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Staff gossiping about parents

19 replies

Mog · 16/01/2008 13:16

For various reasons (long story) I'm going into ds3's nursery to help out. The staff (led mainly by the manager) tend to gossip about parents in a judgemental way. For example, today she said 'the mum's babying him because he's her last one' and then about a girl who had a toilet accident 'she should be potty trained now she's three'. These things are said in quite a sneering way. These are just examples, there are many others.
Is this normal in nurseries? It's left me feeling angry on behalf of other parents. But actually a bit powerless about what I can do (although if it goes on I don't think I'll be able to keep my gob shut ) Anyone any experience of this?

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wannaBe · 16/01/2008 13:28

I bet there isnt a nursery/school in the country where this doesn't happen. In principle carers shouldn't discuss parents, but by nature human beings are judgemental, and it would be impossible for people not to have opinions about the parents of the children they look after. As long as they're not discussing in front of the children, or treating the children differently based on their opinions of the parents, there's really not much you can do about it.

HuwEdwards · 16/01/2008 13:29

Agree with wannaBe - sounds like most workplaces tbh.

Hulababy · 16/01/2008 13:33

Sounds like a typical staffroom TBH. Even outside of education you find staff gossipping about clients, which is what parents of pupils are after all.

As wannabe says - so long as not in front of the children and not affecting how they treat the children, it shouldn't be an issue.

They probably need to be a bit careful about doing it in front of parent helpers too!

ChristmasShinySnowflakes · 16/01/2008 13:37

It sounds entirely unprofessional and inappropriate to me, but then I run my nurseries in a certain way I suppose.

I would have a chat with the Manager about is but I have to say- has it not made you wonder what they say about you when you're not there?

It would me- parents deserve the utmost respect there is; which should include a completely NON judgemental approach, and an appreciation/acknowledgement of the individual needs and wishes of each parent, child and family.

Mog · 16/01/2008 13:42

This was in front of the children - it's a one room group. Of course I had my suspicions, the manager was a tad indiscreet before, so of course it makes me think she talks about me. I take comfort from the fact that people like this are generally not taken much notice of by others - they know they're just backstabbers.
I'm concerned though about the attitudes to children it expresses. Why should a child be potty trained just because they are 3? I presume the mum described as 'babying' her child was just upset that he was crying as she left. It all implies a belief that bad parenting is going on and I think this must subtly affect the way she works.

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mumofhelen · 16/01/2008 14:11

From my experience most education, health and social care staff speak about parents -especially mums - in a derogatory manner. It's amusing though, that since many of the same staff are parents themselves, they take particular offence when comments about their awful parenting comes back to them!

Some of these people are what I call, little Hitlers. They get a power trip by putting others down. Staff who do this, tend to be insecure about their own parenting, and criticising other parents make them feel better.

If you dare, you could ask when her own children were potty trained. Doesn't she cuddle her own children? Take what they say, and relate it back to them. They'll soon shut up.

Mog · 16/01/2008 15:23

There are other concerns I have - can anyone tell me if this is normal.
There were 6 staff in this morning - only 3 were interacting with the children and 3 were doing preperation/admin work. I didn't count the children but the ratios were the normal ones I expect.
Also they regularly, during the three hour session, DON'T take the children outside at all. What would be normal for other places? The children are mainly 2.5-3.5. There are several children, all boys, who are said to have behavioural problems. I just worry that they are bored and need a bit of exercise. Boys cooped up with lots of children tend to go a bit loopy in my experience, if not allowed brisk exercise.

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happystory · 16/01/2008 15:42

Gosh mumofhelen, lots of sweeping generalisations there!

I agree it's unprofessional to gossip in front of a parent-helper and the children but unrealistic to expect they wouldn't do it at staff meetings/in private.

Re: ratios, how many children there? Did 3 adults do paperwork all morning?

Agree that outdoor play is very important. Perhaps you could start by asking when/how often they go outside?

Mog · 16/01/2008 16:40

I don't agree that it's unrealistic to expect staff not to gossip about parents. It indicates a meanness of spirit in my book. I don't do it about other parents - think it's deeply unkind as we don't know everyone's circumstances.

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snowleopard · 16/01/2008 16:45

In front of the children is not very nice. At 3 they can easily understand!

But gossiping itself is probably very common. I'm sure they have all kinds of opinions about me at our nursery! - that I'm a right scruff, that I baby DS (because he's so cuddly and sensitive) and that I'm weird (because I'm a bit socially awkward). BUT most of them are 19 or so and don't have kids, so they don't know what its like to be me and I try not to care.

