Have just really lost my temper with DS1

[terriblyguilty]

DS1 is 6. He has always struggled at bedtime, ever since he was a baby. Always been a nightmare to wind down and go to sleep.

Things had been getting better but recently they have slid back again.

We have told him that if he isn't tired at bedtime (8pm) then he can stay in his bed and read with a light on if he wants to. But he doesn't. He gets up, wonders around, climbs on windowsills - the lot. He keeps coming downstairs and sitting in the hall etc.

Last night, it was gone 10pm by the time he went to sleep. All day today he was tired and grumpy, behaviour was horrible.

And again tonight, he had a shower, did some quiet colouring, had a story with DH, a song with me. Bed time at 8:10 but still he keeps going. He came downstairs about 15 minutes ago for the umpteenth time and I really lost my temper. Really shouted at him.

I walked back up to bed with him but he got out of bed again. I ended up slamming his bedroom door and the door handle came off. I don't know what came over me .

If anyone else had done this to him I would have been livid - told them how aggressive, and frightening and downright counter productive it is. I feel awful.

I'm just at the end of my tether. I don't know what to do. I have pains in my chest I feel so worked up but I just don't know what to do.

What's he doing now? Have you suitable shocked him enough for him to know you mean business?

I've been known to loose my temper wen they push it to far, especially if I'm hungry or looking forward to a bath & PJ's but they still crawl in for a morning cuddle & all is forgotten.

I don't think you should give yourself a hard time over it, sounds like you DC is really trying to oush the boundries!

No, it hasn't made a difference. He's still coming downstairs (3 times since).

Genuinely at a loss.

I think he's finally gone to sleep.

I just feel like such a shouty parent at the moment. I don't know how to get through to him about anything.

nothing seems to work

DD3 is only just 4 but has gone from a great sleeper to a complete pain in the arse.

Last night she was awful so this morning I banned her from watching TV and playing on the ipad after school, every time she asked for TV/ipad I told her no and why.

Tonight was the first night she went to bed with no fuss.

Can you try taking something away from him/do a chart with a reward.

I understand why you feel at a loss x

I have tried no TV in the past, but it didn't really make a difference.

Also, now DS2 is 3, it's not really fair on him to have no TV too.

I'm terrible at reward charts as I always forget about them and it loses it's impact

Marking place as I have 4 yo exactly the same. She is so tired yet keeps saying "I can't sleep".

We got really really shouty last night too, and she's been told she can't go to a birthday party on Saturday unless she GOES TO BED NICELY!!!

Tonight was slightly better but she still wandered out around at 8.30 saying she wanted hugs / toys / water / other random stuff ...

The no TV rule stands that DD3 isn't allowed to choose the programme which really bugs her because her sisters like the cookery channel

I keep a laminated reward chart on her bed, I put it on the floor at night time and when I make her bed in the morning it gets put on her pillow for night time.

She gets a sticker for getting dressed and another one for letting me brush her teeth and hair and an extra one for night time.

She loves her little people and some soft toys + TV & ipad so I confiscate them when she doesn't do what is expected ie night time.

It's hard but it works for us.

Just been through this with my normally very good at bedtime 7yo.

I just drew up a set of 'rules' and 'rewards' to earn back 8pm bedtime.

Simply this: Night 1 bed at 7pm. No calling, getting up etc then night 2 he gets 10 minutes later, if he got up then 10 minutes earlier.

I used my most firmest I mean this mummy voice!!

Night 1 - not a sound.

Night 2 - tried it on, and went back to 7pm bedtime for night 3

Night 3 - tried it on

night 4 - 6.50pm bedtime, had to listen to all the children playing out in the street but not a sound.

Then he settled down and he earnt the 10 minutes everynight but with the result being getting sleep has meant he's actually needed more and wanted to go to bed at 7.30pm some nights!!

Tonight we met friends for cycle ride after dinner because it's so hot and he had an 8pm bedtime. He was so chuffed he'd got 8pm again that one threat warning of 7pm tomorrow if he misbehaved worked.

Don't feel bad about shouting - children do need to know the impact their behavior has on others. As you allow reading etc it's not like your forcing an untired child to sleep. Your just expecting him to stay in his room. DS has a torch in his bed so he can read etc if he wishes.

Same again tonight. He's still not asleep.

Wasn't allowed to ride his bike to school today. Clearly hasn't made a difference.

Must add that I didn't lose my temper this evening.

I think he's finally gone to sleep!

Hello,

That's really tough, 10.30 is so late and gives you no time to recover before he wakes up again.

Well done for not losing your temper.

Is there a big treat you can work towards? E.g 3 nights going to bed well = X. At 6 he should be able to work towards that?

We had a better night last night, but only with heavy threats which I hate.

At six he's capable of understanding a simple instruction like 'stay in bed and read' so he's just being naughty and winding you up on purpose. I think you need to get a lot tougher with some serious sanctions for any messing about. You don't have to shout exactly but, through tone of voice and expression, you can make it understood that you're pissed off and his behaviour is unacceptable. No TV may not bother him but something will. Weekend activities? Playdates? Sport? Find that something, threaten to remove it, and be consistent.

