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Original poster

in 30 minutes I have to stand up for my son

42 replies

whatdoidonow1 · 03/05/2011 19:38

As I said, in 30 minutes I have a meeting with a group organiser who is going to decide whether or not my 14 year old son should continue to be included in a group of kids who are scheduled to go to America for a month in 7 weeks time. He says that he suspects that my son is on the Autistic spectrum, does not join in or participate and therefore is not a suitable candidate. Some of the parents and I held a fundraising meeting at his house, but I was held back for a chat. I know that my son is quiet and not great at making friends, he is not that confident and has been in the past assessed for aspergers but the tests were inconclusive.

I am a single parent, my husband died after taking his own life, the year my son was assessed for aspergers was the months following his death.

I was so upset I got my Dad to arrange the meeting at his house, but I feel so emotional I haven't stopped crying in the last two hours. Please can anyone help me get through this?

OP posts:

davidtennantsmistress · 03/05/2011 19:39

didn't want to leave this unanswered, did the assessors know that his dad had only recently died? surely that would have had some effects on the wee man?

TheMonster · 03/05/2011 19:40

Do exactly what you have said: stand up for him.

Even if he was on the autistic spectrum, why shouldn't he attend?

Original poster

whatdoidonow1 · 03/05/2011 19:42

yes they knew that he died, it was a teacher who flagged it up so he was assessed. I feel that one of the leaders who is going to america is a student teacher, and she's the one who's decided that he has autistic tendancies. I think he probably did a course and thinks she knows it all, and the man I'm meeting with is also a retired teacher, and so the two of them have decided that he's autistic even though someone else has already discounted autism four years ago

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Original poster

whatdoidonow1 · 03/05/2011 19:43

The group is for 'future leaders' - my son isn't considered suitable if he's not able to be a future leader

OP posts:

bustersmummy · 03/05/2011 19:43

Oh poor you your son will be so disappointed at this stage if he doesn't get to go

PonceyMcPonce · 03/05/2011 19:45

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

GypsyMoth · 03/05/2011 19:45

who pays for this trip? you? have you paid yet?

cat64 · 03/05/2011 19:45

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

c0rn51lk · 03/05/2011 19:46

Tell them that he has been assessed by a professional and remind them that teachers (especially unqualified ones) are in no way qualified to assess for autism and that you are thinking of reporting her comments to her course tutor - she has no right to be attempting to diagnose children. Then direct them to the equality act.

Original poster

whatdoidonow1 · 03/05/2011 19:47

It's all paid for, but I assume I'd get it back.

The scheme is part funded by fundraising, parents pay £500 per child. Fundraising has been going on for months.

OP posts:

Abelia · 03/05/2011 19:49

I think you have to very firmly and politely point out that your son has not been diagnosed with Autism or Aspergers. He does not have a SEN, or a statemented need. He has been assessed and no firm conclusion. Then ask to see her proof, her medical qualifications and ask her why she feels she has the right to make this "diagnosis" and on the basis of said "diagnosis" decide to exclude your son from the trip.

Then move on to asking about the specific behaviours he is showing that mean he appears to be ineligible for the trip, talk through if these are new behaviours and therefore likely related to the loss of his father. If so, how can you all work together to help him with the trip, step up to the plate etc as you all want him to be on the trip and showing his "future leader" skills.

If these are old, known behaviours, why was he put forward for the trip? They must have seen some potential, can they think about that and how to help him realise his potential now?

You need to cut off all discussion about autism - she's not qualified to diagnose so it is a moot point in terms of whether it can be used as a reason to take him off the trip.

So sorry for the loss of your husband.

PrettyCandles · 03/05/2011 19:51

(a) Eeven if he is autistic, why shouldn't he participate?
(b) Even if they suspect he is autistic, all their concerns relate to his sociability. If they have no concerns that might mean they'd need extra resources or members of staff, why shouldn't he participate?
(c) If he is shy and struggles socially, this trip could actually be a marvellous opportunity for him to develop his social skills and learn to participate confidently, because of the continuity in a relatively small group of people.

Cancelling his participation at such late notice is punitive, and, unless he has done something that merits punishment, it should not be done to him.

Oakmaiden · 03/05/2011 19:53

How was your son originally selected for the trip? Is it through school? Was he referred by someone?

TethersEnd · 03/05/2011 19:54

It matters not one jot if he is on the autistic spectrum. Apart from that it may be useful to quote the Disability Discrimination Act.

Of course, as this isn't a trip for the whole year group they are able to select pretty much who they like; but they will have a hell of a case to answer if they choose not to take your son because of his 'autistic tendencies' and you go to the governors and the press.

I would ask them to put their reasons for not taking him or 'concerns' in writing.

Does he think he is going?

It's unspeakably cruel for them to select and then deselect him. Surely he was the same person when they chose him?

Aren't they supposed to be showing him an example of good leadership?

And aren't they supposed to be teaching students how to become leaders? Or are they just taking all the 'natural leaders' anyway?

