Any certified Bookkeepers on here?

[DaddyCool]

Didn't want to start this in legal/money matters as I didn't think it would attract enough attention.

I'm a CIMA looking to do a semi career change. Bookkeeping is still in the game but a completely different kettle of fish.

I'm looking for more home based, work on my own initiative work and I've got the backing of a good chartered qualification as back up as not to look like a total hack to prospective clients.

I'm looking at completing the 'certified bookkeepers' qualification on line to top up my training.

anyone a bookkeeper? do you know:

1. what business is like? (demand)
2. length of course?
3. potential pitfalls other than getting no business!?

'

(wtf?)

Why would you need to retrain if you are CIMA qualified ? Surely you can do debits and credits in your sleep.

I am a chartered accountant working in small provincial general practice.

One possibility for developing a business is for you get together a cv/business services menu and send details of services you can offer and your prices to various accountancy firms who may need to get put a bookkeeper in touch with a client.

Firms may also want to call on you during their busy times.

HOWEVER, the big thing you need to do is get reliable business recommendations of the quality of your work. You may have to work very hard and cheaply to establish yourself and get such recommendations but crap "bookkeepers" are the bane of our life and we have no hesitation in keeping them away from our clients by saying that we think they are not up to the job.
On the other hand if a client is growing to the extent that they are starting to need a bookkeeper instead of doing the work themselves we will unashamedly push for good bookkeepers we know to get the job as it makes our life easier and keeps accountancy fees down which makes our clients happy.

You may need to invest in computerised bookkeeping software and training if you are not familiar with it (SAGE is v good and quite widely used) but until you are experienced with it steer clear as it will damage your reputation to pass youself off as being able to use it when you can't.

Sage payroll software and training if necessary would enable you to offer an outside payroll service.

The beauty of computerised bookkeeping records is that back-ups can be e-mailed to you to work on and you can e-mail details back to clients to upload.

Hope this helps

Sorry, was just testing out name change earlier

AA - Excellent. I want to do the certified bookkeepers course because:

1. Yes, CIMA is a strong qualication but it ain't bookkeeping. bookkeeping is completely different kettle of fish and you've got to know your stuff if you're going to be a good bookkeeper.

2. This may just be professional arrogance but I'm assuming the cert bookkeepers course is pretty easy peasy and a short process from beginning to end so I would like it on my business card so I don't have to explain what the hell CIMA is and why I'm qualified enough to do someones personal books without landing them in the poo.

I'm familiar with sage so thats good but whatever software package, I would familarise myself pretty quickly with it.

I'm thinking of this moves because (and you've confirmed it) there are many crap bookkeepers out there who don't know what they are doing charging out ridiculous rates because they've taken some on line course and suddenly think they are accountants.

What I want is to charge out ridiculous rates () but actually do a good job and build up a really good rep.

Aah but AA - accountancy qualifications are very different and can be very sector specific. I'm CIPFA qualified and work in local government - not had any private sector experience. Accountants might have studied a manner of stuff - I did Corporation tax etc in my studies - when am I ever going to use that knowledge?

It may be that DC doesn't have experience of bookeeping as such as it depends on his work experience doesn't it? I personally think it wise to be asking the opinion of people who actually do bookeeping.

snap... kinda. but AA's advice is very helpful.

to be a good bookkeepers I've got to know all the tax ins/outs, loopholes and general wizardry that goes along with dealing with a soul trader's accounts.

I'm currently a corporate FC but I know bugger all about private bookkeeping.

And your recommendation to send details to local accountancy firms is excellent. didn't even think of that. I was just going to advertise heavily and start trying to network (AKA creeping up to old friends and aquaintances)

Why would anyone leave the cut and thrust, high faloutin' world of corporate finance?

I love your professional arrogance DaddyCool and see your gameplan now.I personally think the same way about a bookkeeping course and it would be a good refresher anyway.

CIMA is I believe Chartered Institute of Management Accountants and I think would have been relevent to general practice and bookkeeping in the early days of study)

CIPFA can be very different I understand depending which options you take.

Business is very good for some of our 'recommended' bookkeepers and most of them visit clients sometimes but mostly work from home fitting it in around family commitments.

Main pitfall would be hassle in getting paid.
If you take on a regular clients doing more or less the same thing each month, agree a monthly fee and get them to pay by monthly standing order.
Get clients to commit to have information ready for you by deadlines as you will need to schedule your workload to maximise the value of the hours you work. There's only so many VAT returns you can do last minute each month end and it's really frustrating to be burning the midnight oil to meet deadlines when you had free time with childcare arranged earlier in the month that was wasted because clients didn't have stuff ready for you as agreed!

... because it blows and I'm sick and tired of answering to stupid people... and providing worthless reports which don't get looked at... and being told at 4:59 pm that the MD wants a complete re-hash of what i've just spent two weeks working on and he needs it tonight... and being told that even though I can do 95% of my job at home, I still need to come into the miserable grey office.

Naive question alert...Why would you meet deadlines if it's the client's fault AA?

If you state where you are based maybe someone can help you out with what demand is like in that area.

Plus length of course details would be useful from any bookkeepers out there or have I scared them all off with my comments on how I am in trying to stop crap bookkeepers having anything more than a fleeting acaquaintance with my clients.

Because you are in a service industry and it is expected just as much as being told by your boss, at about 3.30pm that he "needs xyz report on his desk next morning" when you both know that this will take at least 6 hours of work.

If you want to build up a good reputation it helps to be flexible at first and only to take a "tough, you've left it too late" line after repeated lateness. Plus you could always charge a premium for "overtime" rates if client has caused the delay repeatedly.

The financial penalties to a small business for more than one late VAT return can be crippling.

I have a many clients who have been repeatedly chased for their tax return information and are only now bringing it in to be processed by the end of the month.

I will lose a good few of them if I say tough I'm not going to help you avoid the £100 late filing penalty.

We pick up a couple of extra clients each year in January as their existing accountants have told them this. Advertising for clients cost serious money and we get them for free plus we make them pay up front before we even start the work, having agreed the fee which includes a small premium for being last minute.

Warwickshire.

You have to meet deadlines in accountancy Tinker, no matter what area you work in. Even if its someones elses fault, even if they are asking you to do a 6 hour job in 1 hour, even if you are sick ! I can't have a sicky any more. I called in sick on Monday and spent all day working from home.

The whole job is about deadlines, not matter what I get into. Bookkeeping will still have deadlines but deadlines that are within my control.

My DW struggles with the deadline concept greatly and it really gets her down.

Thanks for answer.

Understand teh deadlines issue, was teh penalties bit I was thinking off, really.

ok, i'm all excited now as only an accountant can be!

I was looking into the Institute of Certified Bookkeepers. Looks like the only one.

Any recommendations AA?

Sorry - just laughing at "soul trader"

You planning on being the Devil then Daddy Cool? For that you'd need to work at the Inland Revenue, surely?

Tbh I really don't look at the letters after the bookkeepers name unless considering reporting them to an institute of some sort for really bad practice, it all comes down to "do they do a good job and meet deadlines"

P.S. an acquaintance in the accountancy business was instrumental in a theft/false accounting case where the bookkeeper was found guilty nad sent to prison.

Anyway, haven't read any of last week's Accountancy Age this lunchtime and must now get back to work.

oops . Sole Trader. Good thing NDP isn't around! She'd kick my ass for that one.

I've also got a bad habit for spelling sugar - 'suger'

[Looks over specs in school-marmish manner at DC]

damn! how does she do that!!?