DS still very upset about nursery - I'm getting worried and paranoid. Long sorry.

[snowleopard]

Have posted on this before so thank you to anyone who can help again!

DS (2) is still so, so upset about going to nursery and it isn't getting better. he's moved rooms which seemed to help initially, but now we're back to normal - screaming, sobbing and clinging at drop-off. He is capable of having a good time there and does join in sometimes, especially when they play in the garden, but also has days where he's unhappy all day.

I have to work (3 days a week) but I feel terrible about upsetting him so much, so regularly.

FWIW the nursery are very good, the staff are loving and caring, they are very concerned about his happiness and discuss it with me regularly, he gets lots of hugs and attention and indeed I think because he's so sensitive he basically gets 1-1 care most of the time. Because of this we're reluctant to change childcare arrangements, as I'm not sure it's the nursery itself that's the problem - it seems more like it's just separation from me, and if it is then we could end up with the same situation but with a less understanding nursery or childminder.

But it seems he's the only one there to have this problem so consistently and DP and I are starting to worry that we're doing something wrong. We feel like we try to be good parents - he gets loads of love and affection, lots of fun things to do, firm boundaries etc and he is fine and doing well in most developmental ways (no signs of SN so far, for example). But could we be doing something horribly wrong - mollycoddling him somehow, or I even worry that somehow deep down he's not feeling loved enough and so is insecure... I tie myself up in knots over it.

Or are some children just like this? It's so hard to know how "normal" he is as he is a PFB. He does seem very cuddly, sensitive to people's feelings, caring (obsessed with making sure cuddly toys have enough food, cosy blankets to sleep in etc when we go out and leave them, that kind of thing) but I don't know if all 2yo's are like that? (He's also a very boys' boy and into cars and diggers.) When he's with me he has the odd tantrum and strop of course but is not often upset.

I know I'm probably getting worked up over a normal stage but it doesn't feel normal, I feel alone at nursery and that all the other parents are looking on with pity (which is nice of them but does make me feel DS is odd!)

Sorry this is so long.

Is he an only child?

I wonder if he's so used to being centre of attention with you and dh at all times that it's quite upsetting for him to experience sharing that attention with others at nursery.

He's also very used to having you there - on demand

I speak from experience by the way. It is upsetting but I think it boils down to nothing more than adjusting to his position at nursery as opposed to his position in the home.

firstly i am sure you are not the only parent to have this issue
has DS always been like this since he started nursery? Did anything trigger it ...
Does it make any difference if your DP drops him off?
My DS is a bit younger than yours (13.5 months) but has been in nursery for 7 months - it makes you feel crap when you drop them off and they are crying
it sounds like the nursery are really good - have you spoken to his key worker about some strategies for dealing with this

you sound lovely parents (the kind that we (me and dh) try to be) and your ds sounds gorgeous. Think he would rather be with you than at school, just as you would probably rather be with him than a work. But you need to work and we cannot always have what we want so he needs to get used to it. This sounds harsh but i think you can get what i am trying to say.

could it be its a kind of vicious circle, you're upset cos he is upset and this is unsettling him and making him worried about you? Try making it seem more like a special treat and get him to show you things when you drop off. "Wow ds a digger, what are you going to do with that!" etc. etc. You will obviously be needing to act your pants off but this kind of thing works for us

another thing is perhaps he does not have enough time with other children when you are around? This might make him feel more able to join in when you are not.

good luck and let me know other things that work as my ds goes through stages of being exactly the same.

Thanks for your replies. He has always been like this off and on, but it's got worse and been pretty much constant for the last few months. He generally wants to be with me most, and sometimes rejects DP, but he'll happily go off for walks or be left at home with DP when I'm not there. If DP takes him to nursery, it's just as bad.

They have tried lots of strategies, have asked the HV for help, they even keep a special log for him to track when he's upset to try to find out why. Nothing has helped so far.

