Help!! Carpet fitter has just stormed out. AIBU?

[whenskiesaregrey]

Sorry for rambling state of this post, I am a bit upset about the way I have just been spoken to. Also, sorry for the length of the post, I just want to include all the detail.

I ordered some carpet last week to be fitted today. It is a local small carpet shop, not part of a chain. They offer a 'free fitting service', but you pay 75% of the price in the shop, and the remainder once fitted. I presume this is because they sub-contract out the fitting. In my case this was £150 in the shop, and £50 once fitted. I have bought carpet and fitting from this shop before, and the fitting service wasn't great, but they said they were using a different company that day, so I gave them the benefit of the doubt and ordered from them again. In the shop, I mentioned the problems I had had last time (punctuality, not taking old carpet away) and asked for reassurance that the service would be better this time. I was assured it would be.

Carpet was due to be delivered at 9am. At half past 9, no-one had turned up, so I rang the shop asking where they were. I was told they had has a couple of problems this morning and only had one fitter on instead of two, and they might be able to fit me in a 2pm today. I can't do that time as DS has a party 2-4pm, and I work Wed-Fri, so this morning really was the only time this week that was suitable. I explained to the man on the phone that I has problems last time, and was told it would be better this time. So he said he would move some things around, and fit me in about 10am this morning.

At 10, two men arrived to fit the carpet. In the bedroom, the furniture we had left in there was a double bed, a wardrobe, and chester of drawers and two little side units. We had been told in the shop not to worry about moving any furniture out of the room, that they would move it around the room to fit it. DH had taken the mirrored doors off the wardrobe to make it lighter to move, and we had moved all of the other usual bedroom stuff out of the room. The chest of drawers were half empty, just had underwear in them. The bed still had the bedding on it because I didn't think it would make any difference. The little side units did have things in them, but they really are very small, so I thought they be okay. I am 27+ weeks pregnant with PGP, so it is a bit difficult to move things around.

He went to the bedroom and looked around and sighed. The said, you're going to need to get those clothes out of that wardrobe. There wasn't very much in there because we are getting new wardrobes, so it was just a few things to keep us going until the new stuff arrived. I said I would move it, but it shouldn't make much different to the weight. He said if he tried to move the wardrobe, it would collapse, which I said wasn't true as we have just decorated, and have been moving the wardrobe around so we could get to the walls. But I still carried on moving the clothes. He then started opening the drawers in the chest of drawers, which have my underwear etc in. I said the drawers are almost empty, so the underwear shoudn't make any difference to the weight. He then picked up the small unit and dragged it around the room in a way that the drawers all fell forward and the unit nearly tipped up. I said to him that I would move it if he was going to move it like that, and moved the other unit out of the room. He then said 'look love, I'm doing you a favour here, I could leave you to move it by yourself if you want'. By the point, the other lad had turned the double bed up on to its side and was leaning against the window. I said to the first lad that I understood that he has obviously had a busy morning and he didn't have much patience, but I had been waiting for the delivery too. He said 'no patience?! I shouldn't even be here. I'm not staying here and taking this. Do you want me to go'. I said to him if he wanted to go, he should go, but it's his job to fit the carpet. He shouted to the other lad, 'right, we're off', stormed down the stairs and got in the van. The other lad looked a bit sheepish, and I said 'so is he just going to go, leaving the bed on its side and all the furniture like that'. I am quite obviously pregnant, and DS was playing downstairs and shouting to me, so it was obvious that I would not be able to move the furniture back. He said he would have a word with him, but once he had got in the van, they drove off. So the bedroom is left with the very heavy oak double bed on its side, a unit in the middle of the floor, and they left the door open as they stormed out.

I rang the shop and explained that I thought the fitter was very rude, and what was going to happen now. He said that they had done me a favour by moving the other appointments round to fit me in at 10am, and they were wasting time on the phone at the moment, and other appointments needed to be done. He then said it is in my best interest to be flexible with the delivery time, because I wont get my £150 deposit back, because they have ordered the carpet. I then tried to reiterate how rude the fitter had been to me. Apparently the fitter had told the lad in the shop that I refused to move anything out of the room, and that is why he left. Now, if the shop had explained to us to make sure wardrobes were empty, drawers were empty etc, then we would have done it. We told them when we ordered it it was for a bedroom, so you would know the type of furniture would be in there. But we were told that we did not need to get any furniture out of the room, the fitters would work around it.

Was I being unreasonable to the fitter? Is it true I can't get my money back on the carpet? I don't want that fitter back in the house, he really was so horrible to me. I understand he has obviously had a busy day, and I said that to him, but at the end of the day, that isn't my fault and he shouldn't take it out on me. I also don't like the suggestion from the shop that they are doing me a favour by re-arranging the delivery for me, when I have paid for a carpet and fitting, and that is what I expected.

I am pretty upset at the moment, which is probably all pregnancy hormones. I got a bit upset on the phone to the shop, so he said he would ring me back 'when I had calmed down'. So I am waiting for them to call back now. Where do I stand?

