Feeling at a loss, no way forward

[Schomer]

I’m having some chest pains and I’m praying it’s cancer. Because I don’t want to carry on any more. I’m tired of trying and failing.

I studied for a degree but nobody would hire me afterwards. So I tried to improve my chances by doing postgraduate qualifications but still nobody would hire me. Because I’m autistic. Because, despite being educated and capable, I don’t fit into a team and people don’t like me. Employers will hire someone less qualified, less hard working, if they’re more fun to sit next to at lunchtime.

Feedback is always that I’m very smart and skilled but I need to smile, make eye contact, build rapport, be less withdrawn and more friendly. All things that I’m not capable of because of my autism. I’ve wasted tens of thousands of pounds and years of my life on education, only to discover that I’m unemployable because of something I can’t change.

Now I’m stuck with the dregs. Scraping by in minimum wage jobs just to pay the bills. No opportunities. No future. I whinged to a neighbour who said “well you should have worked harder at school, why don’t you get a student loan and do a degree”. Because people don’t know that I already worked incredibly hard all the way to postgraduate level and the problem is that the NT gatekeepers are excluding me from employment. And now my inability to get a good job is negatively affecting my child too.

I don’t know what to do. Usually when people aren’t happy they get told to go and study a qualification for a different career. But I have three degrees already and getting another won’t solve anything. There’s no point in continuing to apply for jobs - I’ve been applying for ten years now and I already know how I’m going to be judged. And even if I somehow succeed in getting a good job I know I’d struggle with the social requirements and end up having to quit or being fired. I am just totally at a loss.

Just a couple of questions - are you disclosing that you're autistic in interviews, or to recruiters?

What jobs are you going for?

Is what you’ve studied something you’re passionate about?

I work in engineering and manage to blag/mask my way through interviews.

I do find the workplace stressful though and struggle with all the social dynamics.

however, engineering is known to be quite niche and I think it’s to be expected that people aren’t neurotypical. A company needs those brilliant people who are skilled. They can’t just rely on people who aren’t as good but are better in an office.

You sound very hardworking and im sure if you found the right company, they’d accept some neurodiversity for the company to grow and succeed.

what is the feedback frok your interviews? Are you assuming it’s because of autism? Maybe you need to practice some interview techniques to sell yourself more effectively?

No I don’t disclose that I’m autistic. I think that would count against me. The employer would undoubtedly choose another candidate who doesn’t have any problems or need any adjustments.

Yes I am very passionate about my field of study. Feedback is always that I’m passionate, knowledgeable, have achieved highly at university, my portfolio of work is impressive - but they won’t be hiring me because they feel I’m not a team player, wouldn’t fit in, didn’t make eye contact, not friendly enough, didn’t say hello or smile enough, etc. Basically all of the things that are caused by my autism.

And now I’ve been doing parenting and minimum wage jobs for ten years, so my qualifications are outdated. Employers are suspicious why I haven’t had a proper job since graduating. I’m trying to refresh my skills now my youngest started school last September, I started applying for jobs again but just getting the same old bullshit feedback.

It’s just with it being the end of the year, people are talking about their plans for next year and I basically have no future. Because it doesn’t matter how hard I work, nobody will hire me because I’m autistic.

I relate to your post so well even right down to wishing I had cancer because sometimes my future just seems unbearable, yet I keep putting on a mask and pretending that I'm fine.
Ditto to finding a job, I'm disabled now due to a disability I've had since since I was just 20, but even before that I struggled to even get a minimum wage job, went for interview after interview and nobody would ever hire me. I even went back to some places and they ignored me or wouldn't give me a straight answer as to why they wouldn't give me a chance. I really wish I could offer you more words of consolation because I know how absolutely crap and ableist it all is, but I just wanted to let you know I get it and have been through the same stuff aswell xx

Honestly...it's worth disclosing. First to the recruiters, because they'll know which of their clients are more likely to want to take advantage of everything that autistic folk bring to the table, but secondly to the potential employers.

Apart from the fact that it will explain why you're not making eye contact and the like, it also puts them in a position where they know that it's illegal to use the lack of social norms against you, so they're forced to consider why they're deciding against you (if they do at all) in detail enough that it could stand up to scrutiny; "I didn't get the right feeling about her" is in no way enough for that. All of the reasons you've been given for rejection are flat-out illegal once you tell them you're autistic, and absolutely no company wants to be on the receiving end of that discrimination lawsuit in this day and age.

