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Firemen's strike - what do you think?

124 replies

SofiaAmes · 22/11/2002 00:54

So what does everyone think about the firemen striking? Do they deserve a 40% payrise? Should they be allowed to strike?
I'm fed up with the media spin and would love to know what real people think.

OP posts:
WideWebWitch · 22/11/2002 23:37

Gillymac, well maybe they shouldn't have joined the army then!!!!!!

bossykate · 22/11/2002 23:42

the 40% thing seems to be a stumbling block for people... remember (based on the aspirational salary of £30,000) that means they earn £18,000pa now... at risk of being boringly repetitive that is not a lot of money for being the person who runs in to the burning building when everyone else is running out...

well, scummy and www looks like it is just us at the barricades (maybe sofiaames also), while we are there warming our hands on the burning braziers we can have a "free and frank exchange of views" on top up fees for university students...

SofiaAmes · 23/11/2002 00:02

bossykate, I will definitely be at the barricades, but you can bet I won't be talking to you lot when there's a handful of firemen to talk to...now I just have to figure out what to do with dh. And roxie, I don't know where you live, but the policemen in my neighborhood are a pretty sorry lot.
I pay my cleaner 7.50/hr, but then again, with 3 university degrees (2 of them masters) I only make 12.50/hr at my chosen career.

OP posts:
robinw · 23/11/2002 07:14

message withdrawn

Tinker · 23/11/2002 10:20

Oi bossykate, don't forget me!

willow2 · 23/11/2002 11:07

C u at the barricades - I'll be the one with my tongue hanging out.

(Thought this thread needed to be taken to new, higher level)

Janeway · 23/11/2002 12:59

A slight aside - why don't we pass on pensioned off fire engines to the military so they can use more up to date equipment for their own purposes and be better trained/equipped/ready to help out in emergency situations such as strike or terrorist attack.

Janeway · 23/11/2002 13:57

Lets face it, the whole world pay structure is screwy, but paying one valuable service a hugh chunk more will not answer it, that will lead to other similarly valid claims and therefore an inflationary tendancy, with the worthless "fat cats" getting still more, and each pound being worth less to us.

The only way to fix it is to put me in charge - I'll re-structure all wages so that those we'd miss most (should they strike) and/or those who have the most personally harmful or nastiest jobs would get most. I mean, who would miss the services of Computer Games writers more than that of the people who clean the public loos; or the TV hype presenter over a nurse or the person who builds our schools/homes?

Tigger2 · 23/11/2002 15:25

I agree that the Fire Fighters deserve a pay rise, as many in people in skilled labour (hands on jobs) don't get the pay that they deserve. Nurses, midwives, teachers the list goes on, are being shafted because they do the donkey work and some bugger in a suit takes the credit! by floating about looking super efficient, with the "I love me who do you love" attitude. This country needs manual workers, without these people who would clean the streets, clean the public loos, rescue me or my family from a car accident, or fire, nurse me when I'm not well, wash me, feed me, look after a new born very ill child, look after my child and me when the child is unwell in hospital, a teacher who has the gift of helping a child with severe learning difficulties and understanding a child who has a physical or mental health problem.

Yes farming can be dangerous, especially when you have an over amerous young bull like ours who thinks that I am his lurve thing!!! Doesn't bother with DH (the bull has some taste!!) just loves me.

tigermoth · 23/11/2002 16:57

Janeway, LOL! please take over the country right now!

gillymac · 23/11/2002 19:27

www, maybe squaddies shouldn't have joined the army but the same argument could be used for the firemen, i.e. that they knew the terms and conditions fo their job when they joined.

leander · 23/11/2002 22:07

£30k is not a lot of moneyfor the job they do.
To those people who say that they are not worth that much I bet your attitudes would change if it was your child(god forbid)that they saved from a burning building.

Ghosty · 23/11/2002 23:19

I think that they should be paid more ...
yes they do have to spend a lot of time waiting for a fire but didn't anyone see that documentary filmed in NY in the months running up to Sept 11th by those French brothers? After a relatively quiet summer of not much happening, hundreds of NY fire fighters lost their lives trying to save lives ...

This could happen in the UK any time ...

PS ... Vote Janeway for PM NOW!
PPS ... Tigger2 LOL
PPPS ... (I fancy them all too!)

Lois · 24/11/2002 00:04

I don't think they should be striking. It's irresponsible. It makes me angry that peoples lives are being put at risk because of their selfishness. They should settle for £25K. Post 9/11 it's gone to their heads.

