Needs and wants

[Tatties]

At what age do you think babies' needs turn into wants?

How do you define 'needs' and 'wants'?

ds definitely has WANTS... he is coming up for 10 months... but has been like it for a while

and how old is baby

needs are things they need (food, drink)
wants are things they desire (the tv remote, chocolate!)

Except that the need to explore, touch and interact with objects is innate, very strong and absolutely vital for development.

no-one has said it isn't have they? just what age do they get it?

I was referring to 'wanting' the remote control.

Well I think newborns only have 'needs'. Was wondering when people thought that babies/children develop a concept of desire - just wanting something that isn't necessary for survival/emotional wellbeing.

or physical & mental development.

so why isn't that a want? he wants it doesn't he?

I think Aloha is saying that exploration, learning etc is a need in children. It may seem to us that they "want" things, e.g. the remote control etc but playing with these objects is something they need to do for their development.

ok well what would you define as a "want"

if ds "needs" to play with dp's saw again shoud I let him have it? after all, it;s very important for his development and all that

as tatties says... it is still a want, or desire... wahtever the reason.
It is something that very small babies DON'T have

Well of course not. The need to play with things is there but it is up to us (as the grown ups) to ensure that they play in a safe environment.

Small babies 'want' as well - they want cuddles, eye contact, warmth, food, interaction, things to look at. I think it is a very artificial distinction tbh.

A small child has no idea that exploring the remote control/saw is inconvenient/dangerous - they are driven by strong internal instincts to touch, taste, explore and play. The 'want' to play is very much a 'need' in that without it their development is delayed. It is up to us to make their environment safe, but their 'want' to play and explore is no more frivolous and pointless than the younger child's 'want' for milk. I often see here on MN people saying their babies 'want' to be held, but don't 'need' it - yet being held is just as important as being fed to a baby, and almost as important for their health and development.

Tatties, why make the distinction? I don't think a baby or a toddler or young child, heck even an adult can reliably tell between a need and a want. If I want something bad enough, does it become a need from my perspective even if it is not essential to my survival etc?

I think I can tell the difference between what I want and what I need. But I'm not necessarily making any distinctions for children - I don't want someone to tell me if my baby 'needs' or 'wants' a cuddle because in practice it doesn't really matter in terms of how I respond to my baby. As you say Aloha a 'want' is often very much a need and for me if my ds 'wants' a feed at 4am then he needs it.
Anyway I was just thinking about this from a philosophical point of view rather than a practical one...

It's interesting isn't it, if some adults can't reasonably distinguish between needs and wants then why indeed do some people make the distinction for children quite easily and consider babies' 'wants' to be less important than their 'needs' ?

Tatties, exactly!

To take a stab at answering your philosophical question, I would assume that a human being can only begin to distinguish between needs and wants when true reasoning steps in - which I understand from books kicks in around 7-9 years. But then again, it is not unusual to see teenagers or older needing a bit of boost in that area