Toilet issues

[Mrsmch123]

My 3.5 year old has been toilet trained since September. Initially there was no issues with this but since going back after Xmas he keeps wetting himself at nursery.
I spoke to them around a month ago about it and they said they would prompt him to the bathroom.
For the last two weeks he's been wet 2 out of the three days.
I don't know if I'm being unreasonable as my husband thinks I am but I'm getting really annoyed at them because they clearly are not prompting him and it's always when we are picking him up they realise he's wet and then they change him.
My husband is of the opinion that they can watch/check that 30 kids are dry.
My opinion is that they have a duty of care and they know it's a issue and they only seem to check him as we are coming to pick him up meaning he's been sitting in pee for Godknows how long!
He's never peed himself at home so there is no medical reason.

What's other's opinions?

He's not toilet trained if he only goes when told and wets himself if he's not. They've got dozens of children to look after. Yes it's nice of they remember but really after 6 months he should be taking himself.

He’s not toilet trained. He’s still learning.

Realistically, if he’s wetting himself, not choosing to take up prompts and not telling them he’s wet then it’s likely to take time to notice. Particularly during some activities and some clothing patterns.

It would be inappropriate for them to be checking the crotch of every child every 15 minutes.

Work with them on a plan. It might be that he’s saying he’s ok when prompted and you decide to move to a model of ‘going and trying’ every hour or so. Aka you have to stop the fun stuff and go to the toilet regardless of whether you say you need.
Prompting and going are two different things.

He goes to the toilet unprompted at home. At nursery he was asking them to go to the toilet when he needed to until the Xmas break.

The whole point about being toilet trained is that a child can recognise when they need the toilet, can hold their wee / poo for a while and can get themselves undressed in time to use the toilet.
If the staff need to prompt a child to use the toilet, they’re not fully trained. That being said, at the start of term (or whenever our children start in our school nursery, which is the day they turn 3) we regularly tell children to go for a wee throughout the session. We have 3 staff for 26 children. Two staff have to change a child, which leaves the rest of the children not supervised according to regs.

I wouldn't exactly say it's their fault they're missing he's wet himself.
There's a lot of children to a small number of adults.

Instead of promoting he probably needs took. I'd speak to the nursery to come up with a plan.

I dont believe they are prompting him as he would go. They never say we asked and he said no. He was wet from his socks to half way up his T-shirt, it was very obvious.

Politely - what you think about his response to prompts isn’t particularly relevant.

You say there’s no issues at home so his behaviour is obviously different at nursery. One of my daughter’s friends is similar. Fine at home, regularly wet at nursery, and I’ve seen the ‘no I’m fine’ response to prompts at nursery then wet ten minutes later. Nursery’s generally cause no fuss once they do notice wet (much less than a parent) and have more exciting stuff on so there’s a definite ‘don’t want to, not fussed about getting wet, il stay here and play’ mind set.

Sort out a time to have a proper conversation with them about it.

I agree with your husband, he’s meant to be toilet trained and they’ve a room full of kids to look after. Instead of blaming nursery work with them to identify why he’s wetting himself there when he wasn’t before and he doesn’t at home.

Obv they can’t watch/check 30 kids but I’m sure they don’t need to with all 30. The majority of kids this age take themselves pretty reliably. He’s obviously having a bit of a regression, not a massive deal and I’m sure he’ll come out of it soon, but in the meantime it’s totally reasonable to ask them to keep a closer eye on him and prompt him every hour or whatever interval you think would be reasonable- my DS has a prompt to go before playground time as he has a bit of a tendency to rush out and then not want to lose his turn with the play equipment by going to the loo so was having the odd accident.

It's perfectly possible to be toilet trained at home, but he isn't at nursery clearly.

Do you actually think that it's their fault?

@FrannyScraps I think their management of it is poor tbh.

In addition to not saying when he needs to go, he isn't telling them when he's had an accident. Don't forget when at home you might see micro signs that he needs to go and prompt him, that won't be seeing that at nursery, they've 30 kids to watch!

Well so is yours then because this is team work. You can't just say 'tough he's dry at home now it's your problem!'

Fair enough.
He comes up with various reasons why he's wet himself.
He couldn't get his trousers down(it's the same type of joggers he wears at home/the days he's not wet)
He didn't know he needed a pee
His ladies where busy so he couldn't ask
He wanted the black toilet as the others have pee/ poo in them.

It's not even the wetting that bothers me so much but it's them not realising that bothers me more. Especially when it's so obvious

I understand that they have loads of kids to look after but he's one of them!

A month ago I was more understanding. But it's consistently happening.

Also to add from around sept to December he was not wet at nursery.

@FrannyScraps I've asked them to prompt/take him to the toilet.
Other than going in what else can I do?

Put him in a pull up or training pants.

@FrannyScraps he was in them but as he was dry at nursery for months we stopped them.

Ok but now he's not?

I'm unsure what answers you really want from people. Even your dh disagrees.

Toilet training isn't a tick box exercise. He's dry so we're done. Children regress all The time for all sorts of reason. You need to parent the child in front of you, not blame the nursery for it all going wrong.

For whatever reason, he's lost his way with it. Maybe laziness, maybe fear, maybe unsure about who to ask, whatever it is you aren't going to solve it by just shrugging your shoulders and saying 'well he doesn't do it at home' or 'he used to be dry at nursery' which seems to be your only comments.

I went through something similar with my DS3.5 and after a gentle chat with him I discovered that he was scared to go to the toilet because there was a fire alarm in there and would rather not go without an adult.
Do you think there could be something that his put him off the nursery toilets?
We have sorted the issue mostly, but added a staying dry reward chart (ice cream is his big reward) and it is helping big time!
good luck! I understand how annoying the piles of wet things can be and how horrible it must be to think of him sitting in his own piss!

@Woodworm2020 I'm not sure tbh. I've asked him and he's said random things like
He couldn't get trousers down but it's the same ones that he always wears
The workers were busy so he couldn't ask
He wanted the black toilet as the others had pee poo on/in them.
He didn't know he needed to go ect.
It's the thought of him sitting in pissy clothes that bothers me.
I work in healthcare and would be horrified if a family member had brought up their loved one being wet with me and it continued to happen.
It's not like we pick him up at random times we put it on an app and it's the exact same time the three days.

@FrannyScraps I just can't understand why they are not trying to help him when clearly something has put him off!

They have a duty of care. Would it be fine for them to send a child home in a soaking wet nappy?

I totally get why you’re upset about this. 🌺

At his age to be wetting himself regularly effort needs to come from both sides. Yes nursery need to remind him more but he needs to go and you need to stop reminding him as much at home so he can remember himself and learn to listen to his body. If you're not reminding him then is he choosing not to go at nursery?

@1AngelicFruitCake I don't remind him at home. He just tells me he needs to go.
I picked him up today around half 4 and they said he had been to the toilet just before his nap. His nap started at half 12. They went and got him and as they were walking back to me I heard them saying to him ohhh are you wet. When did that happen ect.

Lots of reminders from you about going to the toilet at nursery, maybe small rewards when he does. Staff need to remind him but onus needs to go on him remembering as well.