I feel such a horrid DIL

[Ozziegirly]

My in laws are over from the UK at the moment, visiting us and 14 month old DS, who they adore.

Before they arrived they went on and on about "giving me a break" and taking DS off by himself. I don't feel like I need a break, but mooching time is always welcome. Was fine on day 1 and day 2. Was congratulating myself on not being prickly with them (I am naturally quite an intolerant person, like my own space and hate having people around ALL THE TIME).

Today we went to the shops and made a plan to meet at X location at X time. They were taking DS for lunch and then for a play on the play area. I arrive at X and wait and wait for 30 mins and then get a phone call "we're still in the cafe". So DS has been sitting in cafe, irritated and wriggling for an hour and a half as they thought I was going to ring them when I was ready to meet.

I was quite short with them and also DS was really off with me (I may have imagined this) and I was a bit grumpy on the way home as we missed his running around time and also his afternoon milk, and his nap is now an hour late.

But now they have left and I feel mean for being grumpy and prickly as they really love him and they only see him for a month every year.

Sigh.

Lol. It's true that facts can be awfully annoying.

Umm, I didn't say he was going to die, from not having a run around, or being with my in-laws. I was actually commenting on how I felt a bit mean. But you can read it how you wish. I think I quite clearly wrote that it affected his naps, which in turn makes him tired and a bit crabby. Not dead. Just crabby.

Chill out, it's just a post on the internet.

And he wasn't "distressed" by being stuck in the high chair - he was bored. I would be amazed if you could show me a 14 month old who would happily sit in a high chair for 1.5 hours and not be bored.

And yes, he is my PFB, but it's kind of irrelevant in the context.

at 14mos my pfb had been spending one weekend a month with the ils for about the last 6 or 7 months. oh, and they lived in another country. i used to fly over with her, drop her off their place, and then bug out to work, and come back and get her 48 hours later.

little ones quite often give you the look (baleful glances) when you collect them. despite the fact that they have been having a whale of a time until they saw you. fact. oh, and also, mums imagine it half the time because they are too busy feeling guilty for actually doing something not 100% baby centred.

there are enough things to feel guilty for as a mother without bothering with the unnecessary ones. and half an hour in a highchair being mildly bored isn't one of the necessary ones.

Some people (not the OP) are too precious for words.

Ozzie - hang on in there. Try to make sure there aren't any other miscommunication issues which affect DS & soldier on through gritted teeth. They love him, they want to look after him, not just look at him - there's a big difference in the bonding :)

Buy a bottle of voddie - inlaws then your Mum visiting - you're going to need it!!

I'm not being precious - there's a sub-debate here. I said what I thought to Ozzigirly about how she'd felt, but it annoys me when shine gets on and is plain rude and dismissive. What's the point of getting on someone's thread just to be unpleasant? And Davsmum apparently thinks than opinion outweighs fact, which I find maddening on a purely logical level.

Pmsl @ shiny being told it's just words on a screen

Op totally get it, I bet they spent most of the time after the first 20 mins trying to get him to enjoy being restricted like that.

Octaviapink,
Please enlighten us with the research that backs up your opinion ?
You have expressed your opinion on here - not 'Fact'
Research and theories change with fashion.

One can find research to back up most opinions if one looks for it.

Children who mix with an extended family are probably more confident and suffer less from separation anxiety. Of course you can 'socialise' a child ! Its not 'done' to them,.. its creating a sociable environment where they learn naturally.
I would suggest you do less reading and perhaps get more experience with living people rather than books.

I think perhaps it is mothers who suffer from separation anxiety - more than the babies do.

Perhaps a lot of anxiety in a child can be avoided ?

He wasn't anxious, or suffering from separation anxiety - he was bored and wanted to not be in a high chair. And then I think he was a bit "hrumph" with me when I came back because I had left him and he had been bored.

Yes, I know, Ozzie - the argument has gone a little way beyond your DS into general opinions. Some of which are clearly bonkers.

Hope you're having a good time with your PILs, btw - I'm sure your DS is loving all the attention now!

Octaviapink,.. would you like to share details of your qualifications ? Or care to admit what you have expressed on here is also opinion ?
Its a bit arrogant to suggest that opinions that differ from your own are bonkers.

Ozziegirly,.. I believe separation anxiety was mentioned by others, Octaviapink for one. My post suggesting perhaps mothers suffer more from that than babies do - was in response to that.

Davsmum I'm a childcare professional as well as a mother. I'd be happy to list research papers here if you're really interested but you'd need to subscribe to a couple of specialist journals. For the record though, your view that a mother's feeling of possessiveness is detrimental to the baby is unsupported by research, as I said. It is rather an indicator (one of many) of a strong bond and a developed maternal instinct. The mother's possessiveness as part of the mother-baby bond is only beneficial to the baby and an evolutionary necessity. Your other view, that separation anxiety is largely parental, is also incorrect. The term 'separation anxiety' refers to very specific neurobiological reactions in a baby's brain when it is separated from (or there is a threat of separation from) its primary carer (usually the mother). Parental anxiety is nothing to do with this sort of separation anxiety, it is rather another symptom of the strong mother-baby bond. You will see many threads on MN where mothers are agonising over leaving their babies at a variety of ages and for a variety of periods with a variety of carers. It is neurobiologically completely different from separation anxiety.