This is actually disgusting. Am so angry for your son. Do not let them get away with it.

iwantavuvezela · 03/05/2011 19:55

i dont have time to find it but i am sure the equalities bill would have something to say on this (you cant discriminate) and this feels like your son is being asked not to go because he is "different" (in the eyes of the teacher). If you dont feel strong enough, dont agree to anything, just note what the teacher is saying, copy or take it down, read it back to them to clarify and say you will get back to them.
sorry about your husband ....

pinkthechaffinch · 03/05/2011 19:57

Hope yuor meeting goes well, your son is very lucky to have a mother prepared to stand up for him- I know how hard it can be.

c0rn51lk · 03/05/2011 19:57

They would not have a leg to stand on if you decided to complain and take this further. This is direct discrimination as they have stated that the reason that they want to exclude him from the trip is due to a possible disability. This is just awful. Sorry for your loss.

NoTeaForMe · 03/05/2011 19:58

As someone has already said a teacher cannot diagnose austism or any SEN really. I used to work in that field and if we ever suspected any SEN we would have to have someone come in to assess even if we felt it was clear what the problem was. We also had to be very careful not to say what we thought to the parents. It had to come from the specialists.

I'm also wondering how the leader can now decide your son shouldn't go. If he had concerns they should have been flagged up long ago.

davidtennantsmistress · 03/05/2011 19:58

totally agree what medical qualifications do they have - even the retired teacher - tbh he's not in any position to hand out any sort of statements etc as unless he's specialized in this area it is his pure opinion, besides which id doesn't make a difference does it if he has austism or anything else?

i'd be quite annoyed at the student teacher as well tbh.

is your dad going to help you fight the corner?

TheMonster · 03/05/2011 19:59

Good luck with the meeting. Stick to your guns - he should go. He has been assessed.

TethersEnd · 03/05/2011 19:59

Is this a state school?

madwomanintheattic · 03/05/2011 19:59

is the autism thing a red herring?

what is the curriculum for the trip? if it is a 'future leaders' thing are they going to be expected to be giving talks and presentations, carrying out activities/ taking full part in anything that your son might struggle with?

i don't really understand the scheme (is it a one-off or part of an established programme), but presumably there has already been some sort of entry criteria that your son has passed? so he has already proven himself to be capable of becoming a 'future leader' in the terms expected of the organisers? (or was it just a 'sign up' thing, rathert han a selection-based thing?)

do you think they are concerned that his more retiring personality might mean he finds the tasks/ activities very difficult? is it more of a leadership training/ ie confidence building trip? so something he will in fact, benefit more from than some of the other participants who fit the 'future leader' role in a more clearly defined fashion according to the organisers?

without knowing more about the trip, i think it's difficult to say what the organisers reservations are, tbh. is it possible that they are using 'autistic tendencies' as a way of (clumsily) expressing that they feel he might struggle? will his lack of confidence cause a problem for him being away from home with a group of 'go-getters'?

you catch more flies with honey, and all that. i wouldn't start throwing disability discrimination around (particularly without a dx lol) until you have to. start nice and ask what their issue is, exactly.

if it is a selection based trip and for some reason your son does not fit the selection criteria (whatever it might be) then it might have nothing to do with autism (although why he's have got to that point in the process i'm struggling to work out).

it might just be that the organisers need more information, particularly if he is likely to need more support on the trip - in which case, the more you can reassure them, the better.

if he struggles with his confidence, this would be an amazing opportunity, if he's keen. hope it goes well x

PrettyCandles · 03/05/2011 19:59

Hadn't read about the leadership issue before I posted.

I think that it is irrelevant and that they are wrong to bring it up. Your ds's teachers flagged up concerns about autism 4(?)y ago. He was properly assessed and found not to be autistic, just shy and coming to terms with the loss of his father. All this was presumably known to the staff before he was accepted for this leadership journey. Therefore to raise this now, on the basis of the opinion of relatively inexperienced staff is completely inappropriate.

Besides, you don't need to be outgoing to be a good leader. I, as a shy person who struggles socially, do not feel comfortable with a charismatic heart-and-soul-of-the-party leader. I feel more at ease with and trust and respond better to a leader who understands that some people are uncertain or uneasy.

ilovesprouts · 03/05/2011 20:02

vhappymumma2b · 03/05/2011 20:03

I really hope that things go well for you at the meeting - be strong. What a thoughtful mum your boy has. Be brave and be bold on this!

In terms of development for any teenager these kinds of group experiences can be lifechanging and can bring a huge amount of confidence out and create strong groups of friends.

The teachers should be ashamed of themselves for trying to deselect your Son from the group. Surely they should be sticking up for his needs, he absolutely should be included on this trip!

It sounds more about the Teachers' confidence and inadequacies on how to suitably deal with pupils of all kinds of skills. If your son is on the Autistic Spectrum then they must be bonkers to think that they can go through their careers without teaching Autistic children - who should not be segmented, their gifts should be developed. They should remember that there is no such thing as a 'normal person' in this world, life is not black and white and it is absolutely terrible that these so called Teachers are determining who should go on this trip in this way. Best of luck to you, let us know how things go...

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