Mumsnetters Abroad - I want to hear from you!

[Rhubarb]

Esp those who have moved from Britain to live abroad. I'd like to know what made you decide to go? How did you do it? How old were your children? What was the hardest thing and do you have any regrets?

Rhubarb - see my thread Sunny Cape Town Vs Cosmopolitan London on the Other Subjects Thread.

me, me!

We decided to move to Spain because:

1. we were just priced out of the rental market in Brighton and were fed up with damp flats/getting evicted so the landlord could make a quick buck etc.
2. DP said he needed more sun
3. I wanted to learn a foreign language properly
4. I am a language teacher and he is a freelancer so we thought work would be easy (it was for him, I ended up retraining)
5. We thought it would be a good experience (and it was/is)

We didn't have children at the time, they were both born here. Moving was a bit of a palaver all the same though, mostly because we were on a tight budget. We came over for a week to find a house (should have come for at least 2) and tried to save money by packing all our own boxes, only to have to pay to have most of them re-packed by the removal company (this is actually cheaper than you think, as long as you don't mind waiting a month for your stuff).

I don't have any regrets about coming here, but I do want to come home in the next few years because I don't like being so far away from family and friends.

You thinking of moving?

Well, I am the other way round. Came from abroad to live in the UK. Suppose live itself is not so different from "home". Do sometimes miss family although at other times have been grateful they live far away...Also, never been able to built up friendships like the one from school/university.
Did read about your plans to go to India. You may regret later that you didn't take up the changes for an adventure but I am not sure what I would do with 2 children. As a matter of fact, dh wanted to go to Asia for a holiday next month but I'm not keen because of dd only 11 mo. (well, there are some other hidden reasons as well). I suppose it depends on where you go but would check out what health facilities they have.

Hi Rhubarb

We moved to Switzerland when ds was 3.2 and I was 6 months pregnant with dd. Initially it was supposed to be a year's secondment for dh with a guy here going to London. After a year the Swiss guy moved back here but we stayed as dh was offered a project longer term. We'd promised ourselves in the days before kids that were we to get such an opportunity we should take it and visiting dh's aunt who has been an expat for much of her teaching career gave us the confidence to try it.

We felt it would be a good experience and open opportunities for ourselves and the kids whilst they were at an age when it would be least complicated. However the move did affect ds for about 6 months. He missed his friends, family and home and was probably too young to appreciate the benefits. The kids who probably get most out of it are primary age. dd knows no other life but our options for education are (self)limited by language and differing education systems, and private schools are expensive. ds is already, at the age of almost 6, behind his UK counterparts in reading for example and as we intend to return to UK in the next year or two it is a worry.

As we only came for a year we decided to keep our UK house on and rent it out, partly for my own sense of security and partly to keep a rung on the UK property market. However that has not been without its problems even though we have a managing agent. atm it pays for itself although we have had periods without tenants to cover.

From my point of view the most difficult thing has been the lack of integration in local life. I often still feel as if I live in parallel to local people, mainly due to the language barrier (my High German is still fairly limited and they speak Swiss German dialect)which makes attending local activities difficult, so we tend to socialise within the expat community. I think if you are travelling as a family, with neither working, then it would be a different experience than if you base yourself somewhere and have to get on with normal, everyday life.

Sorry to waffle on but hth

Thanks for that. Yes I am thinking of moving. We want to sell up and start again somewhere different. Perhaps spend 6 months somewhere in Asia first, then we were thinking of renting a place in France to see if we could make a life for ourselves there. I am in the middle of a French language course and dh can get by on his French (he spent a year working there when he was 18). We have been a couple of times and really liked the people and the place, we feel it is a better environment in which to bring up our children. Dd is 3.5 and ds is 11 weeks, but we shan't be doing anything until the summer when he is 6 months old.

Any advice or tips would be appreciated.

lizs - ditto the language problems. I speak good Spanish, and have been learning for 3 years now, but I still find it very hard. 1 to 1 conversations are OK, but I just lose the plot in groups. But that's not too much of a problem as social group type things don't seem to exist here

Rhubarb - why not spend the 6 months in a French-speaking country to practise? I found it much easier to comminicate in French in Morocco than in France because everybody there speaks it as a foreign language too.

