most of you will say mind your own business but, can you help.

[donshardhat]

I have a friend whose little girl has just turned 2.
Mum is down, parenting has been harder than she thought, she has a partner but he is less than no help.
There was a sweet spot when things were going well and she seems to have got stuck there.
The little one is still in the reclined position in the buggy all the time struggling to sit up and see where she is going. She is fed luke warm/cold food all the time incase they get causght out and about and they have to buy a jar for her to have.
The food is always mushed/blended. and because she has a limited diet she is drinking 3 pints of full fat milk.

Now, as a friend I have gently tried talking through the food options that are acceptable for a 2 year old but there are always a hundred reasons why these options won't work.

Is there anything else I could say that would give suggestions. She is a great mum, loving and kind and totally wanting to do the right thing by her daughter.
It is almost like she cares too much and can't relax into trying new things that may not work iykwim.

Of course minding my own business is an option.

bump

Does she get out to any groups? Seeing children of the same age might be a bit of an eye opener for her (in a good way).

Has the little girl been to a dentist yet? A dentist check will identify this as a problem and they must be about due - perhaps suggest they book her first trip now she's two - then you don't have to be the one to break it to them.

Buy her an age-appropriate recipe book - "Healthy Snacks for Your Two Year Old" or whatever (I'm making that up, but there must be something close).

this was me with my first re the food

I totally ruined her

I second the dentist thing

how good a friend is she? you could offer something other than she normally does to her dd (whilst she is there) and then she could see that maybe it isn't as scary as she thought

its wonderful that you care and ewant to help but speaking from painful bitter experience she may just not hear anyhting you say

I was totally screwed up with pnd and couldn't hear anyone trying to help me
it was awful

no she hasn't seen a dentist, but her mum brushes her teeth after everything she eats/drinks as both she and her partner have had problem teeth.
There is no added sugar in the diet (which isn't a bad thing) but even talking about breakfast cereals as a choice is a clear no as there is sugar in them all.

She goes to the newborn baby group (her daughter is the oldest) and the health visitor has suggested she stops coming because it is a newborn group.

Where we live there are loads of little ones (baby boom round here) about 10 children aged between 3 months and 5 years within our culdesac. we congregate at the front because it is a great sunny spot, and she is lovely company but the little one isn't put down to play with the others (even though she can walk well)

x posts, trinity, is there anything I could do that would help her get help for her own sake and I am sure that things with her little girl will resolve themselves??

Do you have a copy of a toddler recipe book you could lend her? Something like this.

Or perhaps buy her a copy as a gift?

You could use it as a start point to talk about moving away from the purees and jars.

do you have dcs of a similar age? Could you find a toddler group that's more age appropriate and ask her to come with you?

Sorry meant to add, I took a toddler cookery book round as we had been chatting about breakfast options and I had brain freeze (got stuck on cereals, toast, porridge) She had the book already and had read it but alot seemed to add salt or sugar or have foods that she "knows" he just wouldn't even try.

Ooh it's so hard to stop yourself when you know it's wrong.
I still have bite marks on my fingers from my best friend having a baby and he is nearly 6 now.

She formula fed him every two hours - for about 10 months . She couldn't understand why he didn't sleep, eat well, screamed alot and she generally wasn't prepared to TRY anything that didn't sit well within her own mind. I did all that gentle hint stuff but like your friend, it fell on deaf ears.

It was harder for me at the time as I didn't have kids so I really couldn't say too much but things were clearly in a mess.

To be honest, im glad I didn't go too far and tell her what to do. They will muddle through eventually and she may or may not be able to see where she went wrong for next time - if there is a next time.

My friend split up from her worse than useless partner when her LO was 4 months old so I do think that had alot to do with it.

She sometimes says she realises looking back she couldn't understand why she did X Y and Z with her LO. I just sit and act daft as if I couldn't remember it.

I think you have tried and now you have to let her slowly realise she isn't a baby anymore.

Oh dear; all the facts together sound troubling - newborn group, pureed food, reclined position in buggy! and not being put down to play with other children her age

The little girl is going to experience developmental delays if she does not change her parenting modes asap. I wonder how or whom could get this message through to her....

What about introducing her to MN ...?

have the hvs not said anything about the risk of developmental delays?

