House fires, how to survive them? Why do people die in them?

[Bumperslucious]

After a few national news stories about people, families dying in house fires, it has got me thinking. Why do people die in house fires?

I'm not being as dense as you think, what I am wondering is what is the reality of a house fire?

Obviously living in a flat with no fire escape is a huge risk. I live in a 1st floor flat and assume that I would chuck a mattress out of the window and we would bundle DD up in a duvet and lower her down. Is that unrealistic? Would I have been overcome by smoke by then? How much time does a smoke alarm by you? I think I have an unrealistic view of how quickly fire spreads.

What do other people think? I know we joke about zombie plans, but what are people's real plans? What are the behaviours that allow people to die in house fires? Why don't they get out sooner?

I wonder if there is any chance of having someone knowledgeable on here to talk about it in the way they do with schools.

Can we talk about it, even if it is just to get some people thinking a bit more about it?

I caught our kitchen on fire once.

We always live in crap rented housing with those electric hobs that don't light up, you know, the black ones.

I put some eggs on the hardboil and left a tea towel on the wrong burner.

I was ironing in the living room, totally oblivious, when the smoke alarm went off.

The kitchen was full of smoke.

DH managed to put the fire out but with the smoke we had to call the fire brigade.

It was in a tenement in Edinburgh and we had a 3-year-old and a baby and two cats.

They came right away and got the windows open, then went into every single flat and checked and refitted the smoke detectors.

Scary to think what could have happened if there'd been no smoke detector in the hallway - the girls' bedroom was just off that (door was closed but they were sleeping)!

I never leave appliances on at night - even the bread machine or slow cooker.

I set everything up so I can turn it on first thing in the morning when we get up before I head off on the school run.

They die because they do not get out quick enough - it is that simple.

Like Bumperslucious said about the fire inspector, I 'walk' the three fire escape routes we have every night and ensure the following things:

1. There is nothing going to impede our exit along the route (e.g racks of drying clothes, rubbish, toys on the floor).

1. I have all the keys to all the exit routes, a mobile phone that is charged and a torch that works right by my bed every night.

1. The fire alarms all work.

1. All doors shut downstairs and all bedroom doors open upstairs that we are sleeping in.

I have been encircled by a fire in a field and I guarantee you that I could not see, hear or breathe. Imagine that in a house.

I was in a fire in a student house once and was unbelievably stupid. We were on the top floor of a huge house (third) and couple on ground floor left a candle on top of a stereo which set the thing on fire. Whole house filled with smoke. DP is from a fire service family so the minute he smelled smoke he jumped out of bed, said 'there's a fire' and disappeared off. I sat in bed and waited for him to come back, thinking all the time 'it's very smokey, maybe I should put some clothes on'. Next thing fire brigade burst in the room and were, understandbly, very shocked that I was sat in bed as my room filled up with smoke.

Anyway looked on local fire safety website and they give the advice below:

Escape plans
Does everyone in your home know what to do if there's a fire?

If there's a fire in your home, you need to tell everyone to get straight out, call 999 and make sure no one goes back in. Everyone needs to know what to do and you should have an escape plan you've all practised to help get everyone out safely when there is an emergency.

Make an escape plan

Include everyone who lives in your home, especially children, older people and lodgers
Talk through your plan, including what to do and what not to do in a fire
Tell everyone where the keys are for the doors and windows
Plan the order you'd escape in, so that if you have to go out of a window you can help others down
Practise the plan and remind everyone of what to do and what not to do in a fire regularly
Put your address by the phone so children can read it out to the emergency services
Put a reminder of what to do in a fire somewhere prominent, like on the door of the fridge
Choose an escape route

The best escape route is your normal way in and out of your home
Think of any difficulties you may have getting out, for example in the middle of the night
Choose a second escape route in case the first one is blocked
Keep both escape routes clear of things that might get in the way
You may be able to escape out of the window if you're on the ground floor
If you're on the first floor you should only do this as a last resort when you are in immediate danger. You should cushion your fall with bedding or cushions and lower yourself before dropping
What if you can't escape?

If you can't escape, you need to find one room for everyone to take refuge in
It's best if the room you retreat to has a window and a phone
Shut the door and block the bottom of it to prevent smoke getting in
Open the window and call for help
Stay by the window and lean out of the window to breathe if you need to
What if you live in a flat?

