introducing a 3rd language to 21 month old

[koolkat]

DH and I speak to 21 mo DS in our native language. It is the only language he understands well and he can say a few words.

So far, he has had very little exposure to English as we never speak to him in English (this is deliberate as we think it is the best way for him to become bilingual), and I am not concerned about this as he will learn English once he goes to school here in England.

DH speaks French like a native and we would like DS to learn French too as both DH and FIL have lived in France and Switzerland and studied there so we can see how it would benefit DS to have 3 languages very early on.

My question is really directed to any one who has taught their child a 3rd language early on. As DH only speaks to DS in our native language so far, what is the best method of exposing DS to French ? I am concerned that if DH switches to speaking to DS in French now, DS will eventually only associate DH with French and we will lose an important element of our native language relationship at home.

Also my French is very basic, so the 3 of us would not be able to communicate at the same time.

Obvioulsy the key thing for us is that DS becomes bilingual in our native language and English. French is just a bonus.

Does anyone have experience with this and how should we introduce DS to French without endangering our native language at home ?

Cheers

oops, sorry I must have pmt.

MrsBigD - I would like to remain incognito - I am in the secret service you see hence the secrecy and multiple language use in my family

Lucy5 - my question was not whether I should be teaching my language and/or English or indeed when. He will learn both, I am certain of it as I have managed to learn both and so have my siblings without any disadvantages whatsoever. I can only think of advantages: ability to speak to all our relatives in 2 languages, ability to read and write in 2 languages, ability to communicate fully within several countries, etc. etc...

My original question was HOW and WHEN should I introduce a 3rd language ? I guess no one has an answer to this one ??

I'll have to ask the Swiss I guess as many Swiss children speak 3 languages fluently, any Swiss MNers out there ?

koolkat we shall keep you incognito then

as for when to introduce... the earlier the better because the 'libraries' in kids brains for phonetics etc get built at a very early age, hence chances of speaking without an accent are higher. Well at least that's what I've read.

And yes there are a lot of tri-lingual Swiss people around. Maybe even quatro as most of them speak Swiss German and German which even to my ear are 2 different languages ;)

MrsBigD - thanks I think you are right about the age thing. I read somewhere too that the optimum time for learning a language like a native is before the age of 10.

ps - I am also known as 000999 - it must be as that is what DS keeps dialling on the phone - the little monkey is on to me !!

I don't know if any of these ideas appeal or are even feasible but wouldn't introducing the third language be easier in a given context - i.e. an aupair, a visit to France, a bilingual play group, or even French "lessons"? Couldn't you find a French speaking family and arrange some sort of mutual play-date with DH taking Ds along? Long-term, what about a bilingual French-English school?

Kiss - I think you are right. We will need to introduce a 3rd person in order for him to learn French well. Can't afford a French nanny or au pair, otherwise that would be ideal.

I think French lessons are a good idea with DH helping him along. I think as long as he has "an ear" for French it will help quite alot. DH picked up quite alot of French when he was very small beacuse his father spoke it well, although it wasn't their native language.

My cousin is a teacher and also feels non English speaking children not only hold back the rest of the class but dominate her time as she attempts to include 4 children all speaking different languages plus her English pupils. TBH I'm not sure it's fair an English child speaking THEIR native tongue should be held back in an English school.

Bornberry, those non-native speakers of English should be given additional language classes then, to get them up to scratch. Or else a language assistant to give them more help.

The English natives will hopefully learn valuable lessons in getting along with folk from other cultures and language groups.

Koolkat, why not try French language children´s TV programmes and nursery ryhmes etc.? DVDs at the library may even have a French language option. Your DS and DH could watch the DVDs together to help DS understand.

I know a family in Brussels, Mum speaks Dutch, Father Serbo-Croat, general population French. Kids never had a problem and speak all 3 plus others, fluently!

I have a 3 years old plus a newborn.I speak to him in Italian ( my native language),my hubby speaks in Arabic and my hubby and I speak to each other in English..well my son only answers in english as I tend to address him in english if his daddy is present or we are out and there are other people how are interacting with us.he goes to a playgroup and as hardly any problem getting understood.
best to keep going in your own native language as kids def understand it from an early stage..don't expect thought an aswer in the same language..my son understand commands in all 3 but would only answer in english..don't know why ....

Who funds these additional language classes though, an already struggling state system? would it not make more economical sense for the children to be bilingual when entering school, their second language (English) could be learnt in a relaxed environment even 6 months before they started school to ensure their mother tongue was firmly established.

I think its perfectly understandable you want to ensure the above but I also think if you want to use a state funded system the onus is on you to ensure your child can understand and not for the government to provide additional resources; the cost implications of language classes for every possible language considering the amount now spoken in the UK would be horrific.

