MNHQ here: Bounty Mutiny (get Bounty and commercial reps off wards) - UPDATE

[RowanMumsnet]

Hello

Thought some of you would be pleased to hear that as the petition to ban commercial reps started by Lauren Harris has passed 10k signatures, the government had to provide a response.

In it, they praise Ipswich hospital for introducing:

'a system where mothers are only approached by a commercial representative if they indicate that this is something that they would like. Mothers can show their preference by placing a card on their bedside table. This is a good example of how Trusts can put processes in place to give new mothers clear control over their interaction with commercial representatives.'

They go on to say:

'The Government is considering how to clarify guidance, so that that the interaction between commercial representatives and new mothers on NHS wards is consistently more positive across the UK.'

So, a small step but hopefully a good one. For the GDPR mavens among you there's also some commentary on that issue in the response on the petition page (please let us know what you think!)

Please do sign the petition if you feel strongly about this - every signature demonstrates the strength of feeling on the issue, and if the petition reaches 100k it will be debated in Parliament.

If you've already signed, you could:

1. write to the hospital where you had your baby (or the hospital where you will be having your baby, or would have your baby at if you had a hospital birth). Bring the response to their attention (they may not be aware of the petition), and point out that the Government has clearly indicated hospitals should have this sort of opt IN system and that other mothers should be left alone.

2. Tweet/share a Facebook post to East Suffolk and North Essex NHS Foundation Trust (@ESNEFT on Twitter) to commend Ipswich hospital on its policy, and tag in your local hospital trust asking them to do the same.

3. Tweet/share a Facebook post with the Department of Health and Social Care (@DHSCgovuk) asking them to prioritise new guidance for trusts on this issue.

If you have any ideas for other useful actions to take please add them here!

Thanks
MNHQ

@Hellesbelle I'm so sorry that happened to you! It's not recent but I remember someone having a run in with a Bounty Bloke on the last big Bounty Mutiny thread. He was definitely unpleasant.

Thanks unfortunately I was only able to have the one child but a friend whose oldest is only a month younger than mine had 4 children and she had problems with photographers not only after the birth of each of them but sadly she lost one and she had to give birth to her dead baby which was very traumatic but she was moved back to the ward and had barely gotten back into her bed when one came barrelling through the curtains and demanded to see her baby. It’s just disgusting to see the lack of understanding and empathy for all new mothers no matter how the birth goes, wether they have an easy time or end up being given an emergency c-section, if they get to see their baby and have it with them or they might have the baby in the in the special unit.Its almost as if you don’t have any rights once you have a child and it’s an abuse of a woman’s basic human rights. Sorry I don’t know what all the abbreviations mean I am new and can’t find any where that explains them, so I apologise if I have offended anyone.

www.bounty.com/info/privacy-policy

Stiff - could have looked myself! The data processing info on the website says that the personal information is not sold on and is retained by Bounty.

The bounty women when I gave birth to DS heard me telling a midwife about my disability. She poked her head through the curtains and said “oh well you won’t be working with that thing wrong with you so won’t be able to afford any pictures and I doubt you have a husband”
I was gobsmaked and the midwife went running after her and have her a peice of her mind.

I did report her but never heard anything and I was in a fog of PND and PTSD to follow it up

There wasn't a bounty rep in Plymouth as far as I could tell. We still got made to fill in the forms and take the pack though. I didn't realise until afterwards that this wasn't part of hospital discharge, the midwife made it sound like it was. Which is pretty unethical really and surely not part of a midwife's job. And I lost the pack and downloaded the child benefit forms anyway.

Sorry to hear your story @Hellesbelle. Why on earth is a MALE photographer- employed by Bounty or not allowed access to a post natal ward?

God all of these stories make my blood boil! I had a relatively nice and non-pushy Bounty rep when I had DS two years ago, but as I lay there full of stitches and exhausted I just remember thinking, ‘am I a shit Mum, already?!’ when I couldn’t afford to buy the photos. I genuinely wondered if I didn’t love him as much as the mum in the next bed who was happily forming out for a full on family photoshoot. How DARE they make vulnerable women feel this way.

@InMemoryOfSleep, that gave me a lump in my throat. I remember so well the vulnerability of those first few hours. I remember watching another Mum walk around the ward carrying her baby with such confidence and wondering if I could ever be that good, and how would I not fail my daughter as I clearly couldn't even give birth right.

World's a small place, so I actually know her now, and she likes to remind me she only looked confident as he's not her first!

It's horrendous that these people are allowed to hound us in hospital like that.

@InMemoryOfSleep I had those exact feelings too. The photos are very expensive. Of course I can laugh now at the very idea that priorities nappies and clothes over a few photos made me a shit mum. I have the photos that I took with my phone printed out and I treasure them, they take me back to the sights and sounds and feelings around me when I took them.