Thank you for that response Octaviapink. It is much better than your previous responses. I understand the separation anxiety to which you refer, but there are also degrees of excessive possessiveness - which, if it continues CAN become a problem for a child. I accept that what I am talking about is not the same as the neurobiological reaction to which you refer, however, I do think that how separation anxiety is handled can have long term effects.
Thank you again, for explaining that the way you did.

Guests and fish stink after 3 days, you're doing well.

Sympathise with your situation Ozzie - I was also abroad when dcs were tiny. There are pros and cons - you don't need to worry about PIL interfering on a regular basis, on the other hand in return you have to endure a month together which would test the patience of a saint - however much you love them. Good to vent on here - you'll probably miss them when they're gone (until the next month-long visit!). You are not a horrid DIL - there are bound to be more tensions in a month together than if you just saw each other for an afternoon every week or so (as you might do if you were in the UK). It's easy to keep smiling and waving for an afternoon - much harder to maintain for a month.

Not sure why Davsmum thinks this is excessive possessiveness - sounds like the OP's DS spent a load of time with the visiting ILs. Doesn't sound pfb to me, either, more about irritating/bit inconsiderate guests.

OP, you are a fantastic DIL if your PILs stay for a month.

Dustbunnies:
I don't think I have ever said 'This is excessive possessiveness.' in realtion to the OP
I referred to possessiveness in response to a comment by another poster.

quite. the op appeared entirely rational.

OPI skimmed over the secondary debate that developed here and have nothing to say about it, but w/r to your post, what I can say is that I completely and totally know where you are coming from.

I have an extremely active 15 month old, who is an absolute delight. I think in part because I keep to a routine. It bothers me when he is out of his routine because I know that he is not firing on all cylinders i.e. not enough sleep, activity or food.

Don't feel guilty about the in laws. They mean well, and probably didn't move from the restaurant because they were unsure about how you would feel and thought better to sit tight and wait. I think my in laws would do the same. And like you, it would have peeved me hugely.

Perhaps write them a card to say thanks so much for their help and how you and your DS miss having them around

x

I think Davsmum has a little bit of a granny's rights agenda going on :)

The OP really just needed to vent - I know venting, whether to my DH, friends, or on internet forums, has probably helped me avoid throttling both my MIL and my own mum a few times :) My MIL keeps telling meits time I got DS2 onto bottles as I "should" know how much he is drinking now he is weaning, and also that bf is the reason he doesn't sleep through at 6 months - really she wants him on bottles so she can have him to herself without me needing to be about to feed him before he's a toddler, I do my best to smile and nod but if I couldn't vent about her to somebody somewhere I would probably tell her where to stuff her "wisdom", for all she loves all 3 of our kids and the big 2 love to spend time with her, and the baby will do, in time... (when I am ready :) )

5moreminutes - hear hear!

Oh, sorry Davsmum, had misunderstood.

5moreminutes - damnit, disappointed to have confirmed my suspicions that MIL/DIL issues are not just a pfb thing ... was hoping all tension would disappear if DC2 came along! Actually, it's reassuring to see that I'm not the only one who can't imagine handing a newborn/small baby DC2 straight over - people do seem to say that that element of MIL/DIL tension is mostly a PFB thing, whereas my feeling is that it's mostly about some sort of (probably quite healthy) instinct to keep a vulnerable little baby close.

dustbunnies tbh I don't like anyone but dh even holding my babies when they are newborn - of course I let the grandparents and close trusted mum friends have a cuddle, and the older kids hold the baby so they'll feel he's "theirs" too but tbh I feel uncomfortable til I have them back, and can't get my head around people who actually want to hand the baby over and go out without baby when still tiny, for all 2 of my 3 have not been great sleepers!

I just wrote a load more but deleted it as it made me sound a bit crazy , but there was an incident when DS2 was 3 weeks old at an evening family gathering, and MIL ignored my hints to give him back and kept rocking him to sleep for almost 3 hours, not only did he then feed for half the night due to having missed his cluster feeding time, but I hid in the loo and cried most of the time she had him as I knew I'd be accused of being illogical for insisting more forecefully that she give him back, but I could not stand being physically separated from my newborn for so long - I'm not normally a crier but hormones were raging and I think exclusive breast feeding may make the need for proximity more intense...

The feeling recedes (but doesn't totally go away, at least so far) as they get older and I let my 4 and 6 year old stay over with their grandparents now (though I worry...), but I think it is utterly natural and right for a mother to have a strong bond with a baby and small child and not be casual about handing them over - and to be controversial simply being a grandparent does not actually give that person right of unsupervised access to the child, it is a matter of negotiation (unspoken or spoken) between parents and grandparents - parents might or might not need or want "help", grandparents might want more or less involvement or responsibility, I don't think it should be a given that the child gets handed over to them to walk away with, when the child is very small, especially in cases where distance means the grandparents are seldom seen and unfamiliar to a small child with a short memory, or where the grandparents are not interested in respecting what is important to the child or parent and will have a knock on effect on the next 24 hours, in terms of feeding and sleep etc.

Sorry I know I am off topic now :)

Oh and just to confirm my craziness :) dustbunnies I have eXactly the same feelings about my own mother wanting to take the babies for extended periods when they are small, I will refrain from anecdotes :) but it's not just a MIL / DIL thing!