I do sympathise though, I have a friend who fretted so much about her ds choking on solids he didnt' have food that wasn't blitzed to mush until he was well over 2. His speech was massively delayed. He's only 5 months younger than ds but can barely speak (ds is 3.7 btw). He also has a really restricted diet, she says "oh X doesn't like fruit" but I've watched him swipe a slice of apple from ds's plate when we've been round there for lunch. She claimed he couldn't chew properly to have solids but he was always pinching food from ds (I used to take ds's meal round when we went for lunch because there was no way ds would eat mush at 2.5 years) and her ds used to swipe sandwiches from his plate!

we have problems with HV's here, a great surestart center but we share our HV with so many other surestart centers she's only visible at the newborn group.

I was wondering about, very gently, suggesting we/she asks the HV for other breakfast options that are healthy? I know it is a manipulative way of gettign someone else involved but I just feel that the HV may actually have some great ideas. She isn't going to push sugar and salt to the little girl so that should fit in with the Mum's thoughts on this (where as my suggestion of rice krispies cronflakes or shreddies was bad because of the sugar content)

What about looking at the BLW website? Loads of great ideas and inventive people on there.

BLW

does her dd eat any raw fruit or is it all cooked and pureed? I often give ds a banana for breakfast (alongside toast etc, but that might be a step too far)

this might be a bit sneaky, but if you're out with her and her dd, could perhaps "accidentally" let her dd grab a slice of banana from you - or similar and see what happens. Maybe if she sees her daughter eating something more solid and not dying, then it might help?

I am not sure if she has any fruit because of the sugar content.
BUT I will invite them round next week and perhaps suggest we try some things together? Would that be pushing too much do you think? The thing is she is at the moment happy to talk about it. my worry is that if I push too far that she won't entertain any discussion abou tit at all.

crikey, that's going to leave a gigantic hole in her dd's vitamin intake. She does know that doesn't she? Where does she get vitamin c from?

Could you try some healthy baking to do together, as an activity for the children? There are some good easy recipes on the I can cook website.

Let her know that many children are suffereing from weak jaws due to food being mushed up too much (I'm sure I heard something about this the other day!)

There are no sugar cereals, puffed wheat and shredded wheat being the two that I eat but I think there are more.

milk has sugar, does she not give milk to her dd as well? a human brain needs sugar to function. You cannot live totally without sugar, it's really bad for you, especially if you are a small child whose brain is developing.

Do you think your friend has PND? To me, this sounds more than a "food issue" IYSWIM. The restrictive diet is not good, but your friend seems to still see her dd as a baby rather than a toddler. The buggy always in the reclining position,not playing with the other dc, still going to the newborn grp. It sounds as though one HV has tried to move her on, but your friend for whatever reason is not willing to do so. Something is not quite right here. Most of us, would be able to see, that our toddler was too old for a baby grp,and would want to be with mums with same age dc. Your friend doesnt seem to see that. Im not suggesting at all, that your friend doesnt love her dd, or want the best for her, but I do think she is mentally unwell,and not seeing things as others do.
Im not sure what you can do, but I think its going to be more than suggesting alternative foods. Do you think your friend is unhappy? Would she see a GP at your suggestion? Its one thing me sitting at home saying this, but if she was my friend, and the situation you describe continues another couple of months, I would have to speak to someone out of concern for her and her dd. Could you speak to the HV at the baby grp and explain your concerns?

The no sugar and no salt thing is being taken to extremes and it sounds a bit obsessive, not a sign of trying to do the best thing for the child imo. The mashed diet is easier to feed to a child and keep the mess at bay than letting the child feed herself and cleaning up the huge mess after every meal. It is also easier for the mother to keep the child from getting out of her control if she is restricted from attempting age appropriate activities; a little baby is in your control more or less, while a toddler is not -- I sense this woman needs to feel a lot of control. This is really an example of anxiety taking over and pushing common sense far into the background.

I think this mum may be mentally unwell too, with depression/ anxiety issues, and may also be more than a bit obsessive. Her child is not coming first for her even though she seems on the surface to be focused so much on her. I don't think this is about the food or the salt/sugar per se. I think it goes much deeper.

Doesn't the child ever complain to be let down to play? Or point to/grab food she wants? Unless she has an incredibly laid back and passive personality, I would already worry about the child's development. I know they are all different, but remembering my own at that age, I couldn't have kept them in a buggy for long spells at that age without enduring an awful lot of screaming.

Is she talking/communicating? This does sound worrying I would say.