black, fluffy, big.....calling pedants

[hatwoman]

I was asked today to look at someone's English homework. there are very near fluent. She had written about a "black, fluffy, big cat". this made me stop in my tracks - I said that I could give her no logical explanation at all but that in my opinion the majority of native English speakers would say a "big, fluffy, black cat". I'm fairly sure I'm right - am I? and can anyone explain it? don;t you think it's weird?

I would say a big, black, fluffy cat.

I'd say "big, black, fluffy cat" I'm afraid. Sorry .

is she talking about a panther, that would be a black, big cat (not generally fluffy though)

yes you're right, I think it is down to the logic of putting the most important adjective first. Big is more significant than fluffy, so it needs to go first. if you put it third, it seemslike - oh the cat is big?? well why didn't you mention that earlier??
it might have something to do with the rhythm of the sentence too? possibly?

It's obvious, you arrange them alphabetically, LOL.

So eloquent HC! And yes, the fact that 'big cat' is a recognised phrase also makes it problematic.

You're right, big first sounds right and putting big last doesn't, it sounds odd. But I have no explanation I'm afraid. What Harpsi said sounded good though.

Hmm, I think I describe our big fluffy black cat as, yep, a big fluffy black cat. Somehow, despite the fact he is the size of a tank (seriously - strangers stop and comment on him. The police stop and comment on him) and quite amazingly fluffy, the black-catness of him is kind of essential to his being. Black cats are black cats. Everything else is additional.

As long as you don't do what an ex of mine did and rant about a big black cat that was jumping through our window and mutter about 'when I get my hands on that fat black bastard' and then realise you're on top of a bus, in Brixton, surrounded by people who quite understandably want to rip your apparently racist tongue from your throat.

HW you have got my grammar hackles up.
And I can't work out why it is either.
Perhaps because you would always put size before colour in a sentence. So in the same way that you put the possesive first, then maybe you put size next and the colour and any surplus adjectives,
E.g. my small red book, teenyweeny yellow polka dot bikini.

HW you have got my grammar hackles up.
And I can't work out why it is either.
Perhaps because you would always put size before colour in a sentence. So in the same way that you put the possesive first, then maybe you put size next and the colour and any surplus adjectives,
E.g. my small red book, teenyweeny yellow polka dot bikini.

Big, fluffy, black cat. Yes, that sounds right to me.

Sorry for double post.
Not only did harpsi have a better reason for it, she also managed to post just once.

Apparently there is a rule concerning the order of adjectives.

Here is a page explaining what order adjectives go in. By this page's rules, it would be a big, black, fluffy cat (if fluffy is material? if it's shape, it's big, fluffy, black cat).

Obviously native English speakers don't have this list explicitly, but maybe we have it implicitly?

Wordgirl's link and mine agree, only hers includes number, and mine includes shape.

It's fascinating isn't it? I never even realised there was a particular order but as NQC says we must somehow have inferred that there is a rule because we somehow know what sounds "right".

How many people, out of interest, on this thread have a cat? I mean, a big black cat is a very imposing thing. The fluffiness could attach either to the size or the colour. But it's definitely a black cat, a big one. And therefore a big black cat.

Yeah, size comes before colour.

To be fair, a big white cat is a big white cat, not a white big cat.

(I have two black cats, one fat, one thin.)

When a German friend of mine used to write me letters, she copied it so I could correct it and send it back. She had amazing English, but some things she wrote were just so obviously not written by a native speaker. I used to write it "in better English", but could give her no explanation.

It is fascinating. I'm frowning and nodding at the thread. But they have rules on adjective order in different languages too:
Le grand chat noir, il gatto nero grande

35 seconds too slow, eh, nqc. lol

glad to have generated a bit of interest! so there seems to be a bit of scope for disagreement over big, fluffy, black cf big, black, fluffy but you all seem to agree that big has to come first.

I did have an enormous, fluffy, black and white cat and he definitely had to be in that order.

I'll print out the pages on adjectives as it maybe gives a better explanation than I could manage - I did try to reassure her that this menat she really was at the stage or ironing out those little give aways.

and caffeinequeen's example is really good there's no way anyone would talk about a red small book - except to distinguish it from your blue small book