High rise flats are built to be fireproof. Walls ceilings and doors will hold back flames and smoke. If there's a fire elsewhere in the building you're usually safer staying in your flat unless heat or smoke is affecting you.

Make sure everyone in your home knows about the fire and alert neighbouring flats by banging on the doors on your way out. Set off the fire alarm if there is one
If there's a lot of smoke, crawl along the floor where the air will be cleaner
Get everyone out and don't delay for valuables
Don't investigate the fire
Before you open doors check them with the back of your hand. If they're warm don't open them as the fire is on the other side
Don't use the lift. Go down the stairs

Sunshine - your dp just left you there without telling you to go with him? Am I reading that right?

Yes. He actually went to see if he could help. He and the boy of the other couple carried the burning stereo out of the building.

Wow abetadad that is very conscientious, I'm going to take a tip from you tonight and I hope other people will too.

I honestly cannot go to sleep without having done it. It is a good habit to get into.

An excellent list from Sunshinemummy the address by the phoe is a good idea as DS1 could ring 999 and do that now.

Moving to a new house in 2 weeks so must make sure I do this.

What a great thread. I have just checked my smoke alarms and cleared both of our routes out of the house. Have even slightly loosened the bolt on the window so I wouldn't have to struggle with that. Will buy a torch tommorrow. Always have phone next to bed anyway. Will definitely shut doors at night from now on. Great advice on here, good idea to start it Bumperslucious

Peachy started a similar thread a couple of weeks ago, and I arranged a fire brigade house check as a result.

As posters have said, they fitted (free) fire alarms, indicated our risk level and gave valuable advice.

The three main causes of fire are:

Smoking
Chip pans
Open fires

They advised that we close internal doors every night and take a charged mobile phone to the bedroom; keep keys to locked doors within reaching distance (a set to keep there permanently); keep stairs clear; check the alarms weekly.

They also told me that in a victorian house, even a raging fire would take 20 minutes or so to burn through the ceiling and floor to get upstairs, and so we would be more sensible at night to bring the dc's into our (road-facing) bedroom, and wait for them to arrive rather than tackle the smoke-filled stairs.

have just booked a visit, thanks for this. am wondering what we would do to get dds if there was a fire, once they start sharing a room.

One thing with fires is that your landline telephone might not work (ours had burnt out) so having your mobile phone within easy grabbing distance, especially overnight) is a very good idea.

On the issue of torches.

I have bought several of those LED wind up torches. They are quite bright but the important thing is that it is impossible to forget to buy new batteries. A quick wind once a week just before bed and they are always ready. I have put one in every bedroom as they can be bought quite cheaply in packs of 2 in places like Robert Dyas or Argos.

Lots of people are suggesting leaving keys in doors/windows, but this actually invalidates many insurance claims, so we don't do it, as our insurance policy specifically says that we shouldn't.

Our large garden shed burned down earlier this year. We had a fridge and freezer in there, so we believe the fire was electrical. The fire brigade said that most home electrical fires are caused by tumble driers.

I worry most about dd being on top floor by herself. She is only 3, so hard to explain (or even to know) what she should do if we can't get to her in the event of a house fire.

We recently had a fireman come to our local childrens centre to give a talk on this. He asked us what we'd do. I said I live in a first floor flat, so if therre was a fire in the public stairway, I'd have to chuck mattress/sofa cushions out the window, followed by ds's (23months and 5 months) and hope they survive that with at worst a broken limb. He told me no, never jump or throw anyone out of the window, instead take your family and shut yourself away in one room and call 999 whilst yelling help as loud as you can out the window......but isn't that what those people did recently? Shut themselves in a room and they all died! It is a scary thought. This man said it is best to have more than one plan, you should think of where you are likely to be at different times of the day (ie mid afternoon vs. midnight) and have a different plan for each as it may be easier/harder to get to the children........

Littleboyblue, yes, they did shut themselves in and were not able to be rescued But that was an old block of flats and probably if they'd have tried to escape they wouldn't have made it either. More modern flats are built with fire risk taken into consideration. Also I think if you shut yourself into a room with a window big enough to get out of, and stay there until you literally can't, that is when you should start throwing people out of windows!

