Oh God, My friend's been sectioned and I don't know if I am interfering, but what can I do?

[Spagblog]

This might be a bit confusing...

My friend has a 5yr old son and admittedly suffers from depression, anxiety, insomnia and probably lots of other things that I am not aware of.
She is married to a controlling man (IMO) who doesn't appear to be very affectionate to her, or patient with her.

She has been in the local mental health hospital on a couple of previous occassions. Once he had her sectioned when she was heavily pregnant. I do not know the whole story.

She had a row with him recently over something trivial and (according to her) he said he couldn't cope with her and made her go voluntarily to check herself back into the hospital. She did so to prevent him sectioning her.
I have been in contact with her by text and phone and she is beside herself. She doesn't want to be with him anymore but feels he wouldn't let her see her son if she left.

She spoke to me last night to say he had sectioned her because she had gone to her DSs school to meet him after school finished. He disapproved of her going without his permission.

I don't know what is true, whether I am only hearing her side of the story, whether she is actually paranoid and dillusional, or whether there is some great injustice here.

She has asked me to find out how she can apply for visitation rights with her son. She believes there is some body who offer free legal advice and help to people.
(Legal aid?)

I am so confused. DH says I shouldn't take her calls anymore as if she is ill then I am not helping her by colluding with her paranoia.

Help?

Anyone

An individual cannot have a person sectioned. At least Two professional witnesses are required, usually two docotors and sometimes a social worker.

Check on the local health authority website and you should find a section explaining the rights of a sectioned individual. The section may be for 72 hours or 28 days.

There is some useful information for example

I think you need to talk to the hospital if she is calling you and saying these things. I have heard some complete rubbish from a family member when in hospital, and the doctors and nurses were pretty good at cutting through the crap.

It is extremely hard to get sectioned, you have to be pretty ill for them to cart you off against you will to an already overstretched hospital.

the might well be some great injustice here, but that probably isn't why she is in hospital. Have you tried talking to her husband? He may be contolling but it sounds like he needs to be for his own sdanity.

her dh can ask for assessment for section but its a doctor (psychiatrist) and an approved social worker that sign the papers - so the professionals obviously believe that she requires treatment.

she'll be on a section 2 (for assessment - runs for 28days) or a section 3 (for treatment - runs for a minimum of 6mths)

she has rights under the mental health act and should have been goven a copy of these. she needs to speak to a solicitor that specialises in the mental health act - the nurses on the ward can give her details.

she can appeal the section - needs to be made within certain time spans depending on which section. she will then sit infront of a tribunal board and all parties can have their say and a decision is made as to whether the section should remain (she needs a solicitor for this)

the multi-disciplinary team (psychiatrist, nurses, social worker) will be those who will decide whether her child can visit her but obviously she needs someone to bring him to her and if that is dh then that appears like it won't happen. there are also rules about under 18's visiting units (following abuse in a high security hospital) - they have to have a separate meeting area away from the ward and this may not be possible in the short term depending on how ill she is.

it is difficult not to get involved but try not - if she is sectionned then she is ill and needs treatment. when she phones again remind her of her rights and make sure she gets hold of a solicitor and starts appeal process.

the mental health act commission website will help you understand her rights.

You definitely can't be sectioned just because your husband says so! Just as zippi says.

thank you all.

I will look at the link zippitippitoes.
Do you think that the hospital would tell me things? Or is it patient confidence and all that?

I don't know if I want to talk to her husband. He is pretty unapproachable and would probably tell me to mind my own business.

in an emergency section a relative or asw can apply but the doctor who makes the section has to be sure that to get a second docotor's opinion wouild cause a damaging delay.

I agree that it is very hard to get a formal or informal hospital admission even when desperately necessary, so it is highly unlikely that she is suffering an injustice.

However, it could be that her husband is controlling and the relationship is causing stress, distress and unhappiness and all or any of these are bad news for mental health problems. eg someone who is a manic depressive could become psychotic through stress and insomnia caused by anxiety.

more legal info on mind and an excellent source in general

There may be an advocate based in the hospital. She can also speak freely to staff, she should have a named nurse as well as psychiatrist.

The 72 hour section is for emergency assessment during which she will see a number of people who make a decision on her welfare. After that she may go home, be a voluntary/informal patient or be sectioned for 28 days.

The hospital is bound by patient confidentiality, you can enquire about visiting her.

It is so hard to be a) 40+ miles away from this and b) to only have her side of the story.

I can see that she has problems but I think that she has been terribly let down by her husband and family.

I'll have to step back from it all. I hate to cut off what she sees as a vital line to the outside world.

I don't agree with what her dh said about you being in touch with her, it's not for him to say..if my h had said that to my friends I would have been very angry.

If she is paranoid or delusional or psychotic then imo speaking to you is not going to make any difference to her thoughts. So offer her support.

As a reassurance i would say that mental health hospitals are not like one flew over the cuckoos nest and the staff are usually very willing to listen, even the nursing assistants.