He is an only child (so far) and yes he's used to 1-to-1 attention at home - although he doesn't get whatever he wants IYSWIM, and he is quite good at playing with other children (he has a best friend round the corner and often plays happily with her).

it is a hard one - sounds like the nursery are being pro-active with their logging
do you stay with him when you drop off, or leave him to it?

Maybe he is just not happy in that particlar nursery, I remember hating my nursery as a kid even though my mum worked there, that memory must have been when I was fairly old and i couldn't go anywhere else. Could a child minder be a better option? My friends who use childminders seem to have a much more personal relationship with them than those who use nurseries. He might feel cosier in an at-home set up.

Thanks witch. That's kind of what I want to hear - that he needs to get used to it - because I don't want to think that I'm doing something terrible to him but I kind of fall into feeling like that sometimes. It's SO hard to know where the line is between being a loving, affectionate parent and wrapping up in cotton wool/mollycoddling/etc. If you know what I mean. I don't want to raise a child who can't cope with normal pressures but it seems wrong to be less loving, does that make sense?

I will try your tip about "acting" at nursery. I try to be positive and tell him he'lll have a great time etc but it's hard to make my voice sound cheery!

It could be that nursery... but it's such a big risk to change. We would lose our place there and might never find anything as good, and it might not solve the problem. I suppose one thing I could do is try him with a CM on a day when I would normally be with him - though that would mean one less day with me.

I try to drop him off quickly and matter-of-factly on the HV's advice, but i do wonder if if I stayed and helped to settle him, that might work. Would that be madness?

when i drop my DS off i hang his coat and bag up whilst the nursery staff are sitting him down and getting his toast - once he is muching away i give him a kiss and say (in a very cheery voice) "have a lovely day, see you later"
when i take him in, i always make a thing of saying to DS "here are your lovely friends and all the toys to play with"
sounds similar to what Witch is suggesting

I do do roughly that - but I'm crap at acting

I'm sure he does pick up on me being upset, as that's typical of him anyway. (I'm ill at the moment with a cold and he's been making me lie on the sofa and tucking me in with his blanket!) Focusing on a particular toy might help though, or starting him off playing with it...

try the toy idea - worth a shot
really hope you can crack it - i am sure you will

I've been through this with both my boys. It's so hard and, like you, I did wonder if we were doing something wrong.

Mine would both get very upset on the way to nursery and would cling on to me as I was leaving but both 'recovered' as soon as I was gone most of the time. The nursery told me it was better if I didn't make a big deal of saying goodbye - I just hung their things up and left quickly.

They both still have the occasional day of being upset and not wanting to go - the older one has admitted that he loves it there but he would just rather stay with me, which is very nice to hear but I have to work and he starts school in September so he just has had to get used to it.

I'm sure this is a stage that your DS will get through. Mine are both sensitive souls too and I wouldn't have them any other way!

Thanks very much Herbiemom. It's good to hear such a similar story (though I know it's hard for them). I wouldn't want DS to change his personality either.

Its so hard in'nt it, my d1 hated nursery, i took her out after a term of crying, she was only going twice a week and i was lucky that my mum has steped in to look after her once a week. The worst bit was when other parents would look at her (when i dropped her off) and say, 'oh whats wrong with her', 'what a sad little face' and 'oh dont you like nursery' (this made her worse). Also i was'nt happy with the nursery she was going to and the way the staff run the place. DD has'nt been to nursery since april but i am planning on finding her somewhere else for september.

Snowleopard what would concern me if I were you is that sometimes your child is unhappy all day. A lot of children have phases of being unhappy when dropped at nursery but IME a child who stays unhappy throughout the day is sending pretty clear signals that the environment is not right for them at the moment.

I am not anti-nursery at all - both my children attended nursery from the age of 1. But I have seen children who just did not like the nursery atmosphere settling quite happily with childminders - and also happily returning to nursery when they were older and more able to cope with it.

Why don't you look around for a childminder? Then he will have a more homely environment, smaller number of children around and more consistency in carers? My ds was a bit like yours, and when we moved him to a cm he settled fairly quickly. It was the best move we ever made.