LadyJogsAlot · 16/01/2008 16:48

mog, i know it must be upsetting to hear these things and it is unprofessional to discuss it in front of you, HOWEVER, you are in their work space. yes, teachers analyse the behaviour of children and discuss where these behaviours come from and yes they can be judgemental but it's really not your place to say anything to anyone.

as a parent helper you have a responsibility to not repeat things which you have overheard, whether they are things about the children or parents. also, repeating any of those comments is likely to hurt the feelings of the parents in question anyway.

in the eyes of the foundation stage curriculum, those children should always have the option to go outside to play.

hth

Mog · 16/01/2008 17:09

All the staff are over 30 and most over 40 so it can't be blamed on youth.
I suppose it's the nature of the comments - they are not off the cuff remarks about parents but negative comments about the children themselves. The comments I've quoted show a lack of awareness of child development.
The children certainly don't have the option of going outside. The door is quite clearly shut to the outside space.
Of course it would hurt the parents feelings, it is deeply unkind and quite childish actually. Playground stuff. That's why I think it reflects badly about the nursery staff. It was actually the manager mainly who was doing it. That's the most worrying part because presumably she sets the ethos.

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mumofhelen · 17/01/2008 10:01

I think very often it is the 'off the cuff' remarks that can be the most hurtful or offensive, because very often they are taken out of context.

Everyone believes that their dd is truly beautiful. I do and I would like to boast about it and I'm very proud too.

Nevertheless, I can't get away from the fact that I am obese (again - I did loose weight but I've put it on again). My dd on the hand, is perfect with strawberry blond hair and slim. Typical cover girl.

Nonetheless, my dd said she overheard one of the members of staff say, "How can such as ugly mother give birth to a beautiful girl like that. It's so unfair."

Well, needless to say my dd was very upset. She hardly spoke when she got back home and it was only to my husband during bedtime book reading that she confided to him what she had heard the staff say about me.

I can take that sort of insult - I'm quite thick skin. Nevertheless, my heart bleeds when my dd says, "Fat is bad, but I love you mummy." She's obviously been indoctrinated that fat people = bad people.

I can assure you that I don't teach that sort of mentality to my children. Seeing that she's either at home or at nursery school, it doeasn't take a genius to figure out where she's got her fear of fat from.

Acinonyx · 18/01/2008 23:45

Gossip is unavoidable and normal - but I'd be very concerned about thsi kind of talk in front of the children shudder.

mumofhelen - that is totally out of order. I can see a certain surprise when people see my dd's mommy - how did I produce that.

BITCAT · 19/01/2008 00:04

NOT VERY GOOD AND VERY UNPROFFESIONAL, I DID SEVERAL PLACEMENTS AT NURSERIES PRIVATE AND LOCAL AUTHORITY RUN, AND I NEVER EXPERIENCED THAT BEHAVIOUR, WE WOULD ONLY EVER DISCUSS CHILDREN OR THE PARENTS IF WE HAD CONCERNS ABOUT THE CHILD AND WERE NOT SURE WHAT ACTION TO TAKE IF ANY!!

Scramble · 19/01/2008 00:27

In the staff room totally common, who doesn't whatever the profession. But not in front of young trainee staff, children or parent helpers, that is wrong and bad practice.

Magdelanian · 19/01/2008 00:34

It happens. I met my DD's teacher in a nightclub and she told me that the staff had been guessing my age. I thought they had better things to think about. Still they got in wrong by ten years in my favour. Still concentrate on the kids.

cat64 · 19/01/2008 00:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

mumofhelen · 19/01/2008 14:41

I agree with cat64. People should remember that 'walls have ears' and should at least look around to see who can hear. There's an old adage, "Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity" but I often wonder whether that is true.

Everyone is entitled to their opinions. However, good manners and social graces decree that you don't say things that may hurt someone's feelings - especially a young child - and you should take all the necessary steps to avoid such rudeness and meanness.
Nonetheless, in my case, such bad manners and rudeness goes against my family's values, which is why in the last 5 years, I've changed GP, health visitor and, in my daughter's case, nursery. The nursery bit was a shame, because dd liked the other children but I thought to myself, "do I want my child to be cared for, and taught by someone who is rude, openly prejudicial and judgemental and so indiscrete? The answer is no.

My daughter currently attends the nursery department at an independent prep school. They were the only ones who seem to share my values and strangely enough, do not equate fat person = poor person to be shat on, despite that sector?s reputation for being exclusive. It's a headmaster and wife team, religious but not too overtly. They are polite, tactful and helpful. A shame not more people are like them, the world would be a much better place.

My dd still remembers but thanks to her new nursery, she now realises that it was that uncouth woman who is in the wrong. Dd is learning that being nice, polite, inclusive and sensitive, especially to people who look ?different? is just as important as learning to share and take turns. Something that I doubt she would have learnt at her other nursery.

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