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Original poster

Please help me understand

26 replies

squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 12:04

Hello all, I'll start by explaining that I am not ND but I have a family with several NDs and whilst I have learned an awful lot, there is still so much more I want to understand.

Specifically atm, I am confused with some of the autistic trait within communication.

ASD close one doesn't always reply to messages. I get this. It's. Even a journey but it's cool. The thing I didn't understand is the not replying to the 'merry Christmas, hope you have a lovely day' .... 'happy NY' etc.

I get that some of my messages don't always demand a reply/dint gave anything to say/it's a closed comment so they don't reply etc. but surely being an adult and an adult capable of learning, they would just know to reply with a similar platitude.

I'm not religious. If someone religious says some random religious comment to me 'god bless you' or similar, I'll just say thanks. Not because I believe in their God but because during my many decades on earth I have learned to reply this way.

Why can't my ASD loved one learn to reply in kind. Or just say thank you ?

Be kind. I really want to know.

OP posts:
rochethenut · 31/12/2023 12:05

they will have it on a list to-do
it will be done later
they will do it in a minute after they have just done XYZ

but then the time is never right and the moment passes

or they forget

That’s how it is with my DS

rochethenut · 31/12/2023 12:06

your religious analogy holds no relevance or weight whatsoever

rochethenut · 31/12/2023 12:07

like talking about why someone with a broken ankle doesn’t go for a run

and then saying that even though you don’t like running, you still manage to do it

Original poster
squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 12:37

rochethenut · 31/12/2023 12:07

like talking about why someone with a broken ankle doesn’t go for a run

and then saying that even though you don’t like running, you still manage to do it

Please believe me when I say I'm trying to learn. I really am.

OP posts:
Original poster
squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 12:43

@rochethenut ASD people do learn behaviours though yes? Everyone learns some behaviours. If I go to a foreign country with VERY different and seemingly random and meaningless customs i may never understand them but I can still learn that they are customs. ASD people do still have memory right? So after say 40 years of Christmas's don't you just learn to repeat the same platitudes? Even if they are meaningless and weird to to?

OP posts:
VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 31/12/2023 13:40

I don't see the point of zero-information platitudes so I don't respond to them, nor do I send them. I message or call because I have something that needs to be said.

Let's flip the question and start from the autistic side: other than "because neurotypical people expect it", why should your relative send or reply to zero-data messages?

The main reason for conforming overseas is to avoid being arrested or otherwise punished. Your relative does not fear these outcomes from you, which is a good thing. Even then, simple mimicry can get you into trouble. For example, mimicking religious practices when you aren't a believer in that faith will earn you social censure and in some places a prison sentence. To give an example: I'm not baptised and if I were to unthinkingly mimic other people by going to the alter for wine and wafer at a Catholic funeral where communion was offered, I would be grossly disrespectful. So it's best not to simply mimic what others do but to ask why they do it and who is allowed and expected to take part so that you know whether you are to join in or stand back quietly.

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 31/12/2023 14:08

There are many countries in which blasphemy will get you arrested and several in which it will get you killed. If your thoughtless mimicry of a religious practice is interpreted as "mockery" or otherwise treated as blasphemous, you can get into a lot of trouble.

It's really really important not to blindly mimic behaviours.

Psychoticbreak · 31/12/2023 14:48

Not responding to being insulted as an atheist by being told 'god bless you' is nothing to do with my asd it is because I find it offensive.

GetTheGoodLookingGuy · 31/12/2023 15:23

For me, it's a combination of things:

  1. I genuinely don't know what to reply/overthink what to reply (should I say "you too"? - no that doesn't feel like enough effort. If I copy what they've said that's just copying, etc)
  2. I don't understand the flow of the conversation and don't want to force the other person into replying to my reply to their message when they'd be happy with the conversation ending
  3. When I'm already stressed/overwhelmed, responding to messages can feel like too much of a demand. In that case, I can either keep stressing about it and eventually reply (sometimes days later as I need that processing time) or look at the message, craft a reply in my head, then feel like I've replied (although I actually haven't) and then forget to actually reply.
Original poster
squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 15:23

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 31/12/2023 14:08

There are many countries in which blasphemy will get you arrested and several in which it will get you killed. If your thoughtless mimicry of a religious practice is interpreted as "mockery" or otherwise treated as blasphemous, you can get into a lot of trouble.

It's really really important not to blindly mimic behaviours.

Edited

You are right. But surely replying to a commonly used greeting that you have heard for your entire life is not dangerous. Isn't that just a learned response? Like learning to say 'hello' when someone greets you?

OP posts:
Original poster
squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 15:24

GetTheGoodLookingGuy · 31/12/2023 15:23

For me, it's a combination of things:

  1. I genuinely don't know what to reply/overthink what to reply (should I say "you too"? - no that doesn't feel like enough effort. If I copy what they've said that's just copying, etc)
  2. I don't understand the flow of the conversation and don't want to force the other person into replying to my reply to their message when they'd be happy with the conversation ending
  3. When I'm already stressed/overwhelmed, responding to messages can feel like too much of a demand. In that case, I can either keep stressing about it and eventually reply (sometimes days later as I need that processing time) or look at the message, craft a reply in my head, then feel like I've replied (although I actually haven't) and then forget to actually reply.

This all rings true. Thank you.