Oh dear . I sympathise snowleopard, I really do. I used to work full-time when my eldest son was small. He went to a CM full-time until he reached 3 when he went to a nursery 2 mornings a week - I dropped him there usually and the CM picked him up. He screamed and screamed and like your DS, had good days and bad days. But he loved his CM. With him it was the change from one-to-one, homely environment that triggered the stress, not missing me per se. When CM dropped him off he was fine. I hate to say it but he was even worse at school . Sorry.

My DD was fine - at nursery and at school. I don't know for sure why DS#1 was like that but I do wonder if he was reflecting my lack of confidence and upset at leaving him as he was my first - certainly we had sort of distress feedback loop happening. Can you get someone else to take him for a while. With my DS there was always a certain moment that triggered the tears - at nursery I would hang his coat up on the peg and turn to the door and instantly he grabbed me. At school when the bell rang he would grab me and start to cry even though he'd be fine beforehand. If I wasn't there that moment didn't happen.

I think we will have to consider the childminder idea, if we can't crack it, and I will be discussing that with DP.

My DS is 2.9 and used to howl dreadfully whenever I dropped him off at nursery. He had started nursery for 2 days a week from being 1 and the howling started after about a fortnight. I considered taking him out of nursery (I am self-employed and could have adjusted a bit what I did) but the keyworker advised me that it would be worse when he went back. SO I persevered, he stopped the howling, then started again, and finally stopped and now goes in happily. When he was in the cry-at-drop-off stage the staff assured me he was fine within a few minutes, and he was always cheerful when I collected him. They even gave me a set of photos of him playing happily.
Soooner or later, everyone's kids have to go through this particular lesson - that you go away and come back. You're not being cruel and he will settle down. Best of luck.

madamez - they will indeed have to learn this lesson. But some children find it much harder than others for various reasons and if you can find a way of lessening the distress it pays dividends for you and the child.

My boss's ds hates being left at nursery and has done since she started taking him at 6 mths. When he was about 2.5 she started staying with him for about 10-15 mins (they have breakfast at the nursery so she stayed for breakfast until he went into another room to play) and he is much better. She says that she wishes she'd tried staying sooner. He is still a bit miserable when she leaves (he's at the same nursery as my ds)but no more screaming and crying. Maybe worth a try for a week or so.

Thanks Birdyarms (fab name!) This is what I'd thought of as a possibility so that really helps!

No practical advice (sorry) as haven't been in your situation, but just wanted to add that you sound like fab, caring parents and I don't think for one minute you should think its something you're 'doing wrong'. It sounds to me like your little boy is feeling a fairly normal separation anxiety when you drop him off, and he is just going to need a bit more time and a little bit of extra help to overcome it.

Hope some of the more practical advice already offered will help, and/or other mums will have some more creative approaches for you to try. Good luck xx

Mine loved their first nursery from 6 months each. Went straight in no probs after the first two or three weeks. DD starts school this september and we are moving DS from the nursery they are currently both in ( that they've only been in for 4 months as we have just moved city ) as I don't like it at all and they are the unhappiest I've ever known reluctant to go in etc BUT I think thats because the staff don't act on the clingyness that DS and sometimes DD show in the way that the nursery your Lo is in do. I have found a new nursery for DS to go to and he starts soon. I was really impressed with them as I discussed this as a problem as DS has never been apart from DD. They have a similar problem to yours and an idea they felt really worked was taking a photo in of mum and dad and they put at a low height so he could sit near it if he wanted to and the staff used it to talk to him about mum at work coming back to pick him up and that the photo was there till she came back etc. I wasn't sure this would have been such a good idea but they had so much success involving mum with the hand over to the picture if you like that they are doing it with all the kids and its been really effective. Is it worth ago ? I guess there are pros and cons but it might be worth a try.

I think everyone is different - perhaps its just too soon for him and you should try again in 6 months time?
Having said that, I fully understand that might not be a practical thing to do...