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Nurseries

Find nursery advice from other Mumsnetters on our Nursery forum. For more guidance on early years development, sign up for Mumsnet Ages & Stages emails.

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Original poster

report to ofsted?

34 replies

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 22:09

Pre school run by paid staff.

Ofsted registration states The registered person:

?may care for no more than 28 children from 2 years to the end of the early years age group at any one time (Early Years Register)
?must not provide overnight care (Early Years Register)

Two members of staff have brought in their 8/9 year old children and a 5 year old (who is at reception at another school) for the past 3 days.

Will ofsted actually take a complaint about this. It is suppose to be an early years setting.

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

Avantia · 21/07/2010 22:24

Perhaps speak with the management of the setting first before a complaint ?

Obviously all to do with ratios and numbers - perhaps not all 28 children have been in this week ?

Seems a bit harsh initally without finding out more from setting.

Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 22:28

Unfortunately Nursery manager is not approachable. Very agressive. I am in the process of removing my child as soon as other childcare found.

My question is regardless of the ratio- is the presence of two 8 year olds in breach of regulations. It happens regularly in holidays (terms overlap). When will it stop..when they are 11? 14? 16?

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Avantia · 21/07/2010 22:33

I dont think it is in breach of regulations as long as ratios are ok.

I work in a preschool setting and on an inset day some staff have brought their children in (as long as ratios are OK and it has been OK'd first)

The children at the setting really enjoy having older ones there and it does both lots of children alot of good.

It seems that you may have other issues with the setting.

Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 22:33

Also this pre school has had two complaints on the last 12 mths. I think its because of how the manager is rude to parents and they cant address their concerns.

What sort of info is Ofsted likely to want? I dont want to give my name.

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LynetteScavo · 21/07/2010 22:36

I think this isn't in breach of regulations.

What is your problem with it? One of the nursery staff at DS1's nursery used to bring her 9 yo to work with her. I didn't have a problem with it.

LynetteScavo · 21/07/2010 22:37

Sorry, that sounded harsher than I meant it too.

LynetteScavo · 21/07/2010 22:37

And now my grammar is shot!

amistillsexy · 21/07/2010 22:38

The pre-school my 2 youngest go to have just had clearance from OFSTED to take children up to 8yo over the holidays, so maybe your pre-school has similar?
You need to check before rushing in with complaints.
I agree with Avantia that it can be an advantage for both the younger and the older children to do this. My oldest boy (6) is really looking forward to going back to pre-school with his brothers this summer.

Ripeberry · 21/07/2010 22:39

Get a life! The over 8yr olds are not even counted and the 5yr old (if) they have finished reception then they are not counted either as they will be on the childcare register (5-8yrs).

Lots of pre-school managers and staff do this especially at this time of year as they can't get childcare for their own kids.

It's either that or they will have to close

Avantia · 21/07/2010 22:40

Is the manager the owner ? is it a commitee run group - go to the commitee or owner.

No reason why you can't give your name just ask that it is not disclosed . If you phone ofsted give them dates , how many children (registered and staff children) were on premises - they may tell you all is OK .

Rudness of the manager is a separate complaint which can still be regisitered if you have no other person to in the settings organisatioon.

Perhasp if two complaints have already been made - do you know the outcome > - perhaps OFSTED are planning a visit soon ? ot that you or staff will know until OFSTED kncok on the door !

Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 22:43

Yes there are other issues which need addressing such as security and planning, mobile phones etc. I will be raising these.

I will check with ofsted if the registration has changed.

TBH I dont think its appropriate for staff to bring their children to work on a regular occassion. They are paid to deliver to an early years setting. There are not an after school or holiday club and should make adqueate arrangements. Just like I have to on an inset day.

Thanks for your input guys.

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NickOfTime · 21/07/2010 22:45

it's quite usual in some settings for this to happen. school age children quite often attend the nurseries round here with the (child carer) mothers in the holidays.

the pay is soooooo appalling that if they had to pay our childminders to look after school age kids they couldn't afford to take the job in the nursery - so you'd be left with a bunch of 17yos looking after all the tinies. in our nurseries it was good to see older childcare workers alongside the very young school-leavers, there were never very many school age kids around tbh. 3 out of 28 sounds fine imho. little kids love to have nig kids around to idol worship.

Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 22:46

Ripeberry: Why get a life? Its a valid query.

Its a managed pre school. The staff are paid in line with other nurseries in the area.

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Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 22:47

Obviously its just as unusual as I thought given everyones experience of this.

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Avantia · 21/07/2010 22:48

Surely its not on a regular occassion ? its been the last three days ? alot of schools have already finished and it sometimes is diffuclt to find cover for your own children

so the choice would be setting close or get bank staff in ?

I realy think that you should perhaps write a letter to the manager outlining your concerns and then perhaps a meeting with her and other parenst ?

also ask to see their polices on security and mobile phones . I amm intrigued as to what has happened at the setting ?

TidyBush · 21/07/2010 22:52

The setting may also be on the compulsory and or voluntary childcare registers,which would make it perfectly acceptable to take older children.

However, as long a ratios are being met then staff bringing in their own children may well make the difference between the setting being able to open or not when staff have no alternative childcare of their own.

If you have a genuine concern that these children being at the setting is compromising the care the younger children receive then you are at liberty to make a complaint to Ofsted. They do prefer for you to have tried to sort out the issue with the provider first. However, if you wish to just go ahead and make an anonymous complaint then they will more than likely just ask the provider to investigate the issue and report back to them.

More info about making a complaint here.

Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 22:55

Im pulling my child out anyway. Dont feel safe in that setting.

Its basically older retired women sitting drinking lots of tea as the children play in a only recently secured grounds adjacent to a grave yard. (one of the compliants ofsted found to be failing)

The manager is constantly on her mobile and if they are outside the front door is regualarly unsecure so the manager can stay outside and not answer it.

She doesnt want to answer into discussion about childs progress as is always in a rush to go and collect her baby.

TBH The last 3 days have shown her lack of commitment to setting as she has just been attending to her (bored) children on every drop off/ pick up.

Can you understand why Im pulling out my child now?

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Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 22:57

Sorry if I sound flippant. Just tired and thinking of who can look after my child tomorrow.

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TidyBush · 21/07/2010 22:58

If you are pulling your child out then why worry about reporting to Ofsted?

If it's as bad as you say then parents will vote with their feet and the business will no longer be viable.

WRT discussing progress - does your child not have a key worker?

BTW when you said "
Its a managed pre school. The staff are paid in line with other nurseries in the area."

How do you know how much the staff are paid?

Avantia · 21/07/2010 22:59

Are you there all the time then ? Manager constantly on the phone outside ?Staff sitting round drinking tea ?

Alot of issues on both sides I feel .

Avantia · 21/07/2010 23:00

Are you a member of staff ?who is a bit pissed off ?

Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 23:06

A friend of my used to work there. I mentioned that it must be run on a volunteer basis as fees were less "She said dont be silly I was paid the same as what I am now. Their really isnt much different in child care pay around here unless you become self employed. The difference is how much the owners make!"

Avantia- No not a member of staff! Drive around alot in my job- nursery is on a busy throughfare...of course I have a look as Im stuck in traffic. Manager doesnt cover up mobile when we are there either...made me wait the other day to discuss an incident whilst she arranged tea with her OH!

Only worry about Ofsted is that its going to obvious its me. Its a small ish town. Dont want to be seen as a trouble maker or over bearing parent.

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Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 23:09

Tidybush...no key worker since she left to go on Mat leave. Manager deals with it now.

RE other parents. There is a high turn over of parents..understand why now!

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TidyBush · 21/07/2010 23:09

TBH, unless you think that children are put at risk in this setting then just walk away and accept that this is not the place for your DC - job done.

Original poster

reporttoofsted · 21/07/2010 23:12

Tidybush:

This is what Im trying to consider now. Writing down the stuff tonight made me realise that there is actually issues that make the setting risky. It more than just the older children. Its opened my eyes to the whole setting.

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