Page 6 | Nursery fees

Smurf2019 · 2023-04-16T12:51:21+00:00

Good afternoon lovely people, Looking for a bit of advice please Our little boy has attended nursery for the past 2 and half years, However in recent months we have been having a few problems, our little man started to get the entitlement to the 30 hours free childcare in September and since then we have been charged a "premium" package fee for his attendance and being charged £1.80 per hour that he attends for 22 hours as his hours are split over 51 weeks of the year. This premium package fee according the nursery is to cover all snacks, lunches and extra curricular activities. My question is I believe this charge is meant to be voluntary and if we would like to supply our little one with lunch etc then we should be entitled to do that? However nursery state that no food or drink shall be brought in from home. We already pay the nursery for the 8 hours he doesn't get funding which comes in at £224.70 per month. this premium package for the food and drink etc comes in at £171.60 per month. This makes our total invoice for the month with the 30 hours free childcare at £396.30. Is this reasonable ? - I don't mind paying for food for him to attend as it does make our lives easier but paying nearly £40 a week for just snacks and lunches seems a stupidly high amount. (I know nurseries are struggling but so are we and finding this amount every month is just really hard).

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jannier · 19/04/2023 11:59

Magentaa · 18/04/2023 22:45

@jannier if you read my post I said someone had said on this thread around £5 anyway I just check our local council and it’s £4.56 per hour, It wasn’t far off. I mentioned that the calculations were for one staff member and 8 children as is the ratio for the age group, obviously there are more than 8 children in a setting and there are also parents paying huge amounts to look after babies and toddlers. The cost isn’t far off actual hourly rate they would get from a parent paying for a 3+yr old. Another thing say they did away with the 15/30 funded hours, how many parents would actually pay for their child to attend?? I’m guessing nurseries would lose a lot of business

How do you check your local council? As a childminder I am in a group of 20 plus childminders we don't get the same rate but are in the same borough. An assessor I'm in several groups with nurseries they don't get the rate published for our borough because that is the rate paid by the government to the LA so would love to know which site your looking at.

jannier · 19/04/2023 12:34

Magentaa · 18/04/2023 22:45

@jannier if you read my post I said someone had said on this thread around £5 anyway I just check our local council and it’s £4.56 per hour, It wasn’t far off. I mentioned that the calculations were for one staff member and 8 children as is the ratio for the age group, obviously there are more than 8 children in a setting and there are also parents paying huge amounts to look after babies and toddlers. The cost isn’t far off actual hourly rate they would get from a parent paying for a 3+yr old. Another thing say they did away with the 15/30 funded hours, how many parents would actually pay for their child to attend?? I’m guessing nurseries would lose a lot of business

Your also assuming that the rent is free the business rates are 0, they keep lights and heating off, they are not insured, do no training, replace no equipment, don't pay pension or contributions, don't feed the children, don't do craft, pay no admin or janitorial staff, for my use water, ...........so out of the maximum £4.33 sand probably less they only have one set of wage to pay .oh and no staff member yoes sick so they don't have to pay the high locum rate alongside sick pay....and if a staff member has maternity leave that a years temp alongside maternity pay that they Reclaim at the end of the financial year.

Magentaa · 19/04/2023 18:23

new It would be unpopular to state 🙄😅. Don’t get it twisted if the nursery I attend asked for a top up I would happily pay it they are brilliant and both my children have attended we moved out of the area but still travel to them as they are exceptional but they haven’t asked for money for extras. They are expanding so must be doing pretty well! Staff have been there years again must be paid pretty well to remain there. What I’m trying to say it can’t be as bad as everyone is saying as if the funding was that out of proportion ALL nurseries would be needing to asking for extra money. Maybe some nurseries are being greedy and over charging as they know places are limited and would be hard to get child in elsewhere so see it as a way to get extra cash, some may generally be struggling maybe they need to look at how they are running the business, if some are making it work why aren’t others? it’s not all down to the government funding 🙄

Mopscharlotte · 19/04/2023 18:39

Nursery’s can charge for consumables, this could be for example, food, snacks, extra curricula activities, trips etc. There is no such thing as a free place. The government wouldn’t impose a Mitchlin star restaurant to charge the same as McDonalds and rightly so . Like wise if you are attending a setting that’s provides quality resources and foods , to give your child underpinning well being then a consumable charge will be applied. Legally however you can only call the funded hours free- not subsidised and settings can be audited by they local Education authority for this breach. Most misleading for parents, and frustrating for settings as it doesn’t give transparency. If you do the maths on the latest government proposals 30 hours rolling in- 3 x babies would generate an approx revenue of £15 per hour - a staff members wage, and tax needs to come out of this, water, gas, electricity, food, specialist training for the staff , bins, insurance. Now I’m no Carole Vordeman, but settings WILL close and there want be provision for children. Unless you get a dog walker for your child at £ 10 per hour .

