Why do I feel so devastated about my job?

[MerryMarigold]

I know most of you are probably parents, but if there are any staff out there... Please tell me if this is normal.

Where I work, there are 2 Practitioners with 14 children, 3-4 years old. 2 of these are autistic, one more severe than the other. The more severe one bites, steals food from other children, eats everything (paint, messy play stuff etc.) and requires a lot of attention. I'm exhausted. I feel like the children aren't learning anything as it's the best I can do to keep them safe, let alone teach them. Circle times are so difficult with the autustic ones. I feel like I'm letting the children down. I'm not even sure this ratio is legal as I'm not a level 3 (the other one is level 3).

I also have to work through all my breaks (I get 20min as it's only a 5hr shift) in order to get observations, books and planning done. I bring home a lot of work and do it on my days off or evenings.

Today I found out they have been overpaying me because my 20 minute break is unpaid, so they have worked out how much I owe since September. I don't care that much about the money, nectar I'm really doing this for the love of the job. I don't need the money, I just feel really gutted that I'm working harder than I've done in my life. Please help me understand if this is normal for nursery staff and I'm just a bit of a wuss or if this is quite bad.

Parents. Be aware that this is how at least some staff are treated. I've gone into this late in life and can say I've never come across a job which is such hard work for such low post and terrible working conditions. I'm on minimum wage, which works out considerably less if you include the time I spend working unpaid.

That should say, such hard work for such low pay. It's an amazing job and I truly love working with kids, but arghhhhhh.

This is why I will never work in a private day nursery ever again. I’m aware they are not all the same, but my experience was horrendous, we were all young girls, no qualifications between us, never got breaks, 10 hours a day, paid next to nothing as we were all on apprenticeships, and what we did get paid was often late and/or wrong.

I’m now a childminder and find it much better. I get to choose what I do with the children on a day to day basis, choose when I do my paperwork and find it so much better than working for someone els (I appreciate childminding isn’t for everyone, but compared to working for a crappy nursery there is no comparison.

Thanks Maryann. Yes, the poor apprentices...

You are working legally within ratio
It’s up to you to manage your workload to make sure you get paperwork done and if you are struggling then you need to tell your manager during supervisions
Your break is not a legal requirement as you work less than 6 hours
Make the most of your break by chilling and not doing work
Look at your routine, I wouldn’t be doing circle time with children with autism
Do the children get loads of outside play as that will make things better instead of keeping them inside and making them sit through circle time
Do you not have anyone who oversees the room?

I’ve worked in a day nursery and it was bloody crap. High responsibility, high expectations and shit money.
Don’t bring any work home, paperwork needs to be done within work hours.
Are they expecting you to do the paperwork while you are with the children? (Which is obviously impossible). You need to be given time to sit and get it done.
Should the autistic child have a one-on-one carer?

Hugs I know how hard it can be.

Yes, my manager tells me it's up to me to manage my workload. Which is why I bring it all home. That's actually rubbish. Any employer can say you need to do this, that and the other but mostly they are realistic. There are staff who try and do it round the children, but I disagree with that. It's not safe, because you're present but not actually present, and it's not engaging with them. We are permanently short staffed as so many people leave. I'll be next. I am going to ask to not have a break anymore. What's the point of having an unpaid break which I work through? It's just giving them my time.

Yes, the autustic girl should have 1 to 1 but she's been here a year now. The parents are fully on board. How can I read stories, discuss things (eg. Wood, plastic etc) with no circle times? We are outside but it's increasingly hot.

I work in healthcare how but I was a nursery nurse years ago. I honestly say it's the most stressful career I've held. I did paper work at home, I cried after stressful days. I would cover lunches way over ratio. Management were always arses and owners all about money.
Never mind the demanding parents who pay for this service too. I get it they pay but some could be horrible to us nursery staff.

There was no time to do paperwork in works time, we still had a room full of kids that needed activities, Assessments and also just observing to make sure they were safe. We weren't given time out to do paperwork, all as a qualified member of staff I was on £4/5 an hour ( pre minimum wage) as a room leader. Best thing I ever did was leave that one.

I have friends that still work in nurseries and it seems in some not all that things are still the same.

It’s just unsustainable. I would speak to the manager and tell her things need to change or you will leave. She needs to give you time to get the paperwork done. The autistic child needs one-on-one. You need another staff member in the room.

It’s up to her to decide whether to make positive changes, or just leave things as they are and have a high staff turnover due to unworkable conditions.