It also takes the load off you in the interview itself, because you can explain up front that you might need a moment to formulate an answer, and then use that to get yourself in the right frame of mind if you're surprised by a question.

Hell, you can even use it to explain why you haven't had a job which takes advantage of your qualifications.

I've been doing this for years, and I've always had positive interviews where I actually wanted the job. Social acceptance of neurodivergence has changed massively in the last few years...please, rather than give up, try to take advantage of it.

Look at it this way: your current strategy of trying to pass for NT isn't working. Trying this new approach can't actually give worse results, so why not try it?

Don't employers get brownie points for employing disabled people. It's a sign they are following equality laws - so some eg in my DD's case want females - or disabled people.

I'm just a lay person but I would think admitting you are autistic could be helpful.

Disclose away, it can't make things any worse can it?

Are you getting PIP?

No I’m not eligible for PIP. I don’t have any mobility issues, I’m physically fit and I can plan and complete journeys on my own. I can cook and feed myself and my child. I don’t need any help to wash or use the toilet. I can remember stuff like taking medication. I have postgraduate qualifications and I’m excellent at understanding written information. I can manage my money by myself. Etc.

What I struggle with is face to face interaction. And I can accomplish that effectively enough to get on with my life. People have no problem talking to me when it’s their job to do so. The problem is that when they have a CHOICE about interacting with me, they don’t want to. I have no friends. Nobody will employ me. Nobody wants to collaborate with me, or do business with me, or anything else with me.

I CAN talk to people, it’s just nobody wants me to. Because they find me awkward and uncomfortable, because I don’t smile or make eye contact, because I have a squeaky voice and an odd way of speaking, because I don’t talk much and I’m quiet and withdrawn, and I can’t build rapport or share interests with anyone. I tend to rabbit on about stuff that only I find interesting, and basically nobody likes me. And this is a barrier to everything. I can’t make a decent life for myself because nobody will hire me and nobody will be my friend. And I’ve now realised that to a certain extent these are the same thing: employers don’t hire an amazing applicant who’s a weirdo, they hire an average applicant who’s an average person that they don’t mind sitting next to for lunch.

All of the reasons you've been given for rejection are flat-out illegal once you tell them you're autistic
They can’t get in trouble if they keep it secret. If I disclose my autism they still reject me for being autistic, but to comply with the law they make up an excuse about “more suitable candidates” or “lack of experience”. Whereas if I don’t disclose my autism, then they tell me the truth about why they’re not hiring me. And it’s always because of my autism.

What about starting with volunteering with an autism organisation then seeing if they will employ you eventually. Or see if they could offer you some kind of interview coaching?

If you can just get started in a job it's very hard for them to sack you for autistic traits once they have employer obligations towards you. (These start from day one)

But...it's literally the only thing you can change about your approach, beyond spending a few years learning to mask better (which isn't a sustainable solution).

What do you have to lose by trying it? Put bluntly, you're on the wrong end of a binary choice made by somebody else here, so the results can't get any worse.

And...people can sometimes surprise you. You're making an awful lot of assumptions about people you haven't met yet, and while I don't know which sector you're aiming for...those assumptions just aren't borne out by my experience in a number of sectors (specifically finance, TV and entertainment, government IT, farming, and clothing manufacturing).

There is a way forward here, you just don't seem to want to try it. That's fine, I'm not here to force you into anything. I just don't see any other option (well, other than giving up entirely on the idea of fulfilling employment, which is also a choice).

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Hi OP, my close family member hires for a big tech firm and they actually view ASD as a positive, as some of their brightest individuals (who profit the organisation the most) have ASD - it's not just lip service. Obviously they'll tailor the role to maximise your strengths (not for your benefit, but theirs!) and avoid your weaknesses (so maybe no/less client facing) as well.

If you were able to mask (and yes, it's absolutely unfair that you have to mask in the first place), on balance it might be better not to disclose. But gently, if you're already consistently not getting the job, it really does seem like you don't have anything to lose from disclosing.

Think of it this way: if a neurotypical individual could be friendly and warm, but simply didn't want to, this might indicate arrogance or them not actually wanting to be at that company, maybe thinking it beneath them. This will affect the actual quality of the work they do for that company.

But if you disclose you had ASD, employers know you aren't just being unfriendly or standoffish. With general awareness around ASD, many companies will know social differences don't affect output/quality of actual work as well. Some will still have some prejudice, but just cast your net wider and go for those that don't – the worst that can happen is the situation remains the same (no callbacks from interviewers).