All it would take would be for each hospital to have to complete an ‘equality assessment’ before they allowed these reps in. Are they allowing double glazing sales reps on the prostate surgery ward? No? Why not - they’re giving away a 10ml sample of preparation H free to every patient! What do you mean men who have just undergone painful surgery don’t want to be disturbed? It’s fine for the women who’ve had C-sections, tears and sick babies.

Even if you take them off maternity wards nobody will miss out FFS - they can just run campaigns through Facebook instead where you sign up to receive a free bag through the post or whatever. That would cost them less than they're paying the NHS per sign up and it wouldn't be rubbishly intrusive.

They had a photography service in the hospital I gave birth in in Germany but you had to go and sign up for it - there was a box in the day room you could drop a form into and the photographer would come to your room at a time you indicated was convenient. It meant you could even dress your baby in clothes that you chose for the photoshoot and make sure they were fed, changed etc beforehand so they wouldn't be unsettled. We didn't do it because the charges were ridiculous and I felt the photos were twee but I did think it was a much much better system for anyone who did want them.

I think I thought Bounty were part of the NHS with my first baby, it was 2008 and the midwife gave you a pack at booking in. No idea if this happens any more.

I gave birth in Nottingham last weekend - no sign of any Bounty reps at all there, although I was prepared for it thanks to this campaign. And in fact I've never been given anything from Bounty throughout the whole pregnancy. Not sure if thus reflects Nottingham's policy, or if I've just been lucky...

I had a look around the bounty website and they proudly declare they give the NHS 2.3million a year. Can't see the NHS giving that up because of a few women whining about privacy, but who knows.

It’s amazing how powerful “a few women whining” can be.

You would like to think so, but the events in Morecambe Bay and Shrewsbury and Telford hospitals would suggest that there isn't enough care and attention to the actual lives of women and babies, nevermind privacy and dignity, so while I will be watching with interest, I'm not optimistic.

Fair enough, that coverage has been shocking.

Done. My DC were born overseas so I didn’t have to deal with these reps. Some of these stories are horrific.

£2.3m nationally is a drop in the ocean of the NHS budget, and really doesn’t seem like much in exchange for access outside visiting hours and getting midwives and hospital staff to hand out thousands and thousands of your “Bounty packs”. If the NHS is going to continue partnering with these vultures the least they could do is up their prices.

I wish I had rejected their offer of photos!! My ex partner (ds' dad) was visiting him shortly after the birth. Already a stressful visit due to a horrible break up during the pregnancy after a absuive relationship. I had just had a c-section that morning and was still immobile laying in bed with very little feeling to my legs. When the bounty lady came round he insisted on the photos as did his mum. I was too emotionally drained to argue. My legs were moved out the way for the photos to be taken. They took my baby from me and started taking photos. I was in so much shock I just sat there holding back tears. His mum then insisted on purchasing the photos and buying me a album. I didnt want one, it was too expensive. The photos were washed out and rubbish. A horrible experience on the first day of my sons life, which I stood up for myself and said no. I would never use bounty again. Signed and hope this gets passed.

This is awesome news. After my first DC in 2010 I was so cross (later on) to have been put in a position a few hours after a traumatic labour to have to be saying “no” to a ‘bed to bed’ sales rep. And not least so cross about the security risk!! I wasn’t allowed to take my baby’s for a walk in the fresh air around the hospital grounds for 10 mins but this random sales person could wander around the ward.

A few weeks after giving birth I asked the Norwich & Norfolk University Hospital to tell me under freedom of information act how much money there were making from Bounty. I never got an answer.

@MNHQ
How can we find out other that the list provided up thread if our hospital is still associated with Bounty?
I am wondering about Dorchester County Hospital (Dorset) as I have noticed they use a different company when providing the packs with your notes in now. In 2016 it was still bounty.

Great news. The ignorant bounty rep reduced me to tears after the very difficult birth of my second child. The hospital nurses and staff were amazing, but the loud, pushy bounty woman, who barged in, making offensive assumptions about my baby due to his appearance completely knocked my fragile state of mind totally off kilter.

It’s great you’re pushing this MNHQ. To my mind opt out isnt enough - they need to be banned from wards altogether. It’s a security risk, its a hygiene risk and it’s intrusive. They simply should NOT be there, full stop.

Of all the campaigns I've learnt about on MN and been passionate about - this is the one that gets me riled up the most.
I gave birth in 2010 and I'm still fuming that these reps were allowed to roam free on post-natal wards. It's frankly disgusting.
I've signed and will tweet.

I put on my birth plan "I do not want to be approached by any bounty reps or sales people at any point" and they were definitely told because they literally never looked at me or in my direction!

I was quite surprised really, given that some MAJOR things in my birth plan had been totally ignored. That's another story though.

I will sign this petition. It's not right to approach vulnerable people and ask them if they want to spend £164 on photos. If this happened in a ward full of elderly people there would be outrage!