I work in a private day nursery and whilst i don't have to do any paperwork (level 2 so no key children) I do constantly see my colleagues working through their breaks to do paperwork, and then if we have the majority of children asleep the two no paperwork staff members sit with the awake children and the others do paperwork.
They're all constantly tired and I don't see how they do it every day. I can see why they don't love their jobs anymore.
I am in awe of everyone who works in a nursery and has key children, and I can't believe that when I told my parents I was leaving school to train to be a nursery nurse I was told it was an easy option for stupid people.
No suggestions on how to make it easier but just my complete admiration for coping for so long and for still trying to find ways to make it work when you don't want to be there anymore.

What is it you are taking home OP? You need to be extremely careful with Data protection and cover yourself here. I'm a nursery nurse too and unfortunately it sounds about right. It's frustrating when you want to give so much more to these children but your hands are tied.

@mylittlenugget I had 11 key children last year- I was exhausted.

By the way you mention not being certain about ratios.
0-2 is 1 staff member to 3 children.
2-3 is 1 staff member to 4 children.
3-4 is 1 staff member to 8 children.
Those are the legal ratios and you can't go over that. But some managers if they have the budget do try to have an extra staff member in, especially for the 3-4years age range simply because they understand the need for more attention on the children than those ratios give.

@Hotpinkangel19 my supervisor has around that amount right now due to someone being on maternity leave and it looks like she's just going to be getting more. I honestly don't know how anyone does it, and if I was allowed to I'd have loved to take on some key children just to ease the workload a bit. It's disgusting how much nursery staff are expected to do for such low wages!

My daughter is at nursery too and I'm paying for her out of my very low wages. Luckily I don't have that many key children now!!

You need to address these issues with your manager and keep a trail of your concerns - save emails write down conversations etc.. The more severely autistic child needs one to one, can your manager explain why this isn't happening? I agree circle time is important dont stop doing that. Can you do circle time and the other staff member does something with the Children who can't manage it?

Break off into groups whenever you can. Hats and suncream on and get outside early before it's too hot.

How many hours a week do you work? Could you drop any days?

It's incredibly hard work and I totally sympathise, I'm on an apprenticeship in a school nursery doing my level 3 at the moment, I am beyond exhausted!

My little nugget
A level 2 person is qualified and there is no justifiable reason why they cannot have key children

The ratios, don't they change for different levels? I'm totally unqualified. I have 3 key children though I only work 15 hours. It's only 3, but we need observations done online as well as in books (7 in each place). You can duplicate but it takes time.

Missyb1, my dream is to work in a school nursery. I'm training for level 3. I didn't think they'd take me without being a level 3 already. I'd love to be around well qualified staff, decent resources (I currently buy all my own felt tips and many other resources because I feel sorry for the children).

I know they're qualified, and I know they can have key children. I did the training and I qualified just under a year ago. At my previous nursery I would have had key children as I would have been training towards my level three, however I left that nursery before starting the training and then I got pregnant so my training was postponed at the current nursery.
Maybe it's just where I live but the nurseries here don't tend to give level 2 staff members key children. We're qualified enough to know if there's an issue with development, or to take charge of a room for five minutes if needed. But we aren't trusted enough to have the responsibility of observations, 2 year checks, parents evenings etc. Again may be just where I live but in the the nurseries I've worked in a staff member has to be at least working towards a level three before they're given key children. Not sure what the reason is, but that's the way ive found it to be @insancerre

What do you mean for different levels? They change for the age groups as I put but once they reach school age the ratios change slightly. Because I haven't worked in a school I can't remember if there's a ratio whilst children are 5 but definitely once they're out of the early years there isn't really a ratio
A school might be able to support you in getting your qualification. I know someone who was a ta and working towards her level 3 (not sure if she had a level 2 before that). It may be worth looking in to @MerryMarigold

I have worked in Early Years for over 10 years in a lovely setting, your nursery doesn't sound great, once you have got your qualification look around at other places, there are much better options.

Thanks nugget. I mean can a level 3 qualified person have more children in their care than someone totally unqualified? Not just 8 per adult. Also, are special needs included in ratios or does it not matter. I assume a special school would have totally different ratios.

Nope as long as you're a paid staff member (volunteers don't count in ratios) then you're counted in full. The only difference a qualification makes in that sense is there needs to be a level 3 in each room, and in a baby room more than 50% of the staff needs to be qualified (a level 3 couldn't be with two unqualified staff members for example).

Special needs don't change ratios unless theres a need for 1-1 in which case in a class of 14 3 year olds, one with a 1-1 there should be 3 members of staff if that makes sense? However, even if there's been a recognised need for a 1-1 unless there's the actual funding in place I don't think a nursery is obligated to provide it. I'm a little murky on that aspect although I did work with a child who was recognised as needing 1-1 but because the assessment or the funding was still being processed she didn't get it.

I dont work in a day nursery but I'm friendly with one of the girls who works in my DS nursery (which is absolutley amazing and they look after the staff). She told me the other local nursery which she trained at told her she had to leave after she qualified because they only took the cheap staff. Shocking!