: In other nearby families, with older children and teenagers, the parents may leave the older children in charge of the younger ones for a while, so a 7 year old may be in the care of an 11 year old.

While a duo like this is fine by me - I trust the mother knows what she is doing, I have second thoughts about adding my son to the mix. So if he asks me if he can play at their house, I feel compelled to say no. A slightly awkward situation, because if this gets back to the mother, it could look like I am criticising her judgement, when in fact I do not want to over-burden the 11 year old with another charge.

Tigermoth1, I think you are absolutely right about not letting your son join the other unatttended children, it's one thing leaving your own, but adding another to the scenario sounds like trouble waiting to happen. I would say that you don't think it's fair for her 11 year to take on the resposibility for another child during her absence, no matter how short a time.

My two are 14 and 15, and NO ONE is allowed to come round if they are on their own, it could turn into something very different, no matter how much I trust my children. I would be furious if I found out otherwise, and they know that there would be very serious repercussions. The good thing is they have been to a few parties where the parents have been away and the houses have been trashed a bit, they have seen the consequences and both have promised they'd never do it, DD says she doesn't know how to clean cream carpets and sofas!

My daughter is going to Peru for a month ( scarey or what) this summer on the World Challenge post GCSE's, she then wants to go away with her friends to Cornwall for a week. I'm not happy about that, but she is a very sensible child - She actually looks after a 7 year old everyday that goes to her High School, she walks her home a mile and then makes her tea, till mum comes back at 5.30 and brings her home, gets paid £160 a month for her Peru fund !) So that's my dilemna, is she old enough? ( Absolute NO NO to abroad apart from PGL where they went last year for 2 weeks) What do you all think?

I quite agree with you Tigermoth1 about leaving an older child in charge of younger ones. I have younger children, and I can see that it's very tempting to leave them in the care of the eldest, but I feel that it's far too much responsibility for the child. And no, I wouldn't let my children go to play at a house where there was no adult in charge. I have, however, left my daughter at home alone with her friend for 15 mins, but I discussed it with her mum first, and we agreed that they're both responsible enough.

Janh, that was a good point about being out in the garden - we have a long garden and a 3-storey house, so if I'm outside in the garden for a couple of hours, my daughter could be out of earshot if she's upstairs.

helenmc, I know what you mean about doing stupid things as a kid. When I was about 9 or 10 (and responsible for bringing my 2 younger sisters home from school!), we used to play 'chicken', jumping out in front of cars so that they had to screech to a halt. One day a van driver got out and gave us such a telling off that we never did it again. I remember him shaking with shock because he'd very nearly hit us. I still can't believe I could have been so stupid.

Thanks to everyone for your comments - I think I was taken aback by how horrified my friend was.

Batters, it's interesting that your first thought is that it's madness leaving a child on their own - could this be because you feel so far away from this stage that you can't even comtemplate it? I wonder if this is what prompted my friend's reaction?

Alibubbles, is it the week in Cornwall that's worrying you most of all? Presumably, you know her friends too? And know the type of place she'll be staying in? I can understand your worries though - at the moment I can't imagine mine going off on holiday on their own, yet it's not so far off.

I have heard that there is no definitive answer so far as the law is concerned. Like you I have a responsible 10 year old girl who I occasionally leave at home for a few minutes (usually while collecting her sister from ballet). She is under strict instructions not to answer the door. I agree with you that you have to gradually increase their independence not do it all at once. What about letting them out on their own to go to a near by friends? In someways this is far more dangerous than staying at home if you know they won't set the place on fire etc.

Well, my next plan was to let her go to her friend's house on her own this year, as it's not far. She'll have to ring when she gets there though. She loves having this extra bit of independence, which makes me think it's the right thing to do.

Since nobody seems to know what the legal position is, maybe there isn't a legal age? I have wondered whether to ask my next door neighbour, who works in Social Services, but if she says it's absolutely not allowed, I'd be worried about being reported.

Well Cfr and Batters, I think the Cornwall bit is scarey cos she's my baby!!
I mean have you seen what goes on down in Rock? Well I suppose I've got this far relatively drama free and she is a young woman growing up. She is so looking forward to being in the 6th form and at some time she's going to start to 'grow away' from us! She's talking about university in USA or Canada, she really wants to go to a 'blue stocking type" of uni like Vassar

She will also be coming to America with us for the last two weeks of the hols, bringing her best friend as well, we've treated them to business class seats, (we're going first!) while my son is in France for 2 weeks at the same time on a PGL, funny how I don't seem to worry about him so much. He's the nightmare, breaks up on 5th July and doesn't go back till 8th Sept!

DD will be away for her GCSE results, she's not bothered about getting her results until we get back on the 2nd Sept, I don't think I can wait that long! She is predicted 10 A's, they're not allowed to predict A*s, but she did get 4 in her mocks, so she knows she is going to the sixth form regardless. It's going to be driving lessons next year!

Life was so easy when they were little!