Prestigious orchestras or music programs for a gifted 14yr old violinist

[User112]

This is for a lovely 14yr old who I met at my niece’s birthday party. She is incredibly talented - plays violin at grade7/8 level. Not much of support/encouragement from school other than opportunities to play in the school orchestra.

are there any highly valued orchestras or music programs that she can aim for ? She wants to pursue music at uni but not sure yet (money bit I guess).

How come you are looking at this? Where are their parents or their teacher that has got them to pass their violin exams?

Without meaning to sound like a total arse - unless you've heard her play and were blown away, then for 'prestigious orchestras' at age 14 then grade 7/8 on violin might not be high enough. Lots are grade 8 plus. Depending on where in the country she is there are possibly sat music centres or local authority options. She could also audition for National youth Orchestra or perhaps the 'inspire' program if she is at state school?

Grade 7 at 14 is good but not precociously talented unless she's recently started or violin is her second instrument.

Most of my kids friends who have had lessons for a while are gr 5/6± in 2 or 3 instruments at 12/13.

When my friends were looking to study music they all needed gr8 in their first instrument, keyboard at gr5 (minimum) and I think most had another instrument at this level or higher.

Agree local authority music service is a good place to start.

@northerngoldilocks you are not being an arse, I think being that standard at that age is quite common too, they are good, maybe good enough to study music, but I was wondering why their violin teacher isn't suggesting orchestras and progression routes to them? Mine always did.

Royal College of Music does weekend classes for young gifted musicians. I expect other music colleges in other areas do also. National Youth Orchestra as mentioned above. I am pretty sure that if her violin teacher / local LA music centre thought it worth while they would have already pursued options.

It depends where in the country she is. Most counties have a county youth orchestra which she would certainly be good enough for. She may not be good enough (yet) for the National Youth Orchestra, unless she's especially musical, particularly if she hasn't experience in her country youth orchestra.

There may well be several amateur orchestras in the area who would likely be very keen an on enthusiastic player to bolster their ranks, but depending on where she lives it would depend on someone being able to give her lifts in the evenings/at weekends.

Maybe you should have been more upfront with circumstances, rather than drip feeding and being offensive. Has she passed any violin exams? If not, how do you know what standard she is?

Ps I didn't go to private school

If she's in kinship care/under an SGO, her school and social workers should be doing something to support this, as it's completely the sort of thing that the additional funding in her personal LAC budget should be used for.

She should also be eligible for free or mere pennies in terms of music lessons due to being in the LAC group (SGOs are recognised as being part of the care system by 90% of schools and music services). And if they're finding it that hard financially, you have checked they are claiming all the benefits they are entitled to, haven't you? It doesn't matter what their age is, they should be claiming.

some of you being total jealous arses - saying it’s no big deal being grade 7/8 at that age. It is a very big deal given her circumstances and the shit she put up with. She didn’t have the privilege your darling children have - safe home, loving family, money - nothing. So you can fuck right off with your private school snobbishness. This child beats your prepped up moneyed washed kids any day with sheer talent

huge drip feed- and the replies weren’t arsey or jealous, it was pointed out that this grade isn’t exceptional in normal circumstance where a kid is have lessons, either privately or through school. Posters did caveat if she’s recently taken up the violin or other circumstances.

im not asking for prestigious orchestras/programs she can go in right now

again, maybe you should have made that clear then?

don’t get cross at people when you weren’t clear
in your o/p. You got answers to the question you asked.

if the grandmother is capable of teaching violin to grade 8 she can’t be utterly ignorant of the mucus world- unless there’s another drip feed coming that she doesn’t speak English…

if you have no idea about local provision best bet is to ask the school head of music- do they know she plays? Is she going to do music gcse?

that or google the council head of music, often the LEA outsources.

if she does want to prep for a prestigious school then she will need help from those in the know, not a friends mum.

she could also look at some of those snobby private schools, many have bursaries for talented kids. Chetham’s for example. But again, that’s best being organised by a professional who can vouch for her ability.

