Mixed up about my dad (very long, venting, sorry)

[acnebride]

Feel so churned up about what i've done to my dad this weekend.
My dad is crap with money and jobs and now lives on the minimum pensioner income (just over #100 a week) in a council flat. He and my mum split 11 yrs ago. He has gone bankrupt at least once, before the split, and possibly twice. For years he would ring either me, my sis or my brother up the night before he was about to have utilities cut off, going to court for non-payment of council tax etc, asking for the money. The previous bankruptcy happened when he signed a loan agreement based on our house, without telling my mum, and then lost the lot so that we had to move.

Clearly it's tough on the pension so I started sending him some money, now #50 a month. I told my mum I was doing this and she started paying me the money. I'm also paying for him to do a computer course - I don't think he will get a job but it gives him hope/something to do. 3 months ago I paid a big phone bill (#160) because he was about to be cut off.

On Fri he rang me and said he was again about to be cut off and his phone bill was #190. I have ummed and ahed but eventually decided not to pay - he'll have to save up the #50 cheques I send him and use those. Apparently he can still get incoming calls and emergency services.

But I feel really wobbly. I'm bad with money too and don't think I could live on his income, not for years on end anyway. He's 73 and he tried to support us when we were growing up, he did what he thought he should do. Although I'm not working atm and we don't have huge amounts of cash (I'm overdrawn myself and probably will be until I go back to work) we certainly have more money than him. Would you pay? I'd love to know.

no i wouldnt pay the phone bill esp. as it is more than last time
what about him using a different company like onetel who have better deals than bt?
or a pay as you go mobile?

Even over a quarterly period, £190 for a phone bill is an awful lot. He must spend half his life on the phone. I don't think you should feel bad about not paying his bills. He's a grown up and should take responsibility for his own debts. I think the idea of a PAYG mobile is an excellent one. At least he has to have the money before making the phone call and he has no nasty bill arriving sometime later.

How on earth has a pensioner on his own run up £190 in phone calls in 3 months? He must be ringing loads of either mobiles or premium numbers.

I think you are dead right not to give him the money this time, acnebride - it sounds a bit like dealing with a teenager - I agree, let him use his £50s to pay it off. (Also, ask to see his bill and see where the money is going, he may not realise what he's doing, my teenagers have been like that, DD2 in particular will call a friend's mobile, then forget that it's a mobile and talk for an hour.)

totally agree with everyone

I was wondering how he managed to run up a bill that high too! Definitely don't pay. How will he ever learn how to manage if you always bail him out?

if he is on basic income can u make sure he is claiming all other benefits he may be entitles to. (council tax, housing benefit, and this winter his £200 heating allowence).

i wouldnt pay. at the end of the day he is an adult, and should (assuming he has no other problems here) be able to live on his income if its just him. We had to survive on 132 a week at one point for me dh and dd1 (about 6months as well). its possible but very hard.

I wouldn't pay, either. My 76yo mum lives on about the same money as your dad yet she even manages to save up for little treats now and then on her pension. She's about to buy herself a dvd player.

I think it's time for your dad to take on responsibility for himself - unless, a thought which has just crossed my mind, he's in the early stages of Alzheimers, hence the behaviour?

i would advise not to pay but in reality couldn't see my parents (if they were alive and in that situation) struggle. Would be inclined to make arrangements for him to get a payphone installed and speak to BT about making stage payments.

No, I wouldn't pay. He obviously relied a lot on your mum for financial arrangements? And he is finding it hard to cope on his own. But this is not the first time he has slipped up, and by bailing him out everytime he just won't learn really will he? You are helping him out very generously as it is, he is wrong to phone you and tell you about these things. Many people would be too proud to ask for help from the same people over and over again, and I think, rightly so.

I think you are quite right to suggest he saves up and pays it. Things are hard, but likewise for many many people and it is necessary to make the adjustments to live within your means. You sound like an incredibly kind daughter and he is very lucky to have you. But you are doing more than enough for him already and you will be doing him no favours by continuing to let him lean on you like this.

I think that you are right not to pay. However, for your own sake, I would suggest trying to help him to set things up so that he can't end up with money problems. At 73 he is unlikely to change his habits at this point in his life, but perhaps you could at least make some differnt arrangements for him. Maybe you could get him a pay as you go phone and instead of sending him the £50 a month, send him top up cards. And also perhaps you could arrange to pay his utility bills directly as well, instead of the £50 a month. That will cover the kinds of things it's easy to overlook paying for. It at least will eliminate the phone calls asking you to bail him out and you won't have to feel guilty that he isn't getting heat or water or able to communicate.

what phone company is he with?

BT do some great deals now. I pay 30 quid a month and almost every single call is free. maybe he should look into cheaper options before asking you for cash

Dont feel guilty

I think it's a great idea to offer to pay some of his utility bills rather than sending him a cheque each month.

Is your dad likely to incurr more debt and court appearances if he does not pay this phone bill?
If so, consider paying it now to avoid extra expense and hassle, but then don't do anything financially for him for the next 3 or so months, to make up for it.

Is your dad able to do anything for you - DIY, house sitting when you are away, babysitting, gardening - that you could 'pay' him for?

Thanks for all your messages, I think i'm going to print these out and mull over them.

Thanks especially misdee for the heating allowance note, I didn't know about that. It's very unlikely that he's claiming it i think.

yes suedonim, I'm worried that he might have the start of dementia as well. It's hard to know how to tackle that but i may contact the Alzheimer's Society for advice.

he promised to set up some kind of deal when i paid his last phone bill, but clearly this is not going to happen for whatever reason, so i will research this. someone else has recommended onetel so i will start there. sometimes the problem is his terrible credit history, but staged payments or payphone may be the answer.

thanks all - you have helped me feel more determined to help him in a practical way, without dissolving into anger and guilt that does nobody any good.