Thank you if you read this far!!

That is utterly ridiculous what the CAB have said. I wouldn't want that rude man back in my houses either.

Rhubarb's advice is good

houses? house

Surely they've already broken their obligation to fulfil the contract, by storming out of the house and refusing to move the furniture and do what they agreed to in the first place.

If that really is the legal position, then I would let them back in the house, with all the furniture in the room and make them fit the carpet, according to the terms of your agreement. I would just remove the drawers from the cabinets though.

Have had a quick look on trading standards website. What are the implications of emailing them? Is it going to mean correspondence with the shop. I am not after compensation or anything, I want nothing more to do with them really. Do I just email Trading Standards, and they log it, or are they going to ask what I want them to do about it? Because if DH gets the refund tomorrow, then there isn't any more I want from them.

Also, thank you Rhubarb and everyone else who has fought my corner!

I would also like to point out regarding "times" as floor laying is the "last" trade we do get held up quite a lot. Also job's are planned so for the fitters to go away and come back again when furniture is moved isn't how it works.

Why not tell the shop that you will still have the carpet fitted but not by the ones that came before? Otherwise, yes you will be cutting your nose of to a degree. Also ask for a percentage to be taken off due to what has transpired (this may appease your partner)

Did the shop give you a copy of their terms and conditions?

Oh, sorry forgot to say, as i stated before there is no such thing as free fitting so it would have been built into the price somewhere (very wrong and misleading) therefore to take the goods and get them fitted by others will be more costly.

Too late for the OP now but I always record phone calls to official organisations such as IRS, and health providers. I also record phone calls involving significant financial transactions or sales services.

I have learned about the need to do this the hard way. 'They' may claim to have no record of what is said/agreed. But I have.

As much as I want my carpet to be fitted, think that ship has sailed with DH. He is a right stubborn arse, so he won't be changing his mind on that I think, especially as they have upset me.

I don't have a copy of terms and conditions, just a receipt.

Ok, so if they would agree to deliver the carpet, so that you could get your own fitters - would that be an option?

OK, the shop is clearly being unreasonable but I think a lot of people are missing the point that I and others have made that there is a difference between suggesting the OP moves furniture (clearly out of the question for a pregnant women) and expecting that the OP and her husband would have emptied the furniture that was to be moved and taken the bedclothes off (cos they are sure as hell going to come off and fall in a heap when the bed is upended).

I'd agree with CAB's advice. I think the situation is all stirred up now by the husband going into the shop. The fitters should not have been rude but this has been made unnecessarily stressful by the way it has been handled. the shop will be reluctant to offer a refund as the carpet will have been cut to size for fitting today, so they will lose money unless they can find someone with exactly the same size room who wants the same carpet!

I think the best solution at this point would be to arrange a meeting/call with the manager and explain you want the carpet fitted by another fitter. And empty the furniture for them before they get there!

eurochick, you are missing the point here.

The shop advertises that they provide free fittings and that they fit around furniture. It says so on the posters in the shop windows. This is the service the OP wanted and paid for and double checked with the shop assistant.

I would get a photo of the posters before they pull them down.

OP, you need to email Trading Standards and detail everything that has happened. You do not need to contact the shop again. They are able to pose as customers to see what services are offered by the shop, my BIL works for Trading Standards and they often pose as customers to find out what is being offered.

They can also check the company against their records to see if they have had similar complaints. They will investigate this for you and if the company are in breach of their contract then they can be taken to court.

As you have a receipt for goods paid for but not received you can quote the Supply of Goods and Services Act. You are entitled to a FULL refund. Tell your dh to threaten them with court if necessary.

I feel for you OP, just reading this thread makes me want to bang my head against the wall.
As others have said you can claim your money back through the bank, you just have to go in and tell them you want to file a direct debit indemnity and they pay you the money straight away and claim it back from the shop.
I hope you get it sorted.

It's worth finding out if the company are listed with The Carpet Foundation which adheres to a code of practice. I'm quoting from their own website as to what its code of conduct is:

Any delays in delivery and installation will be notified to the consumer as soon as possible. Where unreasonable delays occur the consumer may be offered alternative products.

1. In the case of unreasonable delays in delivery and installation the consumer may cancel the order and receive a full repayment of any deposit.

The Carpet Foundation Member will inform the consumer what needs to be done to prepare the site for installation eg., furniture removal, disconnecting sound systems, computers, TVs, door removal etc.

1. Carpet Foundation Members will provide clear written quotations with details of what is, and what is not included in the quotation. Where additional work is required eg., removal and trimming of doors, moving furniture, disconnecting sound systems etc., any additional charges incurred will be specified.

1. The removal and disposal of the old carpet and underlay, together with any waste, may be charged for separately where indicated and agreed with the consumer.