I read about the Woolworths fire (in the 1970s I think?) People were ignoring the fire alarms and just carried on eating their food in the cafe. Most of the people who died were in the cafe. The others were staff members trapped on the top floor behind barred windows Also, my friend was in a Travelodge in Glasgow recently on about the 42nd floor and the fire alarms went off but he just went back to sleep! Luckily it was a fault with the alarm but he wouldn't have had a chance in a real fire.

thanks for thread

We live in a thatched house so we are fairly aware of fire risks. One thing people fail to do which appalls me is having chimneys swept and boilers serviced.

We live on the ground floor of a three floor house. I must admit part of my criteria for anywhere we live is that it's not hard to escape...in our last house, we all slept in the front bedroom, which had a porch roof outside to climb down onto, plus asbestos ceilings (ok if undisturbed!!) so I always knew we could get out - ds's room had a permanently locked window, as it had a conservatory under it, and he was v adventurous child but it would have been useless to escape that way anyway because of the glass. So he stayed in my bed till we moved, when he was 5!

The windows here are huge single glazed but don't open, mostly, however we could break them easily if necessary - but there are 3 exits already so hopefully wouldn't be necessary. I am going to get the fire people round to fit alarms as ours are sat in their packet, I have no idea where to put them and ceilings are 11 ft high so quite tricky.

I worry about our upstairs neighbours if we had a fire, although they have a separate huge stairwell so hopefully they could just use that - but we do need alarms for them if not for us. There are old ones here that don't even work.

I could seriously NOT live somewhere without extremely foolproof escape routes, and sleep at night - i've always been a bit of a fire-o-ophobe though. Even using the incinerator makes me jumpy, I don't use it in summer or at all if possible.

We're not allowed candles as we rent, so I just use them for decoration. It amazes me how many young people (like my old school friends) have candles lit or scarves draped over lights, that kind of thing, really seems so odd that there are not more fires.

the one thing that i learnt going on a fire marshall course for work was. in cambridgeshire not one person has died in a house fire with a working smoke alarm.

also if you suspect a fire at night and your dh/dp goes to investigate, make sure you all go together, including the kids as many times families who remain upstairs have perished as the person who went down stairs cant get back up due to the smoke/fire etc and their nearest exit is the front/back door.

Interesting Ihatethecold, both about the smoke alarms and all going together. You are right, as you might need both parents to enact any kind of escape plan (obviously that is not always possible).

Another thanks for this thread - it has given me some things to think about. Especially ABetaDad - I frequently leave racks of drying clothes in front of the french doors at the back, and sometimes even behind the front door. Won't be doing that again!

ABetaDad, your list is similar to mine, and now my children are older, they're part of the 'check doors are shut, stuff is turned off, candles are put out, smoke alarms work' routine.
One of the things I've done since my children were small is have fun testing out the fire escape route every now and then. Including crawling, because the last bit of air is several inches above the floor in a fire/smoke emergency. G was aware that he needed to keep his floor tidy because his room is our emergency exit point. Lego in boxes at the end of the day, papers and books away. He still does it.
Involve your family in knowing what and why, then it becomes part of their understanding and routine. Girl is off to uni in October, and she'll take that knowledge with her

I almost had a fire in our house 3yrs ago. I was just getting lunch ready, put a frying pan on the stove with some oil and then the doorbell rang...some waste of time person, then for some reason I went and did something else, totally forgetting about the oil!
The smoke alarms went off, the one upstairs first then the one by the kitchen door.
The whole kitchen was full of black smoke and flames on top of the cooker.
I just grabbed the fire blanket, turned off the stove and put the blanket over the frying pan.
It went out and then i had to open all the doors and windows to ventilate.
That was a very close call and now if i'm using the frying pan i won't go out of the kitchen for anything or if i have to i take it off the heat.
Took ages to clean all the black soot off but it could have been MUCH worse.

Thanks Bertie It's just such a scary thought isn't it? We do live in a new build and it is only 2 storeys.

I should qualify the advice given to me to stay in the front bedroom if the fire is downstairs - our fire station is less than two minutes away. Other people may be given very different advice. Worth getting those delicious informative fireman over I say