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Original poster

Churches and church schools

15 replies

mogwai · 31/03/2006 17:57

just spent another hour at the mums and toddlers group run by our local church, which has a primary school attached. I'm mildly religious and this is the church we were married in (and baby will be christened in). I really have some questions about this that need answering!

The school is the only one in our village and is within walking distance of our house. It also has very good results (the best in the town). The idea of attending a local school appeals to me, the results are secondary really.

The problem is, I really don't enjoy going to the toddler group. The other mothers just aren't my sort of people IYSWIM and I'm dubious about singing lots of religious songs to small children (including one which includes crucifiction and the vicar pretending to be nailed to the cross as one of the actions in the rhyme).

Also, the church are really laying it on thick about money. It seems that putting money in the collection tin is no longer appropriate and we are now being asked to set up direct debits from our bank accounts "so that you don't even know you ever had that money" as the vicar put it today. Apparently, some parishioners who do this are already being told they aren't giving enough.

Is this normal practice for churches nowadays? Is it worth going through all this for the next three years just to get into the local primary school?

Opinions please!

OP posts:

Original poster

mogwai · 31/03/2006 17:59

by the way, the school is oversubscribed and selection is by attendance at church and by proximity to the school. We live very close.

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Blu · 31/03/2006 18:00

Mogwai, since it is the only school in your village, do they apply religious criteria as part of the admissions criteria? Ask for an admissions form and copy of the admissions criteria. There might be no religious criteria at all.

Many village schools are CoE foundation schools, but admit all children living in the village. Is the school over-subscribed? Does it take church-going children from outside the village?

Blu · 31/03/2006 18:01

Sorry, x posted.

Blu · 31/03/2006 18:02

How far away is the next nearest non-faith school?

MrsBadger · 31/03/2006 18:03

No advice as such, but a couple of questions:

Is getting onto the primary school conditional upon going faithfully () to the toddler group? Could the school refuse DS a place even though it's the only school in the village? If not (and I suspect not), quit the toddler group and do something more fun.

Tougher - is the ethos of the toddler group an indicator of the school's ethos? Will it get any better or will it be more of the same - or even worse? If the latter, would the school really be right for you after all, and worth the journey to a more laid-back school?

hope I haven't confused you even more...

Original poster

mogwai · 31/03/2006 18:03

there's one in the next village (about 2 miles) but would obviously be a car ride

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donnie · 31/03/2006 18:04

sounds a bit odd to me, and I speak as a practising C of E-er!the idea of the vicar play acting being nailed to the cross is bizarre ( and also a bit funny IMO)but I guess he doesn't mean any harm.
Re the money thing: I am not sure how common the direct debit path is, we use the envelopes becuiase the tax can be claimed back on anything inside, but I don't think you should be coerced into giving money - it should be voluntary.Then again, if you want your child to benefit from the school, it follows that you should want to support the church it is attached to.
Re the religioue songs - children attending the school will inevitably be learning/singign such songs - what is your objection exactly? if it is the gestures maybe you could have a quiet word woth the vicar?

Original poster

mogwai · 31/03/2006 18:06

our neighbour's children attend the school but the people nextdoor to them didn't get their son in because they hadn't attended the church.

He attends the school 2 miles away, which is handy for his mum anyway because she works opposite his school.

I've heard that the school regularly ask for donations from parents. Some parents are very wealthy, and their huge donations are read out in school assembly.

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MrsBadger · 31/03/2006 18:07

cross posted with everyone, but if you are attending church, I don't see why you have to go to toddler group there too if you don't want to.
Another activity whose time clashes (tumble tots? water babies? seeing your mum?) has 'oh, what a shame, I can't make Thursdays any more' potential.

Original poster

mogwai · 31/03/2006 18:07

I don't mind supporting the church at all, but this sort of pressure really puts me off

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Original poster

mogwai · 31/03/2006 18:10

we go to church infrequently (once a month if that). It's a very "high" church and lots of the local ladies turn up in their best hats. I find it soul destroying, which is why I opted for the toddler group instead.

And now I'm having a big rethink!

As I said, I just want her to be able to attend the village school, regardless of results or whether it's a church school

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Blu · 31/03/2006 18:19

"Then again, if you want your child to benefit from the school, it follows that you should want to support the church it is attached to. "

Moot point when this is the only school in the village, and presumably funded by the LEA?

I understand your strong desire for your child to attend the local school Mogwai, but this reading out of donations sounds outrgaeous!

LOL at the vicar and his crucifixion re-construction.

Bugsy2 · 31/03/2006 18:24

Just don't be pressurised. It is a personal decision to donate to a Church & you are free to politely decline. It's not as though the Vicar can actually do anything about it!
Seems a bit weird to have a toddlers group with people being nailed to the cross. I'd feel uncomfortable with that! Bit OTT really for toddlers & young children.

mrsdarcy · 31/03/2006 19:21

I used to play crucufixtion when I was little but I am RC - didn't realise Anglicans did it too . I think it's rather...um...overenthusiastic of the vicar to be doing it.

It might be worth checking with the school about how heavily subscribed they are. Lots of schools round our way are finding their numbers are falling - here it's a combination of the falling birthrate, and rising house prices making it difficult for young families to buy in the area.

Is there another parish you would prefer to attend church in? Depending on the way the admissions policy is worded, you may be ok if you live in the "right" parish but get your "attendance badge" from any church.

Original poster

mogwai · 31/03/2006 19:44

I went on the school website earlier this evening but there's no mention of their admission policy. I do know it's church attendance, but not which church. Think the vicar would be very offended if we started attending elsewhere but it's certainly a thought... I hadn't considered it.

I get the impression that having a standing order donation to the church will stand us in good stead for getting a place, which is why I am feeling some pressure. I think the headteacher takes considerable advice from the vicar on selection!

The school is "aided". What does that actually mean?

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