Is £23k really only a modest retirement income for a single homeowner?

[Lumpycat]

I’m at that stage where I’m constantly doing my sums and wondering when I’ll feel secure enough to retire.
I am a single 60 year old.
I’ve seen the standard responses on this based on some massive survey where it’s state pension levels to just survive. Then about £23k to have a moderate lifestyle and about £32k for a decent retirement.
Own own house.
Would have around £80k put aside for big things/kid’s weddings help.
Live in Surrey/outer London.
Drive a hatchback that I buy at about 2 years old and trade in at about 10.
Three adult children. One cat!
Hobbies very cheap. Reading, cooking, gardening, music, walking, local gym.
Not a shopper and don’t do beauty treatments.
I think I would spend about £5k a year on car including replacing it. Then about £2k on a holiday. Then bills and food around £750 a month so that’s about £15k.
House is fairly modern so not thinking it will need anything major for a decade.
I’m not massively sociable. Have close friends that I tend to meet for coffees/pub quiz/walks.
I don’t get why £23k gives only a very modest lifestyle. Seems like it will be plenty.
Current planning would give me £21k if I retired today then state pension on top at 67.
Really interested to hear from anyone who retired already on similar amounts and the reality of living on ‘below modest income’ levels at my age. What am I missing?

Yes - it's expenses for a family of five, and includes very healthy holiday and eating out budgets as well as running costs for a holiday home!

Divide it by five and you're at £852 per person.

Yes, sorry, mobile, cats and gym membership mine. He has his dogs, own gym membership and own mobile. By fun stuff I mean going out for a drink, going out for the day, cinema, theatre, etc.

The food is for 5 but teens have their own money.Gym membership, mobile, eating out, internet/subscriptions, holidays etc are just for me and DH. Teens at uni and college.

I think those calculations massive overestimate what people spend.

I also think things like needing a handyman in to mend things is probably compensated for by the state pension.

Are you sure you spend £5k a year on a car? I buy one at 4-5 years old and run it for 10+ years and my current monthly car cost (including savings to replace it) would be about £100pcm for savings, plus £25pcm for insurance, £11 tax, and maybe £40pcm for maintenance, plus petrol. I guess that's about £2k plus petrol, but I think that means you could problem shave some cash there if you wanted to.

I would seriously allow for wanting more holidays once you're retired. I guess it's worth thinking that e.g. even another 9 months would get you an extra £1000 per year by the sounds of it, and that would pay for an extra holiday per year with care.

youll Be fine, thing about retiring is it’s much cheaper than working.

media don’t want you to stop working and want you to believe that you need a full time wage

you don’t as you probably don’t have the debts that many younger people have.

if your unsure. Live on what you think you’ll need for 6 months and in month 5 hand in your notice if it works

have you included your interest from the £80k in your income?

@caringcarer . I think you’re out by nearly £2k so maybe you included your mortgage in that. Plus I don’t plan to run a second home or feed five people or spend £8400 on holidays! appreciate you taking the time but I started this mainly to hear realistic feedback from people about living on a moderate pension.
I think every year I work gives about £1500/year pension which would be reduced a bit by taking it however early I go before 67. Plus of course I can save £20k a year from income. Take home is about £3750 so about £45k a year and I seem to be able to save £1500 -£2000 a month easily so am living on £21- 27k ish?
No haven’t included savings interest. It’s all rough figures.
I guess I do live on moderate amounts now and have a great life (for me!).
One thing not discussed on this thread is that even though my retirement amount is pretty moderate it’s apparently loads more than average. I don’t think Mumsnet is typical. Still undecided!

I just think we’re very different with spending.

My gym is £20. I tend to make my own decent coffee at home and take a flask when I’m out walking. I live in the town centre and cinema is £6! Friends and I have various passes for London Art gallery and museum exhibitions and Kew Gardens and Wisley. I think we’re just habitually thrifty. I have the money now but feel no urge for anything.

Certainly there is plenty to do that I personally enjoy that doesn’t cost much. Would love to not have to restrict everything to weekends. And of course aimless pottering and reading is free!

I don’t think it would be as bleak as some people imagine. ‘One holiday a year and an old cat’ paints a different picture than what’s in my head. But I did ask. Thanks for all the feedback.

Mortgage paid off and French house no mortgage either.

I give my niece £50 a month for the 3 years she's at uni because my sister doesn't have a lot of money to give her and I love my niece. I gave the same to her older sister too whilst she was at uni for 3 years. I give my teen foster son more than that every month, now he is at uni. I can afford to be generous.