OP posts:
rochethenut · 31/12/2023 16:15

squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 12:43

@rochethenut ASD people do learn behaviours though yes? Everyone learns some behaviours. If I go to a foreign country with VERY different and seemingly random and meaningless customs i may never understand them but I can still learn that they are customs. ASD people do still have memory right? So after say 40 years of Christmas's don't you just learn to repeat the same platitudes? Even if they are meaningless and weird to to?

but perhaps responding to you simply isn’t sufficiently important enough for them to pull on their learner behaviours

i have a happy new year message from a neighbour. i’ve not replied yet because, i can’t be faffed!

rochethenut · 31/12/2023 16:15

and i am NT!

rochethenut · 31/12/2023 16:16

whereas my brother messaged me and i responded in a nano second because he is most definitely a priority of mine

Original poster
squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 16:23

rochethenut · 31/12/2023 16:15

and i am NT!

But if you are NT the. You are resists a NT. I want to know what a ND is experiencing. You may not respond because you. Ant be bothered but this doesn't tell me anything about why a ND specifically ASD may not be responding

OP posts:
Original poster
squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 16:23

Autocorrect messed up my it's. Hopefully you can figure it out!!

OP posts:
VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 31/12/2023 16:41

GetTheGoodLookingGuy · 31/12/2023 15:23

For me, it's a combination of things:

  1. I genuinely don't know what to reply/overthink what to reply (should I say "you too"? - no that doesn't feel like enough effort. If I copy what they've said that's just copying, etc)
  2. I don't understand the flow of the conversation and don't want to force the other person into replying to my reply to their message when they'd be happy with the conversation ending
  3. When I'm already stressed/overwhelmed, responding to messages can feel like too much of a demand. In that case, I can either keep stressing about it and eventually reply (sometimes days later as I need that processing time) or look at the message, craft a reply in my head, then feel like I've replied (although I actually haven't) and then forget to actually reply.

All of this as well. So when I recognise a message as "white noise", I don't bother with replying to it.

"How's things?" requires a mental flowchart to resolve.

I learnt years ago that some people will use the default "white noise" response of "OK, thanks" against you. I've also recently been reminded by a workplace bully that it is wise to be circumspect about what you share with others because some people will use information against you. This means that I have to evaluate the situation and the person to decide how to answer "how's things?". Is this someone who will use the "white noise" answer against me if it's not actually true? Will they use the honest answer against me? Who else is within earshot? Do I want this person to know that I came down with a migraine last night, went to bed early, and was woken at 4am by the cat throwing up? Will it harm me later if I don't tell them this?

Or I can ignore the question and acknowledge that person (if physically present) by saying "morning" or "hello". Which is what I now do, if I don't trust that person with the honest answer, because I don't like lying.

rochethenut · 31/12/2023 16:47

squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 16:23

But if you are NT the. You are resists a NT. I want to know what a ND is experiencing. You may not respond because you. Ant be bothered but this doesn't tell me anything about why a ND specifically ASD may not be responding

Show quote history

I and people have explained

you either haven’t got it or faux naivety

Original poster
squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 18:57

@rochethenut people have indeed been helpful and I have thanked them. You seem to be offended that I wasn't interested in your NT response. Sorry. It's not what I was asking about.

OP posts:
rochethenut · 31/12/2023 18:59

not at all offended. i posted upthread about my ND son.

second point was to explain that you can’t be sure someone not responding to you is doing that due to ASD or simply preference.

BlackeyedSusan · 02/01/2024 20:10

Ex has never learned that if he doesn't answer I don't know whether he has heard me. He replies there wasn't a question. I haven't learned to ask him a question if I want a response.

AmethystSparkles · 02/01/2024 20:27

Well it totally depends on the autistic person.

My DS19 probably would reply and he does make an effort to do the right thing but he’s very shy and reserved and he might sometimes get it wrong. He’s not very good at initiating contact with people.

Other DS21 just doesn’t particularly care what anyone thinks of him. He never replies to my texts and only answers the phone about ten percent of the time. If I said I was upset, he’d probably be annoyed. He doesn’t seem to see the connection between being friendly and having friends.

I’d usually reply although occasionally I forget and occasionally I get a bit of a mental block about doing a particular thing. My social skills are very well developed now (I’m 51) and I’m very much the ‘social smoother’. I used to be far more stroppy!

Original poster
squigglygiggly · 03/01/2024 13:28

It's so helpful just to be reminded by posters that it's normal. As for ASD people who need content reminders and reassurance so do NT people. I find being reminded that it is very usual helps me. Hopefully I will one day be able to be fully integrated with ND so I'm not initially measuring behaviours against NT behaviours.

OP posts:
llamadrama16 · 04/01/2024 22:06

squigglygiggly · 31/12/2023 12:43

@rochethenut ASD people do learn behaviours though yes? Everyone learns some behaviours. If I go to a foreign country with VERY different and seemingly random and meaningless customs i may never understand them but I can still learn that they are customs. ASD people do still have memory right? So after say 40 years of Christmas's don't you just learn to repeat the same platitudes? Even if they are meaningless and weird to to?

Yes we can learn. But every day I need to remember to do very basic things to just keep myself going. I have to set timers to remind myself to eat. Thankfully I have a very strong pelvic floor because I quite often register the need for the loo, but then get distracted until I'm absolutely bursting.

I personally have hardly any habits and find it nearly impossible to form them. Every week it's a shock to me we need more groceries. For a lot of ASD/ADHDers just doing normal life will have us expelling 200% of the energy (both mental and often physical) that a neurotypical does.

GlitteryDirt · 11/01/2024 18:08

Maybe they don't like you.

Maybe they don't value text messages

Maybe they don't feel the need to reply as there was no question

Why don't you ask them: "I've noticed you don't reply to my messages...would you prefer me not to message you?"

"I've noticed you don't reply to my messages, why is that?"