Magentaa · 19/04/2023 19:39

@Mopscharlotte I’m sure the government will review the costs of this surely and account for it as that wouldn’t be feasible. And if not then nurseries should refuse it until the government changes it!

Mopscharlotte · 19/04/2023 20:10

op , you would think so however they won’t .many campaigns have been done including Champaign/ lemonade for years . Unfortunately in the early years we have great representatives but not unions …. No one listens . Seriously it will fall flat on its face. I feel parents are being conned by all party’s of the government on free child care . Why not give parents an allowance to use to their choice of registered setting , and if they want mini Eaton fine if you want a nice quirky play group that’s fine too . Decisions should be given to parents on an allowance not a dictation to a setting for £5 an hour . Yes your right we could refuse , but watch how many companies fall down the pan in the mean time , and there will be no choice . It will become nothing more than a weatherspoons of childcare ….. terrible ( not Wetherspoons)

Original poster

Smurf2019 · 19/04/2023 22:13

Mopscharlotte · 19/04/2023 20:10

op , you would think so however they won’t .many campaigns have been done including Champaign/ lemonade for years . Unfortunately in the early years we have great representatives but not unions …. No one listens . Seriously it will fall flat on its face. I feel parents are being conned by all party’s of the government on free child care . Why not give parents an allowance to use to their choice of registered setting , and if they want mini Eaton fine if you want a nice quirky play group that’s fine too . Decisions should be given to parents on an allowance not a dictation to a setting for £5 an hour . Yes your right we could refuse , but watch how many companies fall down the pan in the mean time , and there will be no choice . It will become nothing more than a weatherspoons of childcare ….. terrible ( not Wetherspoons)

Yes I think you are right, We are told that it is "free" and then its the up to us to find out the hard way of getting an invoice a lot higher than we expected.

The problem is our LO has been going to that nursery since he was around 1 and a half and when he transitioned over to the 30 hours "free" childcare we had no meeting with the nursery or any information given to us that we would be paying for the "extras" or the cough cough top up to the rate they charge per hour.

I haven't got a problem with paying the nursery an extra supplement to cover food and extra activities however our LO has only ever been on one little outing to the nursing home next door in the 3 years he has been there.

I have seen on numerous sites now that it is a requirement that the nursery is open and honest with what parents will be charged as "extras" and this should also be voluntary - which I don't agree with because there will be families that wont pay the supplement- so then its down to the families that will to foot the bill

OP posts:

jannier · 20/04/2023 00:18

Magentaa · 19/04/2023 19:39

@Mopscharlotte I’m sure the government will review the costs of this surely and account for it as that wouldn’t be feasible. And if not then nurseries should refuse it until the government changes it!

They know funding is insufficient and always has been everyone who has anything to do with childcare including their own advisors have told them....the only answer they have is increasing ratios expecting staff to do more work for the same money and forgetting children need 1 to 1 care. This is why so many settings are closing....refusing funding.

jannier · 20/04/2023 00:21

Magentaa · 19/04/2023 18:23

new It would be unpopular to state 🙄😅. Don’t get it twisted if the nursery I attend asked for a top up I would happily pay it they are brilliant and both my children have attended we moved out of the area but still travel to them as they are exceptional but they haven’t asked for money for extras. They are expanding so must be doing pretty well! Staff have been there years again must be paid pretty well to remain there. What I’m trying to say it can’t be as bad as everyone is saying as if the funding was that out of proportion ALL nurseries would be needing to asking for extra money. Maybe some nurseries are being greedy and over charging as they know places are limited and would be hard to get child in elsewhere so see it as a way to get extra cash, some may generally be struggling maybe they need to look at how they are running the business, if some are making it work why aren’t others? it’s not all down to the government funding 🙄

What area are you in?

nozoc · 20/04/2023 21:21

We have just had our new contact from our nursery and it has a breakdown of food cost which we have to pay on top of the 30 hour free gov scheme. They are charging £20/day per child!!!