And yes they all have second jobs. My house was completely refubished by the good chaps from our local station.

jessee · 24/11/2002 02:09

sack them all and get new ones!

robinw · 24/11/2002 08:14

message withdrawn

tigermoth · 24/11/2002 08:29

excuse me if this has been said earlier, but wouldn't fire fighters get more money if the working hour rules of permanent and retained fire fighters were changed? am I right in understanding that permanent firefighters can't be on call (and therefore paid) at any other fire station on their days off? If fire fighters habitually have two jobs anyway, and if (big if here) they can cope with this, then why can't both jobs be within the fire service? If the issue is one of safety, as I imagine, (of course exhausted fire fighters should not have to be on call 24/7 for a decent wage) then could they be offered extra training so they can supplement their fire fighting job with a desk bound day or two within the fire service?

Just an aside, my dh assures me that if our house burns down during the strike and no fire fighters turned up, we could still claim insurance. Is this right?

Tigger2 · 24/11/2002 10:36

As a matter of interest, who do you think should get a pay rise and what should the pay be, think about this and tell us who you think shold be on your list.

Me of course for my continued good farming practice!!!, our situation is different though as our prices can be very different from week to week and much of the money we receive comes from European Subsidies, of which we can lose if we make a mistake when filling out yet another form. But if we in the farming community want the support from subsidy then the paperwork that MOST of the farmers complain about should be completed properly, I do it all (I can feel a gold star coming on!! from DH)

Another point, living expenses (i am told) in England are a lot more than we spend up here, even in the bigger cities in Scotland, I don't think that it is as expensive. We live in a rural area, and tend to shop local, albeit usually in the huge safeways. Hats off to our local Costcutter, in their butchery dept they have a huge sign that says they can tell the consumer where all their beef, lamb etc has come from, even from birth, good for them, this info shold be available in the supermarkets as well.

The Firefighters, am I right in saying that there are proposals that they should also be performing some of the tasks done by paramedics? like in the USA?

bayleaf · 24/11/2002 13:46

Hmmm mm usually very 'left of centre' but not so on this one...
a) where is the shortage of firefighters? Every job is over subscribed ( often 50 applicants per job) even in London if newspapers are to be believed ( OK I know they're not!)
b) I went out with a firefighter for 2 years and the whole culture made me ( and him) sick - very macho, very 'all lads together', lots of drinking even when on duty sometimes - they had a stripper/prostitute ( not the same thing I know - she came as the former but didn't seem to have a 'hands off' approach!)in the station whilst on shift on at least one occasion for someone's birthday....
Yes some of them work very hard and SOME stations are very busy through the night shifts - others go to sleep and resist much of the 'extra' work they could be doing during non busy periods. Like many professions ( my own as teacher included) they need to face up to big reforms before realistically they deserve a big pay increase.
Reading the headlines in todays' paper makes me relise just how far to the right I've moved since my younger days! Not quite to right of centre - but certainly to a very Blairite 'right of the left'!

Tinker · 24/11/2002 13:58

That's an interesting subject for discussion. My politics have definitely shifted far more leftwards since becoming employed.

Lollypop · 24/11/2002 14:05

I cannot make up my mind until I find out what the new working practices that the firefighter have turned down are. Anyone know? I do know that the army get paid less and that the leader of the FBU seems very argumentative and unhelpful on TV.

SofiaAmes · 24/11/2002 16:53

Wow, I'm as rightwing as they come on anything to do with economics (not socially however)...I even thought maggie was too nice sometimes...and I think the firemen deserve a raise.

OP posts:
bayleaf · 24/11/2002 18:04

Good grief Sofia - WHY? If you're a Maggie Girl what on earth can persuade you that they need a rise given their out of date working practices, the fact that they are already 'better' paid than nurses when all things are considered - and that thier claim is so far over inflation etc etc????
I'm intrigued! ( and I thought Maggie was the antichrist at the time!)

Rhiannon · 24/11/2002 18:24

The fireman who lived opposite us had a black cab that he shared with another guy on a different watch. He moved to a 5 bed detached house in Royston a couple of years ago. He's obviously doing very well.

I agree they need a rise, I don't agree to the strike. I think 16% is about the right amount. R

Xanthe · 24/11/2002 18:53

Our central heating engineer was a fireman in his soare time and made a nice little profit as all the jobs he did for us were cash in hand. I'm not denying that being a fireman is dangerous and much of the time mind-bogglingly tedious, but I totally disagtree with the strike, as they are much better paid than other public srctoe workers such as ambulance drivers and there is plenty of scope for them to have other jobs when they are off-duty.