Same university for PhD?

[MonstersRock]

I am considering doing a PhD, but I can't relocate so would have to do so at the same university at which I have studied for both my first degree and my masters. This doesn't particularly bother me - I chose this university in the first place because I felt I identified with the research interests etc - but I know this it is considered more desirable to have studied at different institutions.

Since starting my studies some years ago (I have had various breaks for a teaching career and maternity leave) I have got married and started a family. DH can't move his job and DS is starting school soon. Apart from that, we're all very happy where we are!!

Does anyone know if this is likely to be a massive disadvantage? Am I likely to be able to pursue an academic career despite not having studied elsewhere?

Any thoughts on this issue gratefully received!!

Who told you it is more desirable? If a) you can get good supervision by a specialist in your chosen field at your current university and b) any financial support from them, then stay where you are. I'd strongly doubt any prospective employing university would rate someone with degrees from different universities higher than someone with their degrees from the same place, if all other factors were equal. And I'm a lecturer who has sometimes served on recruitment selection and interview panels.

The most important thing at PhD level is your supervisor -- if you have a great person you want to work with, and have a topic that suits their interests, stay where you are!

The most important thing in terms of your ongoing career is not where you studied but the quality and name-recognition of your work, and especially your publications. If you possibly can manage it, try to publish at least two articles in peer reviewed journals before you finish the PhD and present your work at at least two conferences, and go to a number of others for the networking opportunities.

That being said, you will need to have a long-term plan, agreed with your DH, to move when you complete the PhD, because academia is a very competitive field and only those prepared to move anywhere including overseas get jobs. I know academics married to other academics whose jobs are split Sheffield/New York and Miami/Boston; my DH and I were separated by a 3-hour journey for nearly 3 years. With the coaltion cuts coming it's going to be even harder -- but you've got a while to plan.

Thanks for these comments.

I'm sure that working for my PhD at this university is going to be a good thing for me, so your comments have helped me to feel better about that.

I am concerned, however, about what to do afterwards. I do want to work, somehow, within academia, but there is no question of me moving long distances - and definitely not overseas. I understand that this will greatly limit what I can do, but surely there will be some options open to me to allow me to continue some academic work?

Can anybody offer any suggestions/advice on this?

Thanks again for both your comments so far.

I'm in a similar-ish position to you, in that I'd like to work in academia in the long term, though I'm a good few years behind you in academic terms! I won't be able to move to follow jobs either. My thinking is that I might have to define 'academia' quite broadly - there may be part-time or associate positions available at my local university (or at one slightly further afield), or there's adult education or the OU. I think you're likely to find options so long as you're prepared to compromise.

Hi MonstersRock, I have known other people who have done the same thing and the uni discovered that since they were part of the dept. they wanted to employ them after they graduated... So it could stand you in good stead if you wanted a job with your uni. Good luck

Thanks for these comments.

Charlielouie - that's a very positive thought! I will remember that!

Bousy - I think you may be right about options and compromises. I may not be that flexible in my willingness to travel, but I'm sure I can be flexible in other ways.

Thanks for all the comments here. They are all much appreciated!

I agree that there's no problem at all with staying to do your PhD. It's usual to develop your interests as a result of what you've been studying, and I agree with beanlet that your supervisor is of paramount importance. Mine was amazing and I stayed at the place where I had done my Masters so I could work with her.

What happens after is the problem, though, I agree with that. At the moment my DP and I are in the same place but mine is a fixed term contract and anything could happen afterwards. Do you mind saying what your field is? I think that can be relevant to your long term prospects of using your academic skills flexibly. I'm very pure arts .

charlielouie I'm afraid I know plenty of people who were encouraged by their department to believe that the part-time work, or even full-time temporary jobs, they did for them would result in a permanent post, only to discover that universities without exception exploit young academics' naivety and enthusiasm and then dump them -- and that institutions will never love you back. The latter is the most important lesson I have ever learned.

MonstersRock, why can't you think of moving in a few years' time? What does your DH do? Do you live somewhere where you can commute fairly easily to another city to work if you have to? (e.g. Manchester-Sheffield-Huddersfield-Leeds-York)

I kind of wish I or my DH did something portable like law or medicine rather than us both being academics, because it's been incredibly difficult and took a long time for us to find jobs even an hour and a half commuting apart.

beanlet your thoughts on exploitation echo my experience and that of many many of my friends all over the country. Now that we have all got one stage further I feel the wrongness of it even more than I did at the time.

I do understand what you are saying about institutions and loyalty - although my experience of university life is limited to being a student, my experience of teaching in schools and colleges has actually me taught the same lesson, albeit in a slightly different way. I know it is unlikely that I will find work at my uni, but there will be a small, ever optimistic, part of me, that will hope. But don't worry - it's the same part of me that hopes I am going to win the lottery and that Colin Firth is going to move next door. If you don't have a dream...

Regarding the issue of moving - not only does DH own a business in this area, but our extended family situation (no details here!!) means that moving really isn't an option. However, we do live close enough to London to make commuting an option - not an easy option by any means, but a possibility.

I am studying literature - I don't how the arts/humanities compare to the sciences for flexibility.

Thanks again for all comments - all thoughts are very welcome!

What happens in literature departments is that you might end up being offered some seminar teaching and so on, but only paid by the hour, so once you've factored in the prep and marking time and the scattered timetable you are not really doing much better than the minimum wage (actually less in my first job). Often these are to cover people's leave, but they only cover the teaching element of that person's work, and they don't concern themselves with the research of the covering person. I had a title with the word 'Lecturer' in, I was covering someone's leave, but although she was paid a full salary I got a total of about £4.5k over the year. At the time I felt grateful that I could carry on with what I was doing.

I'm aware that prospective academics are always greeted with tales of doom -- I'm not saying I would have done otherwise. I'm so happy I have a PhD, though regularly think about whether I will stay in this forever.

What appeals to you about it? Did you enjoy teaching? I'd say that is (should be!) an essential quality in an academic. I love my students, I love seeing the insights they bring to stuff I've looked at 100 times, and I love seeing them transform over their undergraduate years. Maybe if you could identify the things you think you would enjoy in academia it will help you fashion Plan B?

Thanks for this, Heartsease. I've been thinking about this and the bottom line is, yes, I always did enjoy teaching. Having worked both full-time and part-time/hourly-paid in teaching, I know the issues you speak of only too well, but there are pros and cons to it all and it all worked out for the best for me.

Everyone has given me a lot to think about on this thread - thanks again to all.