I have an idea - your thoughts needed, please

[stupidgirl]

After reading...I think it was Zebra's thread, about what arty activities she could do with her little one, I started thinking.

It's something that has only occured to me this morning and I've come onto the pc during the day, which I don't usually do (any excuse!) to lay down some ideas and get some opinions.

Lots of people were saying they hate the mess, and I've heard it said in the past (not on here) by some parents, that they don't 'do' art with their children because of the mess, or because of lack of confidence I guess.

I was thinking about setting up a childrens art group. Meeting for an hour or 2 once a week and basically giving them a free rein to make a mess!

Maybe would have a theme of some kind - something really basic like 'insects' or maybe using the style of a particular artist - it would depend on the age of the children. There would then be certain activities laid out, which the children could join in with, or do their own thing. There would be lots of different materials available, so the children would have the opportunity to experiment.

So, there's the idea, in a very rough form, now the questions

Would you send your child to a group like this? What age would you expect it to cater to? 'Pre-school' or older children?

What day and time would you want ti to be, would you, as a parent, want to stay with the child or drop them off and collect later? Would it bother you that I wasn't 'qualified' (have done art up to A'level, but only just scraped through with a pass!)?

Any other thoughts? Things I haven't thought about? Any ideas, positive or negative would be appreciated. Thanks.

Oh, and another thing - would I be able to get a grant of some kind for this kind of thing?

Yes! A friend of mine runs an art club for pre-schoolers at a local venue. I've never thought to ask about her qualifications, so I'm sure that's not an issue. I think it's a really good idea. Do it do it do it!

p.s I don't know about grant, but will ask my friend if she gets anything for doing hers.

stupidgirl - I think it's a great idea in theory. Your lack of art training shouldn't be a huge problem for kids, I would have thought.

BUT I would be concerned about regulations re looking after children, insurance etc

YES, YES, YES!!! dds used to go to something like this, run by a woman who had three children of her own! She called it Blue Kangroo creative club.She ran it from a building which accommodated a playgroup, mornings only. She had a huge waiting list and yes, the most enjoyable bit was having everything laid out for you and helping your child create what she had made the day before. I have framed 'slippers' (paper template, covered over with felt, decorated with things) hanging in my kitchen. She had themes (slippers were from red theme, also three little pigs, owl and pussycat, painted jubillee plates and crowns .... oh, I miss it so much!!They loved it, I loved it, only trouble is I think the woman got burnt out as she gradually cancelled each class (schoolers, 2-3 and 4-5, as I remember. Then we had a bit of circle time/singing at the end. Go for it - if you have any questions post away, as hers was a resounding success!!

There was one set up for preschoolers in Surrey just before we left the area, wonder if it is still running. We went to a couple fo the trial sessions and ds then about 2.25 seemed to like it although not the most artistically motivated child. There were two activities on the go, related to a theme. So the kids would start making something , have a break with a related story and snack and then return to finish the first thing and maybe do a less structured activity in the meantime. Parents/carer stayed (you need as much help as you can unless you really limit numbers)as it was aimed at under5's.

Don't see why you need to be qualified as such but presumably you'd need to go through some sort of vetting process. A level should be plenty. rememeber the initial outlay on the basic materials could set you back a bit plus commintment ot rent the venue which you would need from those taking part as well. Can't remember how much the one we attended cost but it did seem quite pricey at the time compared to other local activities.

If you are not tied to school holidays perhaps you could do something for school age kids at half terms or in summer holidays.

Well on the basis that mine don't get an art grad at home or at school when they are painting I can't see that the lack of qualification matters a jot.

I think it is a great idea especially for the pre-schoolers.
Bear in mind though that some kids hating getting paint on their hands - so maybe run the theme thing but have different materials at different tables, e.g. play dough, sticky pictures, stencils, pastels etc.

I wish you'd change your name back too. Good idea. answers to your questions:

Yes, I would send my child if the main aim was to have somw fun rather than be taught art.
Ideally 3-4 yo when they're getting bored of playgroups but too young for school
So pm, after morning pre-school (but that's just what we had, am pre school)
Wouldn't bother me that you weren't qualified, just as long as you were enthusiastic and nice to children
Would rather leave child! Oh yes.
I'd make it 2 hours, less isn't long enough. maybe others will say not though.
ratios may be a prob with dropping off though.

Lovely idea, I used to go to one of these when v small, have remembered it all my life. The informality of it was key, as was the environment - huge wallpaper-pasting type tables & giant sheets of paper (think they got newsprint roll offcuts) - not something any child could get at home.

