Change in level of care when they go up to pre-school part of nursery?

[RockBat]

Sorry, couldn't think how to word the title properly.

Although this isn't AIBU, I'm quite prepared to be told I am.. :)

DD goes to nursery one day a week while I'm at work (grandparents other days). She is currently in the older toddlers' group but when she turns 3 in January she'll go up to pre-school (still 9am-6pm). Apart from stifling a sob that my DD and pre-school are being used in the same sentence, this is ok.

They have started putting her into pre-school now for a couple of hours each day to settle her in. Again, not too bothered by this. What bothers me is that suddenly the level of care seems to have changed. She's very recently out of nappies but in pre-school she is no longer helped to the toilet, they go on their own and someone checks up on them afterwards. Consequently she had a couple of accidents this afternoon which she hasn't done before. We no longer get any details about what she's eaten during the day or what she's done so I have no idea whether she ate any lunch or tea, whether she was happy and got on well or what. DH does the pick up and didn't question them when they said they would no longer be reporting back as she was in pre-school now.

My issues really are that a) she is being treated as a pre-schooler before she is one, and she could really do with the help with the toilet and meals. And b) we're paying the higher rate for the younger children rather than the pre-school rate. Is this normal carry on? She is my only and PFB although I don't think I'm particularly pfb overall...

She shouldn't be going into pre-school until she is 3.

There are laws re: staff to child ratios, and up till the age of 3 children need 1 staff to every 3 children. This is so there are enough staff to supervise toilet trips, nappy changes, feeding etc.

Unless your nursery has this sort of ratio in the pre-school room they are breaking the law sending her there for a couple of hours every day, especially as she's not due to move until January.

My DD spent a couple of hours a day in pre-school the week before she moved up and this was sufficient to get her used to the move.

I would check the ratios and if it looks like they're breaking the law I would complain.

Thanks Polly, interesting about the ratios. I'll grill DH and see what he says but will definitely have a word with them when I drop her off next week. At this rate she'll be spending half the day in there for the next 2.5 months.

The ratios are actually 1 adult to 4 children for children aged 2-3 years, and then 1 adult to 8 children when they turn three. I think they are doing the right thing by doing settling sessions early, as it will get her well used to being in the older room. Also, I think with children over 3 it is all about encouragement to be independent.... this is exactly what would happen at a school nursery....

It's probably best to voice your concerns as it may have been overlooked and simply that the pre-school room did not realise that she needed extra help in the loo
although this should have been communicated by the previous room/ key worker

sorry... I should add that I don't think they should have dropped the feedback

She shouldn't need to be in the pre-school room every day now to "settle in" for January. Ask them to leave her in the toddler room for now and start the settling in process in December.

Sounds to me like they might have an extra child in the toddler room, and so are moving her up early to maintain ratios there

I am pretty sure that at my DS's nursery you still get feedback about their day even after 3. I like this and would certainly want it.

I think part of the problem here comes from your DD only spending one day a week in nursery - that's not to say this is your fault. What I mean is that if she spends a couple of hours in the pre-school room, then she is spending quite a lot of her overall nursery time there, compared to a full-time child. Perhaps this is why they have started the transition so early?

My DS has gone into the room he will move to for short visits initially, then for half-days, all over a period of about 2-3 weeks. As he's full-time that makes a better transition, but with only 1 day a week to play with, it's a bit harder to get the balance right of giving her enough time in the room to actually get her used to it, but not so much that they are expecting her to do things she really can't do yet.

However, I would definitely ask them specifically if she can be helped with going to the toilet even in the preschool room as you consider she still needs it and don't want to set her toilet training back. That seems like something they should definitely respect your wishes on.

If she's there for a couple of hours, then surely you get information about at least one meal, as she's not there for both? Or do you just not get anything on days when she's been in pre-school?

Maybe you could also ask that she spends mealtimes in her 'normal' room, even if they are taking her for visits to the preschool room. That could be accompanied by you pointing out that you are still paying the rate for the younger kids' room.

Thanks :) By my reckoning if she's spending a couple of hours a day in pre-school then she's still mostly under the supervision of toddlers and generally should be treated as such.

I take the point about the one day a week. She's been there for 18 months and is still teary at drop off although she knows them well enough and likes her key worker a lot. The three days I work she does get shunted around a bit which unfortunately will get worse in the new year when she adds two afternoons in an actual school based pre-school. But it's the way it has to be at the moment.

I'm sure they know what they're doing, I've had no complaints about them so far and she's happy there. But ultimately it's still daycare not school and so I'd ideally like them to help her out a bit more in a way they won't at school.

Thanks again. I worried I was being a bit of a drama queen. She's still so little and although infuriatingly independent, she's not quite ready to be left to her own devices. :)

They should still be giving feedback, its part of their job . To be honest lots of nurseries have rising threes in the pre-school room at this time of year as the age group drops due to only one school intake (around here anyway), so eldest in room could be just 4yrs. Was she collected from the pre-school room or her old room? It may be that communication between the rooms was poor (not great but can happen in a busy nursery).

You will still be paying 2yrs old rate because they should be still applying 1-4 ratio in that room for the under threes. For example we had 12 in our pre-school room Fri, 8 were 3-5ys = 1 staff member, and 4 were rising 3's so = 1 staff member. In actual fact we had 4 staff in there ans they were still very busy but that a whole other thread!

She should still have a key worker in the pre-school room and they should support her if needed in the loo.

Have a chat with them and explain your concerns, a good nursery will welcome your views and work with you to sort out any issues.

I work in a day care nursery and we still give feedback in the pre school as we feel it is important. We do give it in a different way to the other room but this is explained to the parents when their child comes into our room and if there is something they still want us to report on then we would do so.

I would definately speak to them about the needing help in the toilet as they may not realise she needs help ( we are happy to help them in the toilet).

After the September clear out of children there is usually quite a bit of space in pre-school rooms. It's a good time to move somebody up because you can give them more attention. It's a bit odd they are getting her to visit ready for moving up in January though. Bit of a daft excuse.