Can they charge me for the 30h when I’m on holiday?

[MotherOfCrocodiles]

DD (4) attends a private nursery and receives the 30h funding.

We are taking a 9 week trip to my husband’s home country in the middle of this term. We will continue paying for our nursery place as we need it when we return.

I have been told by the childcare admin (not our nursery but a central admin for multiple nurseries) that we will have to pay for the funded hours during our trip, so it will actually cost us more when DC is not attending.

I could sort of understand that they can’t claim this from the government if the child is not attending. But then live learned on here that nurseries claim for them whole term and the funding wouldn’t be transferred in the middle of term even if we moved to another nursery in the uk.

i checked how this works in our county and the nursery will already have received 60% or for being based on a projection of who is attending; the rest is based on who is attending on headcount day. DD will be on roll on headcount day although not actually in nursery.

does anyone know which is right? I don’t want to be compensating’ the nursery for the government funding if they are in fact in receipt of the funding.

Just to add we will be working remotely while away so still eligible; I will be back and forth a bit. DC will attend a nursery in DH country which we are paying for separately

A holiday shouldn’t affect funding as it’s a temporary short absence.

The government keep changing the goal posts around funding though…

Sorry read it as a week not 9 weeks. That is a long term absence and probably will change things.

Some LAs do not allow us to claim of a child is away for an extended holiday, so yes you would need to pay to retain a space at my setting.

From a random council - looks like the nursery is obliged to inform the funder:

What if a child leaves / does not attend for the funded hours as agreed?

For absence or sporadic attendance; providers are not required to inform the council of absence (unless there is a welfare concern) until a child has reached 20 full days of absence (whether over consecutive or sporadic days), or 30%* absence within a single term.

www.staffordshire.gov.uk/Children-and-early-years/Childcare-providers-and-professionals/fundedplaces/Provider-FAQ/FAQ025.aspx

Yes they can charge you.
9 weeks is not classed as a holiday when it comes to the funding.

If you want the nursery place to stay open for 9 weeks then you will have to pay for it as funding ie government money, public money, will not pay for a place you’re not using.

If you are back and forth a bit and not going until the middle of this term, could you check your local thresholds with the nursery and bring DD back with you? So that she attends for sufficient days to stay above the thresholds?

Of course, flights etc might cost more than covering the funding for a few weeks, so this may be uneconomic.

If you're away for 9 weeks, they won't be allowed to keep the funding. It's paid in advance as an estimate but confirmed at the end if term and adjustments added or deducted.

9 weeks is more than a holiday it's a temporary move.

So basically you think the taxpayer should pay to keep your nursery place open while you go on a long holiday?

Thanks- it looks like it varies by county so maybe we will just wait and see what happens. The reason I’m asking is that (from other threads) it seems that if you leave a nursery in the middle of term it is normal that they retain your funding, meaning you can’t use your funded hours at your new nursery. So I think it is actually quite common that nurseries claim the money for children who are not attending.

As I said I can see the point that the government might not pay when children don’t attend, but if they are in fact paying, I don’t want to pay too!

That's if the child is present on headcount day. You've said your dd won't be.

"So I think it is actually quite common that nurseries claim the money for children who are not attending."

The two situations aren't the same. If a child moves to another nursery then the child is still in a UK nursery so is entitled to the government funding. The LA in some areas allows nurseries to have an 'admin cut off' not to transfer the funding but no-one is claiming hours for a child that isn't in nursery.

Rather than waiting to see what happens, why not contact your own county to understand the position, then you can counter the nursery if it is different to what they told you - if, say, your LA allows 2 weeks of grace and the nursery is allowing none.

Update- thanks to some info on this thread I finally managed to find our LA policy on this and it seems the threshold is 20 school days (annoyingly DD will miss 23!). However, I will ask if we can use her funded hours for more hours per week whilst we are there, as they are currently “stretched” over 52 weeks per year.

No it has be an equal amount each week across the year.

Just give notice when you leave or pay? Stop trying to fiddle the nursery in to giving you 9 weeks off.

The county where I work has just allowed us to claim funding for a child who will be away for just over 2 months. We have been completely up front with them about the absence.

it would be worth you speaking to the Local Authority funding team for your area.

if the nursery is not able to claim funding, and you want the space to be kept open for you, then it’s right for them to charge you.

Interesting, I wasn't aware this could be an issue. We are planning to take an extended holiday to my husbands home country whilst on maternity leave to introduce the new baby.

No, it doesn’t. It can be term time only at 30h a week (this is the default) or be stretched to something like 22h a week over 52 weeks a year.

It varies by council but the maximum allowed holiday is 3 weeks here, after that it’s reported to the council and the nursery can take them off the role though that’s up to them if private

That's exactly what I said. She's talking about using the extra hours she's missing whilst away, during the few weeks that the child will be there. So uneven claims each week.

IMO, she meant switching to term time only hours, not stretched hours. So for the half of the upcoming term that DD is there, she will get the full 30h a week instead of 22h. Op will have to pay for the weeks she is not there and into the holidays, but overall, DD will be present for more of the funded hours in this arrangement.

The nursery won't be able to claim 9 weeks of funding if your child is not present. In my LA I think it's 4 weeks. If the nursery gets audited and the LA discover they've claimed for 9 weeks they will have to pay the money back. I can see why they are charging you if you expect the place to still be available for your child after your 9 week holiday.

As for the funding not being able to be transferred mid term, that is to protect a setting from losing income if multiple children leave mid term as funding is allocated termly so they will be unlikely to sign up replacement funded children mid term. This is completely different to child absences.