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Original poster

Dull but important question for people who know about electrics...... ***Is it LAW that a built in cooker/hob must be wired into an isolator type switch (ie not just a normal plug & socket scenario) ?****

83 replies

NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 11:35

The cooker at our (possibly) new house (not exchanged yet, supposed to complete Fri) is not working. I've located the switch, but it looks like a normal double socket (like the ones you plug the kettle/toaster/tv into). I can see the wire from the cooker that needs to be connected but it appears to be a normal 3-wire one, like plugs wire at home.

I thought built in appliances ran off a different voltage and so they couldn't just be plugged in by anyone, the had to be wired in by an electrician and given a certificate ?

OP posts:
hub2dee · 25/04/2006 14:41

Is it possible for you to turn up / have a nose / word with the sparky ? (maybe whilst he's there ?)

Best way to check it's being wired to its own dedicated circuit / fuse / wire rather than being a bodge job of some kind. Oven wire is bloody wide and stiff and can be really fairly tricky to work with, bend into position etc.

Quite possibly though, all this is done, and the oven connector box / switch / isolator is just hidden away somewhere you didn't look.

Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 14:47

I hope so, Hub. I'm concerned that the wire I saw was definitely the thinner, normal stuff.

OP posts:
Peachyclair · 25/04/2006 14:49

Yes you need to be able to physically able to isolate the supply, accorsing to the good site guide, which forms part of the regs. This is due to using water on the cooker, and the switch should be elevated away. The is linked to how far the unit is from a 'water closet'. However, Dh thinks some new cookers might have different set ups.

If you need any more info, DH can dig out the BS info. from the workshop.

Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 14:50

thank you peachy clair. I thin kI may have to get an independent sparky in to check it out...

OP posts:
Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 14:57

Hub, can't just show up and quiz the sparky. The developer will be there too and would go nuts. He's already had a toddler-esque tantrum today as a result of our solicitor requesting an itemised list of the repairs he made to the roof as a result of our survey report

OP posts:
hub2dee · 25/04/2006 14:57

A Neff \link{http://neff.co.uk/B1442.html\Series 3} pulls 3.7kw for example, that's around 15amps. That is too much for a 13amp socket. I wouldn't want that on my ring main, even if it wouldn't trip a 32amp fuse. And the regs are there to ensure subsequent occupiers are assured of the correct wiring etc. too...

Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 14:58

The one in the house looks very like that one....

OP posts:
hub2dee · 25/04/2006 15:00

more eyesrolling this end. Smile

hub2dee · 25/04/2006 15:00

They all look shiny and silver though. Wink

Laydees are sooo like magpies. Wink Grin

Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 15:01

The man is a moron, basically. Apparently he has done 5 or 6 houses prior to this one, but he is still making amateurish mistakes - the oven, the 'fitted wardrobes' in 2 of the bedrooms are too shallow for standard hangers so cannot really be described as such, etc etc

OP posts:
Peachyclair · 25/04/2006 15:01

According to hub's post and your saying it's like your cooker.... Dh says WRONG! could catch fire

(DH has a small electronics business and does hardwiring on carnival floats) Dh thinks 40 amp feed, not normal ring main.

Means nothing to me mind you!!!!!!

Peachyclair · 25/04/2006 15:02

(Oh and Dh went to mensd a light fitting in my parents that had never worked and found that the council electrician had wired it to.... sod all. they're not above the odd erm, mistake)

Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 15:02

Having had a look at the other ones on the neff site, i think it's the series 1 rather than the 3. According to the blurb, that one needs 2.8kw. Would that be ok ?

OP posts:
Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 15:03

BTW - Thanks for your help so far, guys, much appreciated Smile

OP posts:
hub2dee · 25/04/2006 15:17

In theory that wouldn't blow a 13amp fuse.... it could be plugged in and working without affecting the other appliances (fridge . freezer etc.)... BUT... THAT IS STILL NOT THE RIGHT WAY TO DO IT.

You might take a view that it'll work and leave it at that and get into your house... but you might have a canny buyer when you come to sell and you'd need to have it sorted.

The regs are there to protect you, but ultimately what you do is up to you.

Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 15:18

Indeed, I don;t want to pay £400k to live in a fire-hazard !

OP posts:
hub2dee · 25/04/2006 15:22

BTW - all this isn't rocket science... you can work out what's going on quite easily...

(merryberry can correct !)

If it says 2.8kw that means 2800 Watts. (A lightbulb is typically 60 - 100W). You mains runs around 240V, so this oven is 'pulling' 2800/240 or 11.7 amps.

The highest fuse you can get for an ordinary plug is 13 amps.

I am not sure if double sockets are typically rated at 13 or 26... but anyway...

Your ring main fuse (which serves all the sockets downstairs usually) is 32 amps... so, you can see why putting something which pulls close to 12 amps might not be very sensible considering one day you might want to turn on your tumble dryer or a dishwasher or a washing machine or your kettle all at once IYSIMW !

Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 15:23

Yikes, I see your point.

OP posts:
hub2dee · 25/04/2006 15:24

That's why the proper way to do it is to give it a dedicated fuse, a dedicated (thick) wire etc.

Same with an electric shower. Those can be 11KW easy !

It's a question of whether your developer has specced the kitchen to regs and whether the sparky has installed to regs..

Original poster
NomDePlume · 25/04/2006 15:25

The shower is not electric , one less thing to worry about !

OP posts:
hub2dee · 25/04/2006 15:53

Whatever the situation, I hope it will be sorted and you move into your lovely place ASAP. Smile

Gingerbear · 25/04/2006 16:00

Sorry for not getting back to you NDP (am at work)

\link{http://www.lbwf.gov.uk/index/environment/environment-building-control/environment-building-control-information-guide/bc-domestic-elect-install.htm\this might help re requirement for certificates}

manitz · 25/04/2006 16:01

part p of the building regs requires that any electrical work in any wet area (kitchen, bathroom, outside etc) should be certificated. presume your solicitor has already got proper certification from that?

get them to insert that all electrics need to comply with part p (or a cover all that all building work is covered by building regs and if not, will be rectified after exchange) (I'm not a solicitor btw but makes sense to me!)

here is building regs explan booklet www.odpm.gov.uk/index.asp?id=1131116 i know there is a part p one but dd is screaming so look around. prob doesn't cover in depth but there are 8 reg bodies of part p (one is elecsa) who have answered my queries when I've rung up so give them a call.

Gingerbear · 25/04/2006 16:02

ring Building Control dept at your local council and ask them?

manitz · 25/04/2006 16:13

hi sorry last post was accompanied by screaming so diff to concentrate, realise you already knew of part p. db is a certified electrician - in odpm language a 'competent person' ha! (whereas i know nothing). however he is fitting my kitchen as we speak and the advice you have been given here is right afaik.

know its difficult to hold off but maybe you shoudl and you might get a bit knocked off? seller will be as keen as you to exchange? we had to search high and low for certs for work we had done for our buyers and i think they were right to push for them.