Is he a bad husband/father, should I say anything?

[breeze]

My b/friends hubby really gets on my nerves. I know it is not my place to say anything to her, but I have just been round there to see my friend and I hate seeing her down. I did try to say a few things, but she seems to know what is coming and changes the subject.

My friend started going out with her DH when he was married to someone else and she was in a relationship. Basically neither of them have ever been single since they were about 12, always leaving one relationship to start another up.

IMO they are not suitable and only with each other because it is better than being on their own (she told me this much when very drunk 3 years ago).

In the past he has made the odd flirty pass at me, and on her hen party she got off with someone else. So neither seems totally committed.
He said they would never get married, but 2 weeks after we got married the announced they would get married (because she nagged him to death).

Anyway down the line they have had 2 kids 5 & 3.

They get put to bed at 6, he gets in from work at 6.30. he doesn't like the kids up because he has had a stressful day and wants to relax. On his day off he plays football and goes to the pub. It was his Ds birthday party the other day and he decided to go to the pub rather than go to the other pub that was staging his party.

My DH used to be friends with her DH even before they met and he says that he only had kids because its like he has a hold over her and won't leave. he is terrified of being on his own.

Sorry if I have gone on, so mad and needed to vent.

To be honest I am seeing this from how I feel if I was in that situation. I havent been able to talk to her about it for years because she changes the subject. can anyone be happy in this sort of relationship.

I doubt she is happy (he may well be), but they made their bed & must now lie in it. Immense Pity that kids are involved. However lousy he seems as a dad, he could be far worse (actively abusive). I understand you needed to vent but I think you'll have to keep your opinions to yourself around your friend; she obviously doesn't want to hear you saying all these things to her. Hopefully you'll be able to be around and be a stabilising influence for your friend & her kids if/when her marriage does fall apart.

Breeze - I don't think you can ever understand anyone else's relationship from the outside and, in my experience, it is not really worth commenting .......... I have friends who have stayed together for years in what I would consider the most horrendous relationships, equally, couples I know who have 'appeared' to get on really well have split up. My DH works away from home a lot & some friends say to me 'I don't know how you put up with it' - but there are plenty of positives for me - when he is around he is a 100% hands on dad yet I have other friends who can't even leave their child with its own dad!! I think the whole relationships dynamics is really interesting .............. not really answering your question I know!

I do try my best not to get involved, but am constantly asked (same couple who leave kids home alone. another thread). I know she has made her bed, I just hate seeing my friend change so much since she met him.

If she doesn?t like talking about it, I guess you need to respect her feelings and not run the risk of your well meaning words just rubbing salt into the wound and damage her pride. I imagine that she is only too aware of how dreadful he is and it is likely that she is a little ashamed at allowing herself to stay in this relationship, possibly even guilty for her children. Being inside a bad relationship creates all sorts of complicated and ego damaging emotions. She might even feel a little bit jealous of your own situation.
After standing by for years watching my sister in a terrible relationship and having to hold back, I really sympathise. At first I used to go on and on about it as I was so worried for her and couldn?t help myself. Unfortunately, she just stopped asking for my advice and, worse, stopped phoning altogether after a while. Slowly I learnt to keep my mouth shut and we got back on an even keel but it was touch and go for a while. When they finished the relationship ( he refused to commit, thank God), she found it very hard telling me and I could see how embarrassed she was - very hard work not looking too pleased, but I did my best!!

Jaytree, I am glad it worked out for you and your sister. I can see this relationship going to distance because they are both too scared to be on their own. She knew my dh before I did so knows what a gem I have, so you may be right.
Its is just very hard when she moans to me about him all the time.

breeze - Like Jaytree I have learned the hard way, that sometimes people with problems just want sympathy rather than advice.

I know it's hard as you feel you should be doing something for your friend (and what a git her husband is, by the way). But perhaps you could help in a more roundabout way - by encouraging her to take a course or do something different for herself, perhaps also by offering to babysit occasionally or going on the course with her. I was an FE teacher and you may have noticed on other threads that I really believe that doing something practical like that can do all sorts of good things for your confidence and self-esteem. Once she has those boosted, she may decide to do something to chnage her life on her own.

If you don't think something like a course would go down well, how about arranging a day of treats for her "because you know she's had a gard time lately" or something?

Thanks everyone, she plays hockey 3 times a week and he plays football 3 times a week, so they are only together 1 night a week. When she slags him off I really think she is wanting me to moan about my dh, he has his faults but nothing compared to her dh. I will just say "men ah" and change the subject.