LEGAL MINDS WANTED running a red light - the loop hole

[dottyparker]

Moral judgements aside(or on another thread) i dont want to own up to it and DH will take the rap.

however i am not a legal mind but have been doing some research on legalities and think there is a loophole discovered very recently

now forgive me, i am a bit of a jumble. I think i understand the information but am not sure

the way i understand it is this
the NIP asks for a named driver - which you have to give details of or you are in BIG trouble.

so you give the details of the driver but dont sign the form

if you dont sign the form - it cannot go to court
and the cps will not accept it
and you get away with it

please legal beavers opinions needed urgently if you could explain in laymans terms if i am right , rather than a legal link ( which i have probably been to, but which i am unlikely to understand)

many thanks

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There have been several footballers who got off like this on speeding tickets - all with the same lawyer I think - however when it was last featured in the press I got the impression the loophole was going to be closed sharpish.

I think it takes a while for a legal loophole to be changed though! Could be wrong.

The case of the footballer was, I believe, that his agent filled in the form in the footballer's name and didn't get him to sign it. I'm not sure of the technicalities of it TBH. The more traditional one is to claim that you don't know who out of you and DH was driving.

I'll just share Croydon Council's current road safety slogan with you "Red light jumpers make blood red bumpers". Superb! I guess it's someone's job to come up with these.

If you do not sign the form it cannot be accepted. But then they will probably just send out another one. That case was exceptional because it got to court before they realised that the form had not been signed, so it was too late to do anything about it.
What you say is that a friend borrowed the car, but you can't remember which friend. Speed cameras only pick up the registration, they can't make out the driver. If it cannot be proved who was driving the car, then the case cannot go to court. But the police will make your life hell and probably get you for something else.

If you do say someone else was driving when it was you, it would be perverting the course of justice. Rather more serious than accepting a speeding fine or one for jumping a red light (not sure which you're asking about).

but the law states that i must name a driver ( fair enough) but the law doesnt state i must sign the form - they can ask all they want but i have no legal duty to sign the form

without the signature the CPS cannot accept it - but the police cannot legally force me to sign

this is how i see it

but the law states that i must name a driver ( fair enough) but the law doesnt state i must sign the form - they can ask all they want but i have no legal duty to sign the form

without the signature the CPS cannot accept it - but the police cannot legally force me to sign

this is how i see it

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The penalty is the same as for a speeding offence: a £60 fixed penalty and 3 penalty points.

Depends how many points are on there already, it could mean her losing her car and perhaps she is dependant on it for work? Everyone has jumped a red light at some time in their lives, you know, when it's just changing from amber to red and you think you can make it? Well it's just the same, it's still light-jumping. So before we all clamber down DP's throat perhaps we should take a look at our own driving records. Who wouldn't try to find a way out of it if they could? Don't tell me that if you spotted a loophole you wouldn't go for it.

DP, send the unsigned form back and see what happens. You can always say you forgot to sign it. However it really might be more trouble than it's worth, you know how the police operate, they'd target you if you tried it on. Have you anyone who'd be willing to take the points on for you?

Whilst looking up the fine I came across this. It refers to speeding but the principle is the same for red light cameras.

"If a safety camera ever flashes you, you shouldn?t feel that you have been 'unlucky' - nor should you feel annoyed. What you should accept is the fact that you have exceeded a speed limit that has been put in place for a good reason. The speed limit of a road reflects the potential dangers for that road.

If you do get flashed, remember:

• You have broken a speed limit, which is in place to protect you and other road users.
• The camera that flashed you is there because a significant number of people have been killed or seriously injured in that area.
• What if you either refuse to identify the driver or simply ignore the notice? Failure to provide information on the notice attracts a fixed penalty of 5 points and a fine of £120. The courts also have the discretionary power to disqualify the driver and increase the fine up to £1000. "

Rhubarb, if these 3 points are enough to disqualify the driver then they shouldn't be on the road. Yes, everyone's exceeded the speed limit or jumped a reddish light in their time but, generally speaking, not enough to lose their license and generally I'd like to think they learnt not to do it again.

cant belive rhurbard asked if anyone could take on the points. i have a strange sense of reading something similar to this recently.
i'm only learning to drive, but if i got flashed by a speed camera or caught jumping a light, then i'd face it and the consequences it carries. myself and my kids were almost knocked down the other week at a crossing, as some stupid idiot jumped a red light which had been red for ages, the little green man wasnt even at flashing point.

cant belive rhurbard asked if anyone could take on the points. i have a strange sense of reading something similar to this recently.
i'm only learning to drive, but if i got flashed by a speed camera or caught jumping a light, then i'd face it and the consequences it carries. myself and my kids were almost knocked down the other week at a crossing, as some stupid idiot jumped a red light which had been red for ages, the little green man wasnt even at flashing point.

oops. impatient me.

I thought DP said her dh would take the rap so presume he can afford the 3 points on his licence. Personally, I never do anything wrong when driving but I do cause accidents when the sparkle of my halo blinds other road users. DP I think you are brave to post this question and hope you have your bullet proof vest on or at least a finger jabbing proof one!! Does you dh know he's taking the rap?

The penalty for not stopping at a red light depends on how fast the car was travelling, how long the light had been red, and how far past the light the driver stopped (if at all). It can vary from a fixed fine and points to disqualification. When dh had not long passed his test he went through a red light by mistake, and was flashed. We went along to the police station to have a look at the photo, and was given all this info then. He got points and a fine, and has been much more careful ever since.

i never said it wasnt my fault - in fact i good as said it was

dadslib i have nothing to hide but personal details not pertinant to the original question asked

thanks for the lecture ( almost) everyone i obviously never thought of everything you all had to say. thanks for hitching a ride on this thread asking for legal advise - to voice your personal opinions on whether or not i should or should not do this

where if everyone wants things to be right - i obviously should not do this. this isnt what i was asking.

i take it no one knows conclusivley

KS, i am a learner driver, i go at the speed limit, keep up with traffic etc, and i still get the idiots cutting me up, getting impatient, being rude and all the rest. fortunatly i have a huuuge driver instructor, if anyone actually wants to have a go, i know he'll take care of them lol.

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Most of these stories about people exploiting loopholes are urban myths. I'm with Soupy. A motoring offence is not a criminal offence, but lying on a form or - if it got to it, in court - is. Take the consequences and learn from what's happened.