*Pushchair ban* in *Roundhay park cafe* [angry]

[catherine30]

Hello

The pushchair ban in roundhay park means that anyone with a sleeping child/a child too young to sit in a highchair or more than one child under 3 effectively can't use the facility. The manager is very unapolgetic in his decision because effectively mothers with young children are not his target customer - apparently we spend the least and stay the longest!!

Given they have the monopoly on food and drinks - with seating - in the park I for one am very annoyed at the short term view of said manager. Surely in a few years I might be in the target customer category!? I certainly won't forget the uncompromising approach he is currently taking!

What do other mums think?

I checked with some one who knows. it would only be disablist if they refused entry to a child who was disabled

Yes, but any child unable to walk on grounds of disability and even using a normal pushchair (like my DS2 had to) would need to be allowed in using their pushchair under the terms of the Act, and this would need to be made clear, otherwise it would contitute discrimination.

The visual impairment issue is a bit of a red herring because the cafe itself is not effectvely putting the pushchairs in the path of visually impaired people using a stated policy. However it does have a stated policy of banning pushchairs. They are therefore on thin ice here IMO.

I've got a buggy and I find it pita when we go out and there are loads of them (I take sling or fold it up or put it out way)...and if there was somewhere to put them I wouldnt actually mind leaving my buggy

There is lots of room in that cafe (although I've not been in since the fire and subsequent refurbishment) - but there is also space that could easily be put aside to put folded up pushchairs in. I think if your dc is asleep you should be allowed to take them in - are they going to ban babies sleeping in car seat too?

As its close to the car park, a lot of people could also put the pushchair in the car and go in without it provided that said child was not asleep...

if the cafe said you couldn't take your disabled child in the cafe in their buggy/wheelchair then that is discrimination, but I don;t think you can use the disability act if "normal"(sorry can't think of an other word) children buggis are banned.
I assumed the op's child wasn't disabled.

You could make an argument it is a form of indirect discrimination because there is no provision made in their policy for the disabled - as it is reported here, it sounds like a blanket ban.

My workplace has a 'policy' of not allowing children of workers in private offices, even though it allows children of members of the public to have the run of the place. It was pointed out this was potentially discriminatory because certain bf employees would be prevented from coming into work for staying in touch days and so on. This was thought to constitute sexual harrassment indirectly.

These things are therefore always more difficult and complicated than they seem.

Would the cafe ban this pushchair, for example? Under the terms of their policy, they would have to, but it would be considered discriminatory under the Act, I imagine.

www.bath.ac.uk/bime/products/pdf/Wheelchair%20Babycarrier%20Information%20sheet.pdf

Sorry, meant to type sexual discrimination not harrassment. Clearly HR are not going around criticising people's norks and so on.

surely though, you would need someone to try and take a sn child in, in a sn buggy. if when the parent expplained they were refused access, then it would be descrimination,. tbh I waould assume a buggy ban did not include sn buggys.

wow that buggy is clever. imo they could refuse the buggy but not the wc

This is where lawyers would surely have some fun. If you refuse the child's buggy in this case, then indirectly you are discriminating against the person in the wheelchair if they are consequently unable to use the facilities

It's a law of unintended consequences thing. So the cafe would be more shrewd if it put up a notice saying buggies for disabled children and parents only IMO.

Mmm, the visual impairment example is (arguably) far-fetched but it isn't a red herring. It raises exactly the same issues about risk assessment, duty of care and the need to make reasonable adjustments to accommodate users' needs.

too many pushchairs are a hazard. If you are desperate for lunch and you want your baby to stay sleeping - get a sling.

otherwise, wake them up and stick them in a high chair.

the manager has to put the safety of his staff and customers over and above your childs sleep.

Loads of places ban pushchairs, it's not unusual on a family day out to be required to leave a buggy in a buggy park or something. Doesn't bother me in the slightest. If we take the dcs out to eat the youngest goes in a highchair and the pram is stowed away somewhere.

Being child unfriendly is about attitude, imho, and this cafe manager does sound a bit arsey

"The manager is very unapolgetic in his decision because effectively mothers with young children are not his target customer - apparently we spend the least and stay the longest!!"

That would put me off, not the buggy ban.

Oh my this thread has got me started. As an ex cafe manager in a very big a busy cafe I have to say how obtrusive and bloody difficult it is serving customers when you have loads of HUGE pushchairs in the way!!! No idea how people manage in a small cafe.
Whenever I go to lunch with ds I a) fold pushchair away. I have come across mothers putting their babies completly in the way so your serving hot food and drinks over a baby WTF??
And wingand prayer I have actually had a mother refuse to take her children out of a dbl pushcahir to get down a fire exit during a real fire evacuation!
Sorry to rant

A cafe near me started doing this once and amazingly enough they went out of business.

Is there a moral here about actually being responsive to what your customers want, rather than telling them what they ought to have??

God forbid.

If coffee shops near me started banning buggies then they would soon see a drop in their profits. They are always full to bursting with families and, contrary to what he seems to be saying, they/we stay ages and drink and eat lots.

I would be happy to leave the buggy if there was somewhere safe to leave it but he sounds like he's got delusions of grandeur for his cafe and babies don't feature in it.

This story is in the Yorkshire Evening Post TODAY (Wednesday)... anybody know any other cafes with the same ban?

The cafe in our local zoo requests prams are left outside in a buggy park and I'm pretty sure a kiddy farm we went to in the midlands somewhere did the same thing. Prams are banned in Blackpool Tower circus and in York Castle Museum.

Thinking about it though, how many Mums with dc in tow can linger over a coffee? It's generally the 'smash and grab' lunch where we're concerned.

I think it's perfectly reasonable to provide a handy buggy park and enthusiastically encourage people to use it, but a lot more offensive to ban things outright in a authoritarian sort of way.

You can usually get people to do things by being nice to them, IMO.

We own a child friendly country pub, where at least 95% of our customers have to drive to. Many customers will take their child out of their car seat and put them in the pushchair to bring into the restaurant. This is becoming a huge problem for us, as when busy we just do not have the space for the pushchairs. As a mother of two myself I am quite understanding when it comes to children but, this I cannot understand. Any advice as to how we can resolve this, without offending customers?

We own a child friendly country pub, where at least 95% of our customers have to drive to. Many customers will take their child out of their car seat and put them in the pushchair to bring into the restaurant. This is becoming a huge problem for us, as when busy we just do not have the space for the pushchairs. As a mother of two myself I am quite understanding when it comes to children but, this I cannot understand. Any advice as to how we can resolve this, without offending customers?

There is a pushchair ban in the cafe in our local park - though in practice they do waive it for sleeping children. But if they're too young for highchairs, they just have to sit on knees. Which is fair enough - the counter is right in front of the entrance, and the tables are very close together. Buggies would make it horrendous.

Foodiemum - if the customers are driving, why do they need to put them in the pushchair to come in? Very strange. I would have though carseat (at a push) or nothing. If it was a city pub I could understand.

I would explain as people arrive - "I'm very sorry, we don't have space in the restaurant for pushchairs unless they are folded. You're welcome to bring the car seat, and we have highchairs available". That wouldn't offend me in the slightest!!