Operation Christmas Child - secular alternative?

[GeorginaA]

I'm sure this topic has been done last year, but I couldn't remember the outcome, searched and couldn't find it.

So, ds1 comes home with the Operation Christmas Child leaflets from school. I like the principle, and I think it would be good for him to focus on giving a bit more rather than receiving. However, I really dislike them being used as a vehicle for proselytising young children. Actually, dislike is an understatement - I've discovered that I really do feel quite strongly about it after looking at \link{http://www.samaritanspurse.org/their website} in more depth.

So anyway, if I refuse to do one (a) will ds1 be very left out at school for not having done one, or is it only a minority of parents that end up doing it anyway and (b) is there a secular equivalent shoebox scheme without all the literature and "ministering" to go alongside...

i don't think they are proselytising anyone. at the end of the day it is christian charities or organisations that run them... that doesn't mean they are trying to convert them

they deliver much-needed parcels to adults and children of ALL faiths. Many of the lorries that take them over are done by volunteers who aren't preaching to anyone while they are out there

I am not Christian but at the end of the day you're giving incredibly poor children and adults things they desperately need... I don't see the problem

I agree. If it is Christian charities who organise this, you can hardly complain that they might be delivering a Christian message. Even if you don't believe in Christ, many of the children who receive much appreciated gifts do (although, given their situations, they might be forgiven for wondering where they come in His great plan).

I'm not aware that any Christian message is given in a particularly forceful way and, at the end of the day, you are given a huge amount of pleasure to some desperately sad children.

I dislike the idea of christian literature given alongside of the gifts and the children listening to a sermon (or sunday school equivalent) just to get a few nice items. I don't take my own children to church and vehemently disagree with what I consider "brainwashing" at an age when children are not old enough to make up their own minds. I particularly loathe the idea of this happening in predominantly muslim countries as a way of proselytising to them.

sits back and puts her flame-retardant jacket on

Well I did warn you I felt strongly

sigh ... that's what I'm asking - are there any NON-CHRISTIAN ORGANISATIONS THAT DO A SIMILAR THING?????!!!!!!

I didn't realise it was such a strongly evangelical missionary organisation, as it clearly is

so although i see nothing wrong with using Christmas as a time to broadcast a Christian message I think I do see why we could be cynical about this organisation

FGS Georgina. Grow up.
It coincides with CHRISTMAS or hadn't you noticed!!!!!?????

I don't know of an alternative GeorginaA but FWIW I do agree with what you are saying. A friend at work sent his 5 yo dd to a summer school and by Thursday of the first week she was saying "daddy, there is only one love and that is God". Chuffed, he was not! Needless to say, she didn't go on Friday...!

I'm with georgina. I would like DS to take part in sending gifts to children who have nothing, but as a gift. Not as a way for an organisation to encourage people to accept their missionary aims.

Do it then

I think this was asked last year and I'm pretty sure that there isn't a non-Christian organisation doing anything like this.

My dd did this last year and there was no proselytising and no Bible thumping - we were given a leaflet and that was that. She was in a pre-school, so it may have been handled slightly differently, but I certainly didn't feel that dd was being preached at.

I'm pretty sure that her new school will be doing this too, and for me the important thing isn't who is organising it, it's the fact that they are giving something to those who have nothing. Even if we get the leaflets and the sermons, I can always explain to my dd that this is what these people believe, and although we don't believe the same thing, they're doing something good, and it's something that we can all join in with, regardless of what faith we have or what we believe.

I'd rather do something like this through a Christian organisation than not be able to do it at all.

If you read the leaflet,they ask you not to enclose gifts on a religious theme.

I agree Georgina, I find that really difficult. I wouldn't want my gifts to be a bribe for conversion.

from GA's link:

Kondaiah had never celebrated Christmas before. The Hindu boy lives in Andhra Pradesh, a state in southeast India with a population that is less than 2 percent Christian.

When he was invited to a nearby church for an Operation Christmas Child distribution, Kondaiah went there mostly out of curiosity. But he had a great time and was thrilled with the wonderful gifts. After church workers encouraged him to come back for a 10-week Bible study course, he faithfully attended every session.

?I took the lesson books home and finished the assignments,? Kondaiah said. ?Then my parents and 15-year-old elder brother also started reading those books and asking me questions.?

His family obtained a Bible, and read and discussed the Scriptures together for over a month.

?To my surprise, now all of my family has come to know Jesus Christ,? he said.

Presumably you don't celebrate Christmas then.

The Samaritan's Purse isn't the only organisation who does this, although the others are also Christian. I honestly don't think that pushing their faith at others lies behind the shoe box scheme. It is entirely possible that it is merely their Christian faith which spurs them to doing an act of kindness at a time which has great meaning to them.

I think one of the bones of contention is that OperationChristmas Child has been adopted in a wide range of schools but the gifters do not have the information given them regarding the powerful/Victorian style missionary zeal of the organisation distributing gifts that occurs at the giftee end

the notice that comes back from school tends to be IME fill a box to give a gift to children who have so little when we have so much but not the brimstone and treacle version of Christianity which is delivered with the gift

And if you read their website they make it very clear they are an evangelical organisation, their tagline is "leading boys and girls to a faith in Christ" and it states that "Along with shoe box gifts, millions of children are given Gospel booklets in their own language."

Honestly, I really didn't expect to be attacked for not wanting to be involved in a religion I don't believe in. Christmas isn't just for Christians... pagans had it first, they just renamed it for their own ends :P

oh dear, it gets worse:

'The New York Times caught Samaritan's Purse holding evangelising sessions before releasing US government paid temporary homes to homeless victims of the earthquake in El Salvador in 2001. '

'Franklin Graham has refused to apologise for calling Islam "a very wicked and evil religion" and for his equally hateful pronouncements on other beliefs - Hindus as being "bound by Satan's power".'

Charity commission currently investigating them

leaving aside the inaccurate assertion that Christmas is a solely Christian festival I looked into this last year and at that time only Christian charities were doing this.
I so think it is wonderful work FWIW, but no there is no secular alternative.

Oooh I'm all for it.
The more Christians the better.

Endangered species.

it isn't any kind of bribe. no-one is FORCED to convert to christianity to receive a box. they are invited along to church but they don't have to go!

I have seen them handing the boxes out from the back of lorries... no sermons involved!

for goodness sake... they are taking things to people who need them... who cares who takes them?

Arguably sweets,games and toothbrushes aren't essentials in any case.

www.internationalaidtrust.org.uk/

is still christian but seems normal

Thank you philippat, that looks a lot better

what about this one GA? sounds much more up your street:

www.21stcenturychild.org/pages/shoebox_appeal.htm

Ooo... yes that does look better, thanks

I'vew just had the request back from ds school and it doesn't mention the distributing organisation at all except to say make a cheque out to samariatn's purse, and there is no information from them except the title Operation Christmas Child

It just says

This year we want ot give thousands of children a Christmas they will never forget. We want to share the excitment of waking up and having Christmas presents wrapped and ready to open. For many children in poverty a present at Christmas is something that they dream of and we want to make that dream come true with Operation Christmas Child.

A simple task, all you need is a box and some presents!

The rest is instructions what to put in or not and how to wrap it.

Now, if you look at the website which I wouldn't normally do in response to this I find that it is a lot different from my initial perception

Why do they omit the evangleical context from the initial approach? I think families and children at both givers and receivers are exploited to some extent.

I cynically believe that the uptake would be less if they made clear their evangleical mission as many people including Christians do not support evangelical missions undertaken like this whether in the UK or overseas.