No advice but going through the same with my ds who's 5.
Last night I was in tears totally worn out after having a d & v bug and so looking forward to an early night.
I ended up downstairs with him at 9.20 having given up.
I shouted , threatened no football, no playing after school in the end I had to get in bed with him until he fell asleep.
To top it all ds & ds have been utter nightmares this morning too & I've been in tears again - i feel like I'm doing a crap job as I can't seem to stop the bad behavior or get ds to sleep at night

Well, this morning he looked so tired. He was broken, with huge black circles under his eyes. Really floppy.

He has football after school and always goes to his best friends house for tea (I'm usually at work). I have the day off today so leapt on the chance and told him that he was not going to his friends for tea, as he was too tired. I would pick him up from football.

He cried, a lot. I explained that our bodies need enough energy to do fun things and that, as his mummy, I knew that he didn't have that. I also told him that not getting enough sleep makes us tired and grumpy and not listen, and it wasn't fair on DF's Mummy to send him as we was.

He's supposed to be going for a sleepover there next week so that hangs in the balance.

I'm praying that it works this time!

I also spoke to his teacher who has given me the number of the school nurse, who might be able to have some helpful things to add.

I agree cogito. I think when he was younger I was too soft on him and gave him the benefit of the doubt.

However this morning I made it clear to him that he couldn't complain of not being able to sleep if he wasn't even attempting to stay in his bed.

He seem to be going through very much a 'what are you going to do about it' phase at the moment, in lots of areas, which we need to address.

Probably this is stating the obvious, so forgive me - but just wondering, does your DS get plenty of physical exercise during the day? I find this makes a big difference with my DD who has always been a dreadful sleeper. She seems to need to be physically exhausted because she can get to sleep. She is now 9 and does a lot of sport. A few weeks ago she was injured and didn't do any sports for a week, and her sleeping patterns started going haywire again.

TBH - When she was younger I used to often get into bed with her and stay and cuddle her until she dozed off, this helped a lot, even though even that was hard because she would start chatting or suddenly get up to check something, try to show me dance-moves or start giggling or shuffling, and endless fidgeting, but it was better, and it was the only way to break the vicious circle of her (and us) being overtired. I know people frown at this, but it meant that at least we got some time in the evenings to ourselves and she got a decent night's sleep.

Punishments/incentives never worked, and just led to endless frustration.

madamebutterfly Yes, he is very active and never sits still. Yesterday, we went to the park after school and we were there for 2 hours! Poor DS2 (3) was begging to go to bed at 7!

Hehe, that sounds familiar - DS, who is 19 months younger than DD, used to be so happy when it was bedtime! I think he went through the first 5 years of his life totally sleep-deprived because of his nutter older sister...

Ah well, good luck! And let us know if anything works, as I have still not cracked this with my 9YO!

And don't feel too guilty about shouting... you are only human...

I agree, don't feel guilty, we all lose our head sometimes. But I do wonder why he would do this, after all your attempts of punishment etc? And if you find he does not do it even after you take various things away from him, what then?
I firmly do not believe children do such thing "on purpose to wind us up" - I think this is a terrible way to look at children and think their minds are little factories of naughtiness. It is far more likely that there is something that is genuinely bothering or terrifying him about sleeping alone in his room but for whatever reason he does not dare to tell you. I had a friend whose son was like that and she was totally at a loss until she really tried listening and empathising rather than punishing and rewarding - it turned out that somebody had told him that when he sleeps he might not remember to breathe in his sleep and could die (child take on cot death or god knows where this came from). So he would just avoid the bed until he would drop off out of sheer exhaustion.Other example in know was a boy who tended to wet his bed - he was too terrified of this to go to sleep at bedtime. My point is - when we do not listen to our children but resort to rewarding and punishing a specific annoying thing, we miss two important things: the underlying problem, and the chance for them to trust us.

Maya, now you've made me feel even worse

I was very careful not to present not going for tea as a punishment though, merely a consequence of not getting enough sleep (too tired to go).

I said that we would talk about it later and find ways to help.

I admit it is a flash point with me though. It's always been an issue since he was a baby, peaking when he was about 3. I think we probably have always handled it badly. I ricochet between being very annoyed and very frightened it will mean he fails his A levels.

Because it's always been an issue, I might be guilty of ignoring temporary factors and putting everything down to him 'never wanting to sleep'

But he is wiley

oh, dammit. no, please, don't feel guilty, i have done that so much before, getting all worked up, imagining things that some behaviour now will bring about in the distant future....I think you should instead think how good a mother you must be for noticing this, realising something is not right, and trying to find ways to make things better.... :S so guilt is always useful, but not to sink into ... :)

Oh they absolutely do do things deliberately to wind us up - DS was tantrumming - we don't "hear" screaming - when he couldn't get a rise he started spitting - then when he still couldn't get a rise he started throwing stuff then he started hitting me.

He knew exactly what he was doing - I remained calm (I lost it a few weeks ago and now I don't let it get to me).

Marking my place and watching for hints. I've got a bedtime refusenik too. We managed to have two weeks for 7.30pm (bliss!) but now after having tonsillitis last week, his routine's gone to pot and we're back where we started at 8.30pm+ and he's just 4...