Think we all went from about 4, Saturday mornings for a couple of hours, no parents needed - one person (who knew what they were doing) in charge plus several uni students as jolly extras.

Would say though that it was fun more than education - not at all sure I ever learned anything about "art", just that if you swirled green & red together it made a better apple.

Meant to say it was from 1.30 - 3.00, different days depending on age of child. And yes, she had uni helpers too. GO!

PS she was a former barrister, so no formal art qualifications, just lots of brilliant ideas.

Yes I think dd would find it fun. I would expect to stay with her rather than drop off and pick up later (as she is only 18 months), but would like somebody to be the 'facilitator' as I am crap at helping her with arty things

Fridge magnets, candles using wax they could mould with their hands (mine needed help from me for that one!). I'm really, really sorry (and promise I don't work for them or know anyone that does) but the baker ross catalogue will be a source of inspiration.

Oooh, I'm getting quite exited now...thanks for all the great ideas, keep them coming

Where abouts are you? Don't mind if you don't want to say!

stupidgirl (I don't like it either, can we have a poll?), lots of museums and art galleries have sessions like this, some one-offs on a theme, some regular - why don't you visit a few, see how they organise them, what the adult-child ratios are and what sorts of activities they offer? They generally have websites with an events section, googling your local ones should come up with some links.

The ones I've looked at up here (eg Imperial War Museum North are mostly on Saturdays, but some have weekday ones for preschoolers. Most require an adult to accompany specific age groups, often 8 is the cutoff but sometimes it's 12. They often suggest wearing old clothes too, depending on the activity (most people doing culchah will dress up I suppose - your group wouldn't be like that but probably still important to mention it!)

there were crafty things going on at the Childhood Museum in Bethnal Green (making dollies out of oldfashioned pegs with wool for hair, fabric for clothes etc) - and they're doing a special Sindy day for Valentine's this saturday 12-4.

excellent idea stupidgirl do you live near me? .....I could drop them off in a bit.

I have heard people say that too about the mess

I would love to be able to drop off my 4 year old at an art class. He would enjoy it too, I think - he's very sociable.

But he doesn't 'do' art yet. He likes tipping up paint pots and painting himself, not the paper. He likes mixing paints together into messy brown sludge. He likes tearing drawing paper into strips. He uses ALL the glue in one go. Hee loves talking to strangers (that will mean you) and he will ask you endless questions - in other words he is captain chaos. I have seen the most child friendly, arty museum staff whither when faced with his cheerfully constant demands. I usually carry him off before too much damage is done. Some children are like this IME. So if you set up an art class, be prepared for children like my son, and ask parents to stay, or get helpers.

I think your idea is a good one stupidgirl, but could be D* hard work for you!

I LIKE MY NAME!!!!!

Again, thank you for all the input. I have so many ideas buzzing round my head now - I need to go away and try and get them straightened out.

There are a lot of legal kind of issues (and financial kind of issues) that need to be resolved. Does anyone know of an organisation that might be able to advise?

Also, what would you expect to pay for this kind of thing?

WWW, it certainly wouldn't be about teaching art. I have had so many times when I have been told that I'm not doing things the right way (the first time in school when I was 8 or 9, and it stuck with me!). To me art isn't about following rules, it;s about what's inside - expressing your own thoughts and feelings. I don't think you can really teach art, and neither do I think anyone 'can't' paint. It's just about finding your own way of expressing yourself. So, no, it wouldn't be about learning to paint, it would be about making a mess and having fun!

Tigermoth - your ds can't be as bad as my dd. She is only 2 and her favourite word is 'why?' I think most of the time she doesn't think about what she's saying, it's just a reflex reaction. Drives me mad, bless her

Oh, and for those who asked, I'm in West Sussex.

stupid girl. You have probably thought of this - but have a look at some of the other clubs - tumble tots and jo jingles - on the internet and see what they offer. When I joined Tumbletots within the registration fee included insurance.

I am not suggesting stealing ideas from them (worried about getting into trouble) but it might give you some ideas about regulations and prices you could charge and so on.

As this is a small business you might even be able to get help (and training) from the government. I think the initiative was called buiness enterprise or something. Will have a search on the internet. Great idea. I would send my ds.

stupidgirl, if you'd like, do the contact another talker thing, and I'd try and get you some useful info from our Blue Kangaroo lady. I'm sure she'd be more than happy to pass on her info/expertise/knowledge/helpfulness.

Have just mailed you, thanks carla