In my experience (immediate family and friends) it is very difficult to get someone sectioned.

My mother is totaly demented, but has only been sectioned once is over 4 years.

family friends have an adult child who is scizophernic and they often feel that she needs to be committed, most times the medics and the social workers say no.

she may well be let down by her family, this may well have a part to play in her illness. But I really don't think 'he got her sectioned'

No, well I had no idea how the mental health act worked, I assumed it couldn't be as simple as your husband wanting rid of you.

Thanks.

I spoke to a nurse at the hospital who thinks it would be beneficial for me to keep in contact with her. I tried her husband's home number but just got an answerphone.

Do you know what happens if they release you and you don't wish to return to the family home? Is there some sort of halfway house or sheltered home scheme available?

There are community based halfway houses and hostels but they tend to be for people who have committed offences. It depends on the local area as provision varies and places are likely to be few and far between. They are more for say someone who has been in prison but is now relatively stable and so needs to be in the community rather than a secure psychiatric place.

She may get a council hostel place or B and B, not likely to be the most appropriate for her needs.

OK obviously I have no idea about the situation but.....

Could it be that her husband comes across as controlling/cold etc because he is the one stuck dealing with all of her mental health problems?

If she is ill enough to have been sectioned a few times then he is having to deal with this, the responsibility for their child/children, the health and well-being of the children, making sure they are secure and safe and that they are as affected as little as possible by a mentally ill mother.

On top of this is he working to provide for the whole family as well?

That's a lot for anyone to deal with. Perhaps he needs help and support as well.

Just another point of view.

Spagblog, my neighbour was recently sectioned and everyone who has said an individual person cannot get someone sectioned is right.
My neighbours family called her g.p, he in turn called 2 psychs. Several hours later, 2 psychs, an ambulance and the police arrived to seciotn her.

You have my sympathy, it is awful to knwo that someone you know has been taken away against their will but at the same time you know they need the help.

I think trying to keep in touch is a good thing. Unfortunatly my neighbours family have completely cut all of her friends off, refuse to tell us how she is or what hospital she is in or anything.

In my county (NYorks) mental health care seems to be quite decent. There is a lot of support after one returns from hospital, albeit from the voluntary sector; such as buddy schemes, drop in centres, support groups. There are also supported housing schemes and women's hostels for example - for people with MH probs.
I reckon writing (maybe on neutral subjects, send pics, magazines,books, puzzles, things to make her realise you have not abandoned her, without getting yourself too drawn in when she is ill) might be a good bet for you.
Are you on reasonable terms with her husband?
I don't know where you are in the country, but if you want more information MIND is a good place to start, they have an info line and also do a range of info leaflets. they also offer legal adivce (I think) to people with MH problems.

here is their website mind

If she has been 'framed' by her dh, it should become apparent to the HPs within the 72hrs.

If she does stay in the hospital for a while, can you offer to help out her dh in some way? Eg Offer to visit and take their ds out for a day to give him a break (not to visit her though). She'll appreciate it later and you might learn some more from the dh (but don't try and make him talk about it too much, men don't feel better from talking like women do.)

..she will probably like some of her favourite music ..probably very hard to concnetrate on reading at the moment.

Chocolate might go down well too.

ggod point zippi

magasines to leaf through rather than a book (agree difficult to concentrate). One of those cooling evian sprays....hospitals can be over hot.

Thank you for your suggestions, I will cobble together a package. Great idea!

I am sure she has mental health issues. It isn't that I think she is fine and it is a huge set up. It just feels like she has been abandoned by her family...Out of sight out of mind etc.

I don't know.

It is a very difficult situation to be in, she is very lucky to have such a loyal friend, your staying in touch with her can do nothing but good things for her recovery.

I hope that it isn't a case of 'out of sight'. I do realise that it can seem like that from the outside, but deciding to admit that a family member is so mentaly ill that they need sectioning can be a gut wrenching thing to do.

I remember well when my mother was taken to hospital, thank God my brother took her, I don't think I could have coped. But we all knew that she couldn't cope at home and was only safe in the pyschogeriatric hospital. didn't stop my cousin telling me how wrong I was to do it though. Ironicaly, her mother is now in the same hospital as my mother.

I hope that your friend gets well as soon as possible, often things have to get this bad before they can get better, she is lucky to have you as a friend.

Agree with what most other posters have said, it is true that you need two doctors and an approved social worker to section someone. There is an onus on the ASW to consider family circumstances, both in terms of what support can be offered to the person and also in terms of what the nearest relatives motivations might be in requesting an assessment.
I can't tell you how many times I have had a partner/relative really angry with me because they were convinced that their relative needed to be sectioned.

often the support after someone leaves hospital comes from the community mental health support team.
you could find them in the phone book and see if they can give you any general idea about what kinds of support are available in your area, obviously they won't discuss any specific case.