I'm about the advertising of 'we'll fit around your furniture'. What's the wording? It seems like a bizzare thing for a carpet shop to advertise in my view because it's not really possible is it? I can see the service being offered if asked for and discussed (it should have been clarified a lot better in this instance what that meant) but it just seems odd to advertise it. It seems obvious it would be an additional extra service and as someone else pointed out £50 between 2 workers and a van for furniture moving, fitting, disposal etc is not a lot of money.

Anyway, the whole thing is a big shitty mess. OP I'd ask for the carpet to be delivered and not fitted as the relationship has broken down to such a point this won't be feesable. Then get the yellow pages out and find a fitter - although I suspect most will charge more than £50 for it.

A direct debit indemnity won't help with a debit card payment.

If it's Visa Debit you do have cover, not as quickly as if it were just straight Visa but you should get your money back that way.

People fit around large items of furniture all the time, taking. It's fiddly and it takes longer, but it is entirely within the ability of good fitters. I'm really surprised by all the people who seem to think it's a weird request like getting your bed fitters to sew your duvet cover.

They might also be members of The Furniture Ombudsman in which case you can make a complaint through them.

According to the government you have a right of complaint if:

The law states that any furniture you buy from a trader must be:
?as described ? match the description on packaging or what the trader told you
?of satisfactory quality, eg the furniture?s seams should not be coming apart
?fit for purpose ? fit for the use described and any specific use you made clear to the trader, eg a folding table should fold

If your furniture doesn?t meet any of the above points, it is faulty and you usually have the right to a repair, replacement or refund.

If you buy furniture online or by phone, fax or mail order, you will usually have seven working days to:
?cancel your order
?return the furniture once it?s been delivered

And this is what a professional carpet fitting company advertise as part of their services:

Who moves the furniture?
Although most installers will remove furnishings from the room, you should remove all breakable itemslike vases, lamps, collectibles, and dishesbefore the installer arrives. You should detach wiring from TVs, VCRs, stereos, and computers. You should also clear desktops, tabletops, and bookshelves.
Will they move the piano?
The complimentary removal of furniture is often limited to those items that two men can easily handle. Some retailers may charge an additional fee for large, cumbersome items, including pianos, pool tables, aquariums, and oversized furniture. All of these items may vary by retailer and you will need to verify this with them before installation

Just googling "carpet fitting moving furniture" and it appears that some companies will and some won't. It doesn't appear to be unusual at all but most state either way.

It appears that this company stated that they did. Therefore they are obliged to do just that, regardless of whether or not their fitters agreed with the policy or were even informed of it, your contract is with the company and NOT the fitters.

We've recently done up our house and had 4 carpets fitted by the same company and they moved the furniture and worked around it.

My DH works away and I am now 30 weeks pregnant. If we were to get a carpet fitted now there is no way I could move anything.

Some carpet places do work around furniture.

Yes it's possible but as you say, it's fiddly and takes longer and isn't a standard expectation - in my experience. Also one or two large items which aren't easily moved (like a bed, sofa) left in a room isn't unreasonable, small items and drawers that could've been moved are.

I think if I paid £200 for carpet, underlay, delivery AND fitting for a double bedroom, this would be a big red flag as to the kind of quality and/or service I would be receiving.

John Powell carpets:

If moving furniture, uplifting your old carpet and disposing of it is a problem, dont worry we can arrange to do it for you.

We pride ourselves in providing a reliable, helpfull, friendly service for all our customers.

On Call Carpets:

• Moving Furniture (domestic) ~ We can move domestic furniture, but need prior warning. We ask for breakables to be removed and any cabinet or piece of furniture must be emptied by yourselves so we can move it on the day of the carpet fitting.

Carpet King:

We offer a full carpeting fitting service, from moving furniture, removing old carpet, disposing of old carpet, supplying and fitting underlay, gripper and laying the new carpet.

Webro Carpet:

Webro Carpet & Flooring was established in 1958 and we pride ourselves on family run values and advice. We like to offer our customers a whole service, and this includes taking up old carpets, moving furniture and fitting your new floor.

That puts pay to the argument some have used that this service is NOT offered and NOT normal. Those companies were all on the first page of Google. Of course there are companies who don't move furniture and companies who charge extra. All make this very clear. From what the OP says, the company she went with made it very clear that the carpet removal and the moving of furniture was included in their services. Which is why she went with them and no-one else.

£200 to deliver and fit a small bedroom seems reasonable enough to me. We paid just over this to have our stairs and 3 bedrooms carpeted. The rooms were empty but the fitters were brilliant (given as many cups of tea/coffee as they liked) and even fitted the inside of our walk-in wardrobes.

It all depends on where you live and the quality of carpet you choose.

nicknacks the price is not the issue
fwiw my carpet is being fitted on saturday, with underlay, for £153 for a red check wilton
The terms and conditions say that the rooms should be emptied but the fitters will move furniture and carpets if it is necessary. They will also remove doors but not refit.
It seems like you are saying she should have expected to get a crap job for paying only £200