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Original poster

WARNING - CASH MACHINE SCAM

19 replies

bootsmonkey · 19/07/2004 11:31

Please be warned - I have just had £2000 emptied from my current account by people withdrawing cash from an ATM using a cloned card. I hardly ever withdraw cash from cash machines and its Sod's law that on a very RARE night out with my husband, I withdrew cash to pay for my meal. Apparently this was on watchdog the other week (wish I'd seen it) the cash machine had a black box around the card and was stiff to put in and took ages to return.

Bank staff say if you have suspicions, cancel your card immediately, but don't try to remove the black box as often the machines are watched by the scammers who may 'intervene' to save their kit.

I am soooo annoyed - although the money will be re-imbursed, it is me who has to go to the bank to fill in the forms, then to the police station for a crime number, back to the bank etc., etc.

OOOOH!

Be careful out there..........

OP posts:

carla · 19/07/2004 11:34

bootsmonkey ... how did this happen? How did they clone your card? I'm all confused and worried - I'm always using the ATM. Glad you got your money back though

beansprout · 19/07/2004 11:47

Sorry to hear this boots - glad you will get the money back, but sorry for the hassle.

wobblyknicks · 19/07/2004 11:48

carla - basically they use a fake cash machine. The easiest way to avoid it is, if poss, only ever use a cash machine in the side of a 'reputable building' - eg, major bank, major supermarket etc

Original poster

bootsmonkey · 19/07/2004 11:56

Haven't got it yet - will take a couple of weeks and I won't hold my breath until I see it!!

They clone your card by reading the magnetic strip when you put it in the machine and thereby get your account details and then they record your PIN number when you enter it yourself.

Later they will retrieve the whole gubbins from the ATM and download the info onto new cards and then withdraw from ATMs as normal. £500 a day on mine. I only found out by accident as I tried to withdraw cash as I had left my money in my other coat, otherwise they would have had another couple of days before I went to the bank again!

OP posts:

Tissy · 19/07/2004 12:01

my dh's Switch card was cloned (we still don't know where)and we had our account emptied!We got all the money back from the bank, though it was a hassle.

I was advised by the bank that the safest way of getting cash is to get cashback at the Supermarket,or to hand your card in over the counter at a bank. No cash machine is immune, and there are various ways that they can clone cards.

carla · 19/07/2004 12:08

WK ... am still confused. Where do you find a fake cash machine????

katierocket · 19/07/2004 12:09

when we were burgled last year they took DP's cash card and managed to withdraw £400 in cash even though the pin number was categorically NOT in the wallet. Police said that some criminals have special 'machines' that can read the number, the bank said this was not true (well they would wouldn't they)

The bank did refund the money but very reluctantly. i still don't know how they managed to get the number and get the money out.

Original poster

bootsmonkey · 19/07/2004 12:16

Carla - they either fit something over the top of a cash machine, or slide it into the card slot - either way, you can't tell unless you are looking for it.

OP posts:

twogorgeousboys · 19/07/2004 12:28

We've had this happen to us twice in the last 6 months. Now, only ever get cash as cashback from supermarket or over counter in bank.

We know a shop where be bought kitchen equipment (good seconds) cloned my husbands card. Police asked us to give details but these people know where we live so were too frightened to risk a "visit" from them.

Original poster

bootsmonkey · 19/07/2004 12:52

I will never again use a cash machine if I can avoid it, but rely on cashback at the supermarket or face to face over the bank counter

OP posts:

carla · 19/07/2004 13:01

WK - wouldn't the bank affiliated to the cash machine spot this at once???

Tissy · 19/07/2004 13:17

there was a programme about this on the telly a few weeks ago- thieves will target any cash machine, anywhere. "Reputable" businesses are NOT protected. The scanner can be virtually invisible, even to people who know what to look for.

wobblyknicks · 19/07/2004 18:27

But if you HAVE to use a cash machine, one in a reputable business is the best bet. Firstly it won't be a fake machine, which is how some cards get cloned (you can buy machines, fit them into the side of your building/shop and clone cards that way). And also, loads of people will have used it so the problme is likely to be picked up earlier, many machines have cameras which will have picked up anyone meddling with the machine, and some of the machines are checked fairly often.

But like everyone else says, if you can get away without using any machines, thats even better.

SofiaAmes · 19/07/2004 23:08

The other thing you are supposed to do is shield your hand while you are typing in the code. These fake or doctored machines also rely on a camera that records you putting in your code.

GeorginaA · 20/07/2004 08:29

Unfortunately, this situation will get worse with so called "chip and pin" cards - it'll be far more trivial for someone to clone your card (the chip and pin swipe machines all look different - can you be sure you're putting it into a "legit" one?) and far harder for you to prove you didn't spend the money. At least now you can prove that it wasn't your signature, trying to persuade the bank that someone got your pin is far harder.

Tissy · 20/07/2004 08:51

When we had our card cloned we didn't have to prove we didn't spend the money- the bank believed us without question.

A report on "Money Box" recently stated that card fraud has declined significantly in Europe since they moved over to Chip and Pin- we are years behind. One of the advantages of Chip and Pin is that the card does not have to leave your hands- you can put it in the machine yourself, and key in the number, making sure that no-one is looking over your shoulder. I'm sure that the banking industry wouldn't be spending millions going over to the new cards if it wasn't going to save them even more millions. Since getting my Chip and Pin card (4 months ago after my dh's card was cloned), I've only been able to use the Pin a handful of times- in a shoe shop, Safeway and ELC.The "rollout" of technology is very slow.

Tissy · 20/07/2004 08:57

According to the Royal Bank of Scotland website card fraud in France has decreased by 80% since the introduction of Chip and Pin.

GeorginaA · 20/07/2004 12:26

A very good post about the dangers of "chip and pin":

Chris Lightfoot's Fishy and Chips

gscrym · 20/07/2004 12:32

Another thing you should watch for is receipts. One of the reps at DH's work got his house robbed and no cards were taken. They did however take receipts that had the number on them. The following month, his account was emptied and his visa maxed. This is similar to the problem of thieves stealing receipts from the rubbish. We keep ours for a while and then chuck them in the barbecue or shredder.

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