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Original poster

PEDANTS, SNOBS and SALTS............................................. help me with this

34 replies

VeniVidiVickiQV · 31/07/2007 17:14

DD had speech therapy today.

It was mentioned that she also says "ff" instead of "th". I said yes, and we correct it at home as much as possible. The SALT said "Well, we dont bother to correct that, because it's regional dialect ("Norf London" obviously), plus its quite common at this age and most children grow out of it"

THEN, she was doing some bits with DD whilst I amused DS, and she said "Which one o' them do you want xxxxx?"

Am I being just a little bit sensitive about this or should a SALT know better?

OP posts:
NadineBaggott · 31/07/2007 17:16

You're joking, right?

witchandchips · 31/07/2007 17:17

is aim of speech therapy to make children speak "proper" or to be understood?

MaryAnnSingleton · 31/07/2007 17:19

too !

JeremyVile · 31/07/2007 17:19

ff for th is not a symptom of speech problems per se though is it?

So not really SALTs concern and i think a lot of pre-school kids do this even ewhen they are from a well spoken family.

allgonebellyup · 31/07/2007 17:21

it isnt actually a speech-related problem though, i think the SALT is right in this case.. (can you spot the hopeful SALT in the making?!)

allgonebellyup · 31/07/2007 17:22

SALTs dont like to pressure children who are quite young to feel they must "perform" properly, it is true that the problem will probably correct itself , it is just a choice of dialect at the mo!

NadineBaggott · 31/07/2007 17:23

its the 'one o them' that I'm shocked at.

I'd really expect a speech therapist to have good grammar.

moondog · 31/07/2007 17:26

I'm a salt.
We're not elocution teachers though.
I don't do this kind of work but yes,she is right.
Herei n my part of Wales,Welsh speaking kids use a 'ch' sound instead of a 'll' which is technically 'wrong' but we don't correct it as it's a dialect variation.

Noone 'speaks proper' when using connected speech anyway.This is a huge area known as Phonology which is quite fascinating.
To use a common example, if you say 'Goodge Street' fast and then analyse it phonetically, even the properestestspeaker of them all is actually saying 'shtreet' and not 'street' as the 'j' sound in 'Goodge' has 'coloured' subsequent consonantal clusters.

Geddit?

mamama · 31/07/2007 17:29

I think my reaction would depend on the purpose of the therapy. Why is DD having speech therapy?

IME, it is usually designed to help children understand the subtleties of language and correcting speech impediments etc rather than altering accents, dialects or commonly mispronounced words.

If you're really unhappy with the ff/th thing, can you have a word with the SALT? Or just keep working on it at home while she works with DD on the other things.

Blandmum · 31/07/2007 17:35

my DN is now a SALT. She has a west midlands accent. She can also do a mean welsh accent (copied mor her df, dm and me!)

Ellbell · 31/07/2007 17:37

The 'ff'/'th' thing is very common isn't it? My dd1 (7) still does it (whereas dd2, who is 2 years younger, has no problem distinguishing between them).

I'm not sure what the problem with 'Which one o' them do you want?' is. Is it just that she didn't pronounce the 'f' in 'of'? If so, I'd say it's pretty minor as 'mistakes' go, and a characteristic of normal, everyday speech. (No-one enunciates every single sound of every single word all the time - it would be like saying 'does not' and 'cannot' all the time, rather than 'doesn't' or 'can't'.) Or was there a problem with the 'them'? If she had said 'I've got a red crayon, a green crayon and a blue crayon. Which one of them do you want?', I'd have no problem with that. Whereas, if she'd said 'Which one of them crayons do you want?', I'd have been a bit .

I hope the session was useful for your dd anyway.

Ellbell · 31/07/2007 17:39

Just to clarify... was responding to the clarion call of the pedant . I am not a SALT (and I hope not a snob) .

ProjectSeverus · 31/07/2007 17:41

them

Gobbledigook · 31/07/2007 17:48

one of them

MrsBadger · 31/07/2007 18:05

Ellbell is spot on with usage of 'them' - tis context dependent and not always a cause for shrieking.

Ellbell · 31/07/2007 18:09

Thank you MrsB. Was starting to think I was losing my pedantic touch !

Original poster
VeniVidiVickiQV · 31/07/2007 18:25

Oh no, it was definitely a "one of those/these" calls

The th/ff thing - I can live with it, because it is common with young children. I dont buy it being a regional dialect issue though.........[snob]

OP posts:
Original poster
VeniVidiVickiQV · 31/07/2007 18:28

I'd also suggest, Moony, that us Londoners can say Goodge Street just fine, and without a "shhh"

OP posts:
MrsBadger · 31/07/2007 18:29

nah - try it and listen to yourself - Goodge St vs Baker St
subtle difference in the 'str'

hunkermunker · 31/07/2007 18:32

I say which one of them...

But I say "would you like"

Original poster
VeniVidiVickiQV · 31/07/2007 18:33

I guess I was brought up proper Mrs B

OP posts:
Original poster
VeniVidiVickiQV · 31/07/2007 18:34

BBC English, me

OP posts:
hunkermunker · 31/07/2007 18:39
Original poster
VeniVidiVickiQV · 31/07/2007 18:50

I'll prove it when you come around on friday

OP posts:
moondog · 31/07/2007 21:26

Hang on,who the hell is VVVQV?
THought that was Hunker????

Obviously not.

eh???