I TOTALLY agree regarding the valuable lessons from other cultures and languages, totally invaluable IMHO but I don't think those lessons would be any less if both parties could communicate in the same language, if only at a very base level?

I'm also sure many children will fit in and learn the language, but children can also be very cruel and I think School can be hard enough without the potential of a child so young feeling isolated by the fact they cannot be understood nor understand even basic English.

Berry

Well. Now my opinion.
My children started school with little English.
Yes, it has been hard and am pregnant again, and have asked them to speak English from now on ( which they do, nut not to dh or me).
when we came here, our english wasn't good enough to teach the children.
at school there were ESL teachers. But they were only for the urdu speaking children, most of them second generation.
My opinion is dat yes, we as foreigners pay lost of taxes and have given work -oportunity for many people here- yes, it would be fair being at least symphetetic to our children's need, for example, of only encouraging other children to play with them instead of putting all the foreigners together.Esl lessons should be for especially for people who are less then 10 years in the country, as you can't expect them to speak English to their children.The lessons in the native language- it is up to their own country to provide lessons, like for example I get dutch teaching-material from our government end the italian government provides free lessons in our area.
an esl teacher who speaks half urdu- half badly englsih to children is a waste of money imo en i would never expect the english government to pay dutch lessons for my grandchildren, just to keep our identity..

As for french, my children are now at private school (learn the language much better and quicker in smaller groups, even if half of the class is foreign)and get french lessons. It is fun. of course it doesn' make them native speakers French but the fourth language is no problem at all.only, the more input you get, the more you will know a language.If you try teaching too many languages, you might end up not knowing any of them like a native speaker and my priority would be the language of their secondary school/ social environment

Well. Now my opinion.
My children started school with little English.
Yes, it has been hard and am pregnant again, and have asked them to speak English from now on ( which they do, nut not to dh or me).
when we came here, our english wasn't good enough to teach the children.
at school there were ESL teachers. But they were only for the urdu speaking children, most of them second generation.
My opinion is dat yes, we as foreigners pay lost of taxes and have given work -oportunity for many people here- yes, it would be fair being at least symphetetic to our children's need, for example, of only encouraging other children to play with them instead of putting all the foreigners together.Esl lessons should be for especially for people who are less then 10 years in the country, as you can't expect them to speak English to their children.The lessons in the native language- it is up to their own country to provide lessons, like for example I get dutch teaching-material from our government end the italian government provides free lessons in our area.
an esl teacher who speaks half urdu- half badly englsih to children is a waste of money imo en i would never expect the english government to pay dutch lessons for my grandchildren, just to keep our identity..

As for french, my children are now at private school (learn the language much better and quicker in smaller groups, even if half of the class is foreign)and get french lessons. It is fun. of course it doesn' make them native speakers French but the fourth language is no problem at all.only, the more input you get, the more you will know a language.If you try teaching too many languages, you might end up not knowing any of them like a native speaker and my priority would be the language of their secondary school/ social environment

Well. Now my opinion.
My children started school with little English.
Yes, it has been hard and am pregnant again, and have asked them to speak English from now on ( which they do, nut not to dh or me).
when we came here, our english wasn't good enough to teach the children.
at school there were ESL teachers. But they were only for the urdu speaking children, most of them second generation.
My opinion is dat yes, we as foreigners pay lost of taxes and have given work -oportunity for many people here- yes, it would be fair being at least symphetetic to our children's need, for example, of only encouraging other children to play with them instead of putting all the foreigners together.Esl lessons should be for especially for people who are less then 10 years in the country, as you can't expect them to speak English to their children.The lessons in the native language- it is up to their own country to provide lessons, like for example I get dutch teaching-material from our government end the italian government provides free lessons in our area.
an esl teacher who speaks half urdu- half badly englsih to children is a waste of money imo en i would never expect the english government to pay dutch lessons for my grandchildren, just to keep our identity..

As for french, my children are now at private school (learn the language much better and quicker in smaller groups, even if half of the class is foreign)and get french lessons. It is fun. of course it doesn' make them native speakers French but the fourth language is no problem at all.only, the more input you get, the more you will know a language.If you try teaching too many languages, you might end up not knowing any of them like a native speaker and my priority would be the language of their secondary school/ social environment

Rhianna, I agree with the pressures - my DH's mother didn't bring him up bilibgual becasue she felt his sister had been held back at school largely by insensitive teachers. To answer your original question koolkat, I'm bringing up DD bilingual French-English (I'm half French so bilingual). I take out a subscription to a French children's magazine. For Italian, we have Italian-speaking friends and thought we'd let it ride, but DD has learned a surprising amount from 2 of her friends at nursery for speak Italian (one of the nurses does too and has encouraged some language play). What really helped was going to Italy for a week - nearly a year on, she still pronounces Naples as Nahpoli, etc.

Sorry - I mean I agree that the pressures are significant for parents!