It's not bleak, one thing you can't buy is time. I stopped working four and a half years ago. I have a modest income, approximate to you and for 3 years lived on that . This year I decided to start taking my pension, still got 8 years until my state pension, calculated id need to live unit I was 85 to break even on not taking my pension now. So id rather have the money now and use it for extra holidays as im fit and healthy now but who knows when im 86 what ill be wanting, but doubt ill need as much money.
I have on average 8 weeks away a year on holiday, varies different types and prices of holidays.

I quit the gym and my car is old, I have savings, but those have actually increased since I stopped working. I don't go without but like op I don't want stuff. I have done some major works on my house, new garden just before I stopped work and new utility. Then 2 years ago a new bathroom. I have enough money for a new to me car, but will keep the car I have until it needs to be changed.

There is much more to life than working 9-5 or 6-3 and I didn't want to be tied to a regular pattern any longer.

I fill my days with doing what I want to do, meeting friends, going on day trips, volunteering, hobbies take up a lot of time and family. The most important thing is being there for family and I have been needed for more than one member and a very dear friend.

I don't miss work and I certainly enjoy my freedom, I wouldn't have worked any longer for more money either. I'm satisfied with what I have

It's not a retirement budget though. Your spending just isn't any more relevant to what a single woman with independent adult children needs for retirement than that of any other married parents of teenagers who are also subsidising extended family, spending 8k plus per year on holidays etc.

not sure why you're focusing on the £50 when the main point the pp was making is that the £700 on holidays, £89 on entertainment, £250 on presents, gym membership etc most people would consider to be 'fun things!'

I responded about the £50 for my niece because someone said I didn't need to do that and said do your sisters fund your DC. Anyway surely most people have internet/subscription TV. Ours cost £89 because it's a package and included Sky Sport, Sky Movies, TNT, Netflix, Amazon Prime, Disney and Now TV. We go out less in winter when cold and instead watch more TV in the evenings. We both like sport and DH likes movies.

my Ill health pension at 47 is about that much.

Its so difficult to work out & to actually make the leap to becoming a spender instead of an earner. I really struggle with the idea of a firm cut off & if I didn't have enough for any reason what would I do.
All the maths says I should have enough, however I haven't actually been able to take that final step yet - I am still planning it but it remains to be seen if I actually do it when I hope to

Sounds a rich life in all the ways that matter OP. You are my kinda gal! I think one really important aspect of your life is that you seem to have like minded friends who probably are as happy with a picnic lunch if out for the day, for example. There are also my kimd of people. Good company, remaining curious, having the wherewithall to continue to enjoy what is probably the greatest city in the world (am jealous), a loving family.....money has veey little to do with any of that.

I have £22k income a year and pay £700 odd in tax on this, no mortgage but do pay £1700 a year in management fees for my flat on top of normal expenses. I have £180k invested/savings but, obviously, the more of this I spend, the lower my income becomes.
I retired 10 years ago, work 2 days a week as a volunteer and take 3/4 short breaks to Spain each year. I run a 2017 car but mainly use (free) buses to go everywhere. I put aside £1k odd for Christmas and £100 for 5 family birthdays. £750 is transferred into a general spending acc each month and this covers food, clothes, lunches, Amazon buys etc (bills are all paid separately) and I usually have a bit over each month. I think you'll be fine on your income and only 7 years until your state pension (this will be taxable). It might not cover any world cruises though!

What about your pension lump sum? I earn just a little more and also a civil servant. If I get to 67 i’ll have 43yrs service and my lump sum alone would be 250k, plus then 35k ish plus annually. I also have part time years, but my years on classic still final salary so helps. I’ve basically lost 5yrs from the part time. Sounds like you’d have plenty of money for your lifestyle to be honest.

@Zanatdy - you get a £250k lump sum from a salary of just over £64k?

I was just thinking that! I must run my calculations again - mine isn’t even six figures and my salary is higher with no breaks or PT years😩.

I’ve probably got a similar spending pattern to you OP. I’m 57 and hoping to retire at 60. I earn £37k now, have a nice life, manage to save. I’m single no DC. House in London no mortgage. I’ll be getting £5k DB pension at 67 and now have about £550k in pensions and savings, hope to get it up quite a lot further by 60.

my bills are:
gas and electric £100
house insurance £50
water £50
internet and cable £50
cat stuff £100
no car, public transport about £40
council tax £160
mobile £12
food £400 (I’m not careful at all though)

my fun stuff is books, sitting in garden, coffee with friends, dinner out occasionally, petting the cat, craft hobbies, a couple of week long holidays in Europe a year.

I hope I’m not underestimating how much I’ll need. Not really thinking on to care in my 80s tbh, I’ll probably be stuffed anyway as don’t have kids.