I moved from Australia to Germany. My husband is German and the original plan was 2 - 5 years. It has been 18mths so far. I was 5mths pregnant when I arrived. I felt that I had previously missed out on the experience to live overseas, plus I wanted to learn the lingo and get to know the culture for the sake of my DH and my DS. I thought I wouldn't be able to work anyway and defo want to be back home by the time school starts so that was it. My DH had been out of Germany for nearly 10 years, so it was the right thing to do for his family too. DH's employer paid for the relocation, but it is still quite expensive to set up house here as you have to install your own kitchen, light fittings, blinds, curtains and paint.

It has been tough at times, but now my language skills are better I am much more open to staying longer. I socialise a little with expats, but more so with neighbours and with the mums from my baby playgroups as well as with family, so I think that has allowed me to feel a little more integrated.

My mum has visited for 4 weeks and my sister for 10 days and my Best Friend on three occasions of up to 4 weeks plus we have made one trip back home for 4 weeks.

The other benefit of coming to this part of the world has been the travel. Even with the challenges of pregnancy and a young baby I have been to Spain twice, Turkey, Hamburg, Trier, Luxembourg and I hope to see much more.

The main time I regret being here is in the context of a medical situation - the system here is v different, some different attitudes, plus the language challenge.

The best gadget for such a move is a Computer Navigation System for the car - cuts down on the stress and takes out one more obstacle that might keep you at home.

Moved from Uk to New Zealand when DS was 2.5. (18 months ago) Dh wanted to come home. I agreed because I was sick of living the frantic London life, long working hours, commuting, high pressured job while trying to look after DS and feeling that I was failing at both. Exchange rate meant that we could (and did) sell our house in UK and buy 11 acres, 4 bedroom place, with spa and pool going in at present 30 mins outside Auckland. I am a pregnant SAHM at present but have worked pt since being here.
The hardest thing is being so far from home, family and friends especially with the time difference when good or bad happens, not having family to babysit (DH and I have had 2 nights out in 18 months, I was used to 2 nights out a week!!!), although it is NZ not having a past, in that when everybody talks about programmes or songs from their childhood you can't relate and visa versa. DH watches those 'do you remember songs of 76 etc.' and laughs his socks off, it means nothing to me!!! The 'good life' isn't all it's cracked up to be with nobody to share it with. It does become much easier after the first year when you start to make friends. It is hard work though, getting out there, going to all the clubs, meeting heaps of people to end up with a handful of 'friends' which normally you would take years to build up/do.
Having been negative I am really glad that we did it, I won't be sitting at home when I'm 80 thinking 'what if...', DS has a fantastic life, his nursery has a swimming pool, animals, is on 10 acres and is amazing we would need to be billionaires at home to afford that. It has been the expreience of a lifetime. I travelled a fair amount in my 20's but it is different to relocating.
We are not sure we will stay, we wouldn't go back to the UK but are considering france or Spain in a few years. Closer to home and family for me.

We moved to Spain in 2001. We stayed 12 months and decided to come back to UK. I am a seasoned traveller and have done my fair share of back-packing adventures around the globe so I thought a move to Spain would be a breeze. But ... we hated it there, I could write a long list of things we didnt like about being aborad and we both missed friends and family alot more than we thought we would . Neither of us regret going but we are both very glad we are no longer living there.

I suppose my only advice would be to keep your options open. We kept our London flat when we moved abroad, that way we were not priced out of the market on our return.

I am a kiwi who has lived on Geneva and London at various times - both times for approx 2 years. In Geneva I was young and single and although I missed family etc I actually really enjoyed it and would have stayed longer if my work permit hadn't expired (btw I had no French when I arrived but didn't matter). Great for travelling and forced me to do things I wouldn't have attempted at home. 2nd time in London with my (then) husband and it was a totally different experience. In some ways much easier - no language problems and not so lonely at the beginning - but in the end was not such a good experience. The pseudo-familiarity actually made me miss NZ more, didn't like the inconveniences of life in London but didn't really want to move out of London as why would I do that (and then have horrible commutes etc) when I could be in NZ and have a 15 min drive to my carpark outside work in central Wellington? Also created lots of conflict between me and my ex as he wanted to stay and I didn't. We had dd while in London and tbh that was actually the least stressful part of the whole thing although ultimately it was what tipped the balance in favour of returning to NZ.
Sibble - had no idea you had such a fab daycare arrangement in Akld!! What a great idea - wish someone would set one up in Wellington. Is it part of a chain?