It's good of you to be looking out for this girl's wider interests OP.
For the snarky pps muttering that G7 isn't gifted, it doesn't matter if she's gifted or not but every child deserves the opportunity to develop their talents, and I suspect that the school orchestra doesn't stretch her.
My DS has got a huge amount out of playing in a local youth orchestra. Some of the kids in it are gifted of course, I suspect most aren't, but they are dedicated, passionate about music and thrive with the support of brilliant staff.
Without knowing where you are in UK it's hard to advise on options. If you're in London PM me and I'll send you the info I have.
Try Googling, asking the 'big' ones if they have any suggestions for smaller local orchestra if appropriate.
IME music organisations all have bursaries for accessibility, so encourage her to be clear about her circumstances. By supporting her further involvement in music you could be giving her a life long benefit.
My DS is not doing music at uni, but making his choices based on the musical activities available there, and the music is a great way to meet likeminded people, as well as a source of pleasure in itself.

OP, you are doing a lovely thing. we are also currently helping to advise and support a talented young man (friend of our ds) who does not have the advantage of the same level of support and money that our own son has (although he did have an inspirational school music teacher who subsidised his lessons.) He is taking a year out and applying for conservatoire this year. Easier for us to help as dh is a conservatoire graduate and music teacher himself (he is going to give him free theory lessons) and ds is off to conservatoire in September so he has some knowledge.

I would see whether she is in feasible distance of any Junior Departments. There may be bursaries to help with costs. Is she in any county ensembles? Depending which school/teacher she goes to she may not even have been told about these. My dh knows lots of students who were never aware that they were available. Some schools are better at promoting this sort of stuff than others and it will depend partly on both her home postcode and which local authority her school is in.

And as for being "only" Grade 8 by age 14. Dh only began lessons aged 14. He was Grade 8 by 18 and got into conservatoire aged 20. Dh firted with a couple of other instruments aged 10 onwards but only began lessons on his current instrument aged 14 and is about to go off to conservatoire aged 18 (on a foundation year but he is guaranteed onto their main degree as long as he passes.

if the grandmother is capable of teaching violin to grade 8 she can’t be utterly ignorant of the mucus world- unless there’s another drip feed coming that she doesn’t speak English…

Things move on so quickly. Dh for example moved into a different area of music teaching (MT vocal coaching) so is totally out of touch with much of the classical world and it is only because he spent some time teaching for a music service that still knows about some of what is available there. Much of it was not around when he and I learnt and I suspect the grandmother is much older than him.

It is often tricky to know what is available and no one suggested that this girl might not one day be suitable for playing in prestigious orchestras but that wasn't what was asked and it looked like it escalated quickly. Asking what options might be available in x area for a 14 yr old violinist around gr 7/8 level would probably have got more useful replies as there are lots of things but they're area dependent.

A final point on levels - yes those at Indi schools often much further ahead but the difference between being good at a standard school and then moving into specialist music provision eg Sat schools is really staggering - just because it's a self selecting group of those 1 or 2 kids at each school all pulled together

Call her local council or look on thheir website under music
Saturday music schools
County level orchestra
Etc

If she is in a state school then the nyo inspire programme would be ideal for her. I think the auditions are every spring though. Other than that local/county youth orchestras are a good option. It's true that for junior Rcm etc a lot of kids are grade 8 by the end of primary school but they also look at potential and circumstances. However the child's teacher is probably the best person to advise them.

It really depends where you are. Something like this offers multiple instrument tuition, ensemble playing and theory for £30 a term
livewp.maccmusiccentre.org.uk/mmc-groups-timetable/
I'm expecting significant vitriole for suggesting something not on her doorstep. But what do I know, from my little village state school and local secondary school.

Oh, and if she's playing violin, she won't be in the mucus world, that's the brass...

I would second county youth orchestra and NYO Inspire, it's competitive but she's just the kind of person they are looking for and it's fantastic experience. Then maybe NYO a couple of years down the line.

Conservatoire junior departments also good if she has access to one.

It's true that grade 7/8 at 14 is not that unusual even in (gasp) state schools but no need to kick off, people are just trying to suggest good options for her from the information in your OP.

I can't see the previous messages as they look to have been deleted for privacy concerns.

I dont have much to add except that the bloody school needs to step up. LAC/,PLAC children and young people get hefty pupil premium plus payments and the virtual school head should be absolutely behind this talented kid. Yeah, loads of kids are at grade 7 or 8 at this age. LAC or PLAC... not so much. Sorry for the acronyms. These young people aren't their labels. Good luck to them though. And good on you for advocating on their behalf.