KateyCuckoo · 20/04/2023 21:26

nozoc · 20/04/2023 21:21

We have just had our new contact from our nursery and it has a breakdown of food cost which we have to pay on top of the 30 hour free gov scheme. They are charging £20/day per child!!!

Did you read any of the responses above?

nozoc · 20/04/2023 21:37

Yes, what is your point?

I have not come across a post that is anywhere close to £20 for food for one child/day. I think it is outrageous. The food at his nursery is cooked in house and it is only fair! I understand there are overheads that need to be covered but I can’t see how it would add up to £20. Breakfast alone is £3, a three year old has a small portion of cereal and a slice of toast, how on earth is that £3

KateyCuckoo · 20/04/2023 21:46

Maybe read them again...

nozoc · 20/04/2023 21:52

my sons nursery ARE charging £20 per day per child for food. This is not for activities or consumables. It is disgusting!

nozoc · 20/04/2023 21:54

Maybe you should summarise for me as clearly I am missing something.

nozoc · 20/04/2023 21:58

I know I have to pay for food on top of the 30 hours free. I know I have to pay for the extra hours he is there outside of the 30 hours. I am trying to make the point that I am disgusted that they are expecting £20 per day for the cost of food. I understand there are overheads but if you even take them into account it is such a huge daily cost for food that is cooked in house.

KateyCuckoo · 20/04/2023 21:58

I don't have the time or energy to play this game, the answer to your confusion is explained by many people in this thread.

If you don't want to pay it, find a new setting.

potatowhale · 20/04/2023 22:05

nozoc · 20/04/2023 21:37

Yes, what is your point?

I have not come across a post that is anywhere close to £20 for food for one child/day. I think it is outrageous. The food at his nursery is cooked in house and it is only fair! I understand there are overheads that need to be covered but I can’t see how it would add up to £20. Breakfast alone is £3, a three year old has a small portion of cereal and a slice of toast, how on earth is that £3

But the people who don't get 30 hours are paying for the meals too. The 30 hours don't cover lunchtime.

nozoc · 20/04/2023 22:09

I know it doesn’t, that’s not the point I am making. I know I have to pay for food on top and an extra cost but it the cost of the food and the breakdown of the cost/ meal that baffles me!

potatowhale · 20/04/2023 22:10

nozoc · 20/04/2023 22:09

I know it doesn’t, that’s not the point I am making. I know I have to pay for food on top and an extra cost but it the cost of the food and the breakdown of the cost/ meal that baffles me!

Why? It's not the same as going to a shop and buying it yourself. It's more like going to a cafe.

nozoc · 20/04/2023 22:12

I don’t see how you think I
am confused. I’m stating how much they are charging for food and I want to know how they can justify it. My intention of coming on here is to see how much other parents are paying for food at their nurseries so that I can write a letter to my nursery.

DesteB · 20/04/2023 22:38

My granddaughter goes to a nursery at an independent school. She goes term time only, has if necessary breakfast, snacks and lunch. She gets two languages, art, drama and music, all taught by qualified staff. Also a morning at an outdoor site, all children transported by coach and a picnic lunch if warm or hot lunch if it is colder weather. For her last term she will also have swimming. Because of the free 30 hours it costs absolutely nothing.

Belltentdreamer · 21/04/2023 07:17

DesteB · 20/04/2023 22:38

My granddaughter goes to a nursery at an independent school. She goes term time only, has if necessary breakfast, snacks and lunch. She gets two languages, art, drama and music, all taught by qualified staff. Also a morning at an outdoor site, all children transported by coach and a picnic lunch if warm or hot lunch if it is colder weather. For her last term she will also have swimming. Because of the free 30 hours it costs absolutely nothing.

Well that is highly unusual!! I have no idea how they can make that work, let alone make enough money to cover the overheads of an independent school

Shinyandnew1 · 21/04/2023 07:36

Belltentdreamer · 21/04/2023 07:17

Well that is highly unusual!! I have no idea how they can make that work, let alone make enough money to cover the overheads of an independent school

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They must use money paid in fees by parents of the older children and put that into the nursery.

slamfightbrightlight · 21/04/2023 08:52

Yep, the clue is in the words “independent school”. Fees elsewhere will be subsidising the nursery, much like nurseries within primary schools fare a little better than standalone private nurseries.