I'm looking for analogies to religious schools in the state sector.

[Swedes]

Please help.

Sorry - don't understand. Elaborate.

Hello Seeker.

I'm thinking when a minority interest is state funded.

Royal Opera House
Turner Prize

Swedes, well done on the Royal Opera House. If it's true what I've heard than that is a really good comparison. A place paid for by tax payers that nevertheless doesn't want to let most tax payers in.

Here's a goodie, Swedes - SureStart.

All over the inner city fantastic facilities aimed at supporting families with children under five are being shunned by the people they were set up to help, and colonised by incredulous middle-class mummies instead

My dsis found her local SureStart centre by chance, was gobsmacked at all the lovely courses/sessions on offer, signed up for a few...and was the only person who turned up.

I thought the Royal Opera House let anyone in...for a modest fee of course!

Marina - I thought SureStart was choc full of MC mums learning interlined curtain making, upholstery, script writing, papier mache mask making etc. Not serving those it was set up to help but used nonetheless.

And faith schools are full of pretend believers...
I know some SureStart stuff has been curtailed because of lack of uptake, sadly

Marina - Thanks

Music and drama schools - but they admit children purely on the talent they have

Royal Opera House
Die Zauberflote £139 (mat)
La Traviata £175 (eve)
Parsifal £190 (eve)

There are a few cheaper tickets in the stall Circle sides for £53 £63 and £70 respectively but they are sold out. (Must be all the council estate kids getting in first).

I'm not sure that I agree about Surestart. I live in a chi chi area on the edge of a not at all chi chi area (in London). My nearest Surestart has been colonised by the middle classes. One day I took DS to the one a mile and a half away, on the edge of an estate. It was packed, and not at all middle class.

I don't know if there's any research into who actually uses them, most of what seems to be around is anecdotal and comes from papers - and journalists are likely to find their way to the posh ones.

By the way completely agree about unacceptability of the state funding religious schools.

I've got 4 children and I know very little about SureStart - I feel a bit cheated.

Our local SureStart has some brilliant courses, its just unfortunate that they are all during the day when I work.

SureStart funding is subsidizing my son's after school club.

However some of the courses are really helping the people in the area. My son's best friend is Indian and his mother could not read English. This caused problems with her listening to her own son read. She has done a 15 week remedial English course. Her ablity to read, write and speak English has improved dramatically and so has her confidence.

Its a matter of children's centres putting on the right courses that are appriopate to the needs of the parents.

Swedes - isn't it the other way round to your OP - the C of E helps fund state schools?
I mean, they historically set up schools in poverty stricken areas, and now are continuing that in funding academy schools in poor areas.
Unfortunately this means that in many areas state schools are all C of E and local people have no choice but to send their children to a faith school if they want them to remain part of the local community.

I'm a little bemused about this religous schools in the state sectore hoo-har.

My local junior school is CofE. DCs'would be sent there unless I can get them into another school.

I have moved DS from this CofE school to a Catholic school. Under subscribed, but none the less good. Actually I couldn't care if it was Catholic or Jewish. He is happy.

Aren't independent schools indirectly state funded because of the tax breaks they get?

And I would say that the Iraq War is a state funded minority interest.....

I'm a little bemused about the religious schools in state sector hoo-har also.

My children both attend(ed) a C of E primary.

All that happens is that they get a good cultural grounding in the traditional British faith, as well as an utterly positive and sensitive grounding in other faiths.

I am an unbeliever (so are they). But I don't at all see why unbelief should necessitate an abstraction from a central cultural feature of our society.

The Church is a cultural enterprise, like theatre, sport, and so on. Our society is being ravaged by valuelessness. In the absence of traditional, culturally entrenched values we don't all suddenly become perfectly rational and moral. We are denuded and prey to a nihilistic consumerism.

We need to give our children a rich common culture. That is very far from amounting to religious indoctrination, which state schools shouldn't (and largely don't) engage in.

Much better to think about the NHS so we all pay for it but then imagine we had comprehensive hospitals which admitted everyone and then C of E, Catholic etc hospitals which gave priority to patients from that faith and then allowed any spare beds to those from other faiths. These hospitals would attract extra funding from the relevant faith. The faith of the hospital might also influence the sort of treatments offered e.g. circumcision, contraception, blood transfusion and abortion. It would be great wouldn't it? Not.