With regards to the perils of relocation, I know this is not quite the same, but when I moved here, (Preston) I did it on my own. I knew of 2 friends who came from Preston but neither were living here when I moved. I just hooked up with their friends. I had no car and no job and was living in a tiny room in a shared house. But I didn't miss my family (I was glad just to get away from them!) and I revelled in the chance to reinvent myself. And I did. I met my dh here, I have made many good friends and have had lots of good times. But I never intended to stay here, I always said I would move on. If I hand't met dh I would not still be here. And again, if we didn't have kids, we wouldn't be here either. So before we miss another opportunity I think now is the time to go.

Also the good thing about going to France is that most of them speak English too, and personally I've never come across such friendly and welcoming people (down South anyway).

It is a risk and we might hate it. But as Bunny2 has said, we wouldn't regret trying, but we would regret it if we didn't try. Life's too short for regrets.

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Rhubarb: I love you I love you I love you

You are unusual though: you like french people and you are not afraid to say it! But do go to the south of France, so much nicer there....

I love you

Good luck, please ask if you would like help with anything on France and I'll try my best!

Frenchgirl - I love French people as well, will you love me as well?

Another french lover here! I adore France and the french people. My french isn't that brilliant but I love to speak it, and I try very hard, I do make myself understood, sometimes French have been known to ask me what nationality I am, perhaps they are flattering me!

DH and I are looking forward to holidays now as DD and DS probably won't be coming with us much longer, except for skiing, we are looking forward to taking 3 or 4 weeks and just driving through, nowhere in particular, just stopping and staying in"Chambres a louer" like we used to wehen we were in our early 20's before children. We stayed with some lovely old ladies, in beautiful french homes, lace bed linen, armoires, and every attention to detail.

Some of our happiest and most romanytic holidays have been spent in France, I love being in the middle of nowhere and visiting all the tiny french markets for wonderfully fresh food. We think that we may go and live in France one day soon!

We also use Alistair Sawdays, his places to stay are fabulous

alibubbles and Tinker: I love you too

aahhhhhh

you have put a smile on my face you lovely people!!!!!

Frenchgirl, there is one thing you could help me with! My French! Would you be willing to email me every week or so in French to help me improve my skills? And I could email back in French. Whaddya say?

Are you still living in France? If not, why not!

Frenchgirl, my DD is off to Paris to Uni to read French, do you know any families who would like a paying guest/part exchange babysitting and childcare in Paris, preferably on the RER?

Hi buzzybee, how are things with you? Unfortunately it is not part of a chain. I really did just fall on my feet, it was the only kindy I looked at in the area when we moved and I was lucky to get a place a few months later. Now (1 year later) word has spread as there really is nothing like it close by and I have had to put the baby to be's name on the waiting list (at only 4 months pregnant) for a place at age 2. A firend has just put her 1 year olds name on the list and is 65'th for a place at 2 with fat chance of a place coming up she is told.

what if you moved from abroad to live in the UK - okay call me crazy... I moved from australia with the view of teaching and travelling - almost four years later I am married with an 19month old dd.

Hardest thing going through some tough times with dd without my family and long time friends around.

No regrests - would not have met my husband and some of the amazing friends I have made - I shall miss them when we move back to aus in a matter of weeks.

how did I do it - went for an interview got a job teaching, resigned and in two weeks finished work, packed up a house and left for England knowing NO ONE!!! very scary but what an adventure.

Rhubarb, you are very welcome to e-mail me anytime, I'm happy to help! I have lived in the UK for 10 years now, gulp....I came here as a law student...and met someone and we got married. We would both love to move abroad though, but now's not the right time. DH lived in Madrid for 7 years and misses the continental way of life...

alibubbles, I have a brother in paris but my relationship with him and his wife is not brilliant, I couldn't ask for his help. They don't have kids by the way and a tiny flat in an expensive area!! I will try and think if there is anyone else who might be able to help.

Rhubarb......I got your email and will email you asap. Very strange thing......I'm from Preston too!!!!!!!

Eidsvoid - you brave thing you!
Frenchgirl I will get your email from Mumsnet if that's ok.
Collison - I look forward to hearing from you, whereabouts in Preston?