I lost it with my boys. I told them if they dont start behaving together, dad and I will move apart and live with ONE boy each,

[QuintessentialShadow]

because you are just impossible together.

Ds2 is currently amusing himself with burping loudly into DS1s face. He keeps doing it, and laughs. Nothing anybody say, or do, will make him stop.
DS2 also keeps launching himself at ds1 and shower him with kisses.
Ds1 does not like it, so he keeps asking him to stop.
He does not respect his boundaries at all! When ds1 gets annoyed, ds2 is jubilant.
So ds1 got fed up with burps and kisses, so pushed ds2 over, so he hurt his back.

I have well and truly had enough of them.

Ds2 does not seem to GET that "stop, dont do this" actually means he should stop....

What can I do?

I make ds2 stay in bed by saying that his brother will not be sent to bed until he (ds2) is settled).

'luckily' Ds1 has ADHD and can happily stay up indefinitely with no ill effects (in fact on Wednesday night he not sleep at all, not even for 10 minutes!)

The punishment for Ds2 is the knowledge that his brother is being allowed to stay up and play games and that he isn't.

I don't leave Ds2 upstairs alone, I lie on the floor nex6t to his bed and read. I don't engage in conversation, and if he tries to get up, I gently push him back into bed but I don't speak.. I don't really have to have this battle anymore as I mostly sorted it when he was 3 and 4.

god colditz 10 mins sleep sounds like punishment for you?!! or does he just play all night by himself?

At 3am I lifted his brother into my bed (they share a frickin room) and told him he could switch the gamecube on as long as he made NO noise AT ALL>

Maybe being a second born has meant ds2 hasn't learnt to enjoy his own company.

It was interesting, because both boys had a long lie in on saturday morning, and a relaxing morning in front of the tv. Because it was my goddaughters confirmation the day was pretty heavy, with a one hour church service, two hours of boredom in a nice and posh restaurant with speeches and what have you, followed by 20 grown ups for coffee and cake at my fathers.... This went on for hours.... They did not bicker, they did not argue. ds2 was in fact busy on his own the entire time. He made a long laser sword out of 5 straws he joined together and kept himself busy with this. He was in and out the house with his "lasersword" the entire time! I was impressed!

So DS2 can amuse himself therefore there is no reason for his behaviour.

"He just pouts and says, "fine, if that is what you want". Goes into his room, and sits down on his bed and stares into space...."

And that is a problem because?
When he does this, shut his door after him. If he is doing this with the door open he is doing it for the dramatic effect. Pay no attention. When he comes out, ask him if he is ready to behave in a civilised and respectful manner.

I agree bedtime and blackout blinds. I also suggest an exercise machine for indoors so he can use up his surplus energy. Or teach him to wield a hoover and put clothes out on the line. Sounds as if regular chores wouldn't be a bad idea. He is not too old to be told about respecting the 'No' of others, and you will have to show him you mean it. Your DH needs to step up here.

I also think you need to physically remove him from interfering with DS1's personal boundaries. Pick him up and drag him away. Or get your DH to.

I think you should be losing it with DS2 a bit more tbh. DS1 seems fine. If DS2 is allowed to continue to bother DS1 like this DS1 will lose it one day when puberty hits and DS2 will regret it.

Don't make empty threats and don't just parent from the armchair. Some children demand physical intervention.

Agree - if you don't do this then there will be repercussions

1. DS1 will properly lash out one day
2. DS1 will resent you for not doing anything
3. DS2 will not know that No means No - and this is something he needs to learn.

I have a different angle which worked for us.

Ds1 needs to be shown how to say 'stop it' in an assertive way, he is the older by far and should be able to deal with his brother. Make sure ds1 knows he will not be in trouble for telling ds2off, he may be presuming this is up to you. Act it out with him, tell him it's ok to be verbally forceful. The minute he is irritated by ds1 he could warn him once then say 'I'm not playing this game' or 'you're annoying me, game over' and walk out and leave ds2 to it.

This will mean ds2 will not be getting negative attention from you, and ds1 will learn useful skills for when other kids are trying to wind him up at school.

If our kids came to complain 'x is doing y, it's annoying me' I'd say 'don't tell me tell x' and for younger ones suggest the words and tone they could use. It worked for us, our kids 'self regulate' as dh puts it. Then you don't set yourself up as judge and jury for evermore.

Of course you can step in yourself if this doesn't work. I would perfect a strong severe expression in the mirror and tell ds2 that his behaviour is ridiculous for his age and he should take himself to his room until he is feeling more sensible. And dock pocket money so that it is in line with the age he is acting.

Agree Asinine - but the parent also needs to step in if it's as big a problem as this. What is DS2 doesn't listen to DS1?

As in my last paragraph op could tell ds1 to leave ds2 in peace when he has told him to, and say it in such a way that he knows that this behaviour is just totally unacceptable at that age. Send him to room and dock pocket money.

I think the tone of voice is the crucial thing. Imagine if a guy was pestering you in a pub and you were not interested and they were persisting and getting irritating or touching you, that's the voice you need

How's he been this week?

He keeps doing it so he must get something out of it. I wonder if he wants to attention you give him when he does this. OK, from your point of view, it's bad attention because you are yelling at him, but to him, it is attention directed just to him and no one else.

I think you may need to withdraw attention, and do something with your other boy when he starts like this, so instead of crappy behaviour leading to attention he finds his crappy benhaviour leads to being ignored and in fact to his brother getting attention. ALthough short term this will cause him to step up his campaign of terrible behaviour if you reinforce the "crappy behaviour leads to mummy ignoring me and in fact doing something without me" he will stop. I remember with DD just saying "I'll come back when you're acting like a civilised human being" and just walking off. She went totally mental, but learned slowly that she would get a biscuit when she said please, but not when throwing herself on the floor. You do have to be tough, and your other son needs to just shrug and walk away as well.

I also remember my parents installing a lock on my brother's door so he could lock himself in his bedroom and keep me out. I was a bratty little sister by all accounts!

Brothers are often like this to each other. Its not unusual but it is up to you to control these situations.
You say nothing anyone says or does will make DS2 stop burping in his brothers face ? I can assure you that he can be made to stop - you just do not know how to handle it and he knows it ! The boundaries are not real boundaries if he does not respect them - You have them but do not enforce them. No child will respect that.

Popbiscuit - A six year old cannot MAKE you all miserable. Its not knowing how to handle it that makes you all miserable. Don't blame the child.

There are really good books on how to deal with these issues but you have to give them a go, work at it and be consistent.