PIP - change of circumstances between application and tribunal?

[Pouff]

Hi, just wondered if anyone had any experience of this?

TLDR: DC needs extra support to live independently, but not at home as family provide the support. PIP process is so slow DC has had to move back home, needs to go to appeal but obviously circumstances are different when living at home.

DC has disabilities, but we didn't realise how much help they needed until they went away to university and things just fell apart to the life threatening stage (eating disorder + AuDHD + others). We applied for PIP to try to "buy" help, DC didn't get enough points and so was declined. We went for mandatory reconsideration as several issues had been completely ignored, and it's just come back with more points but just under the threshold.

We now want to go to tribunal, as there are still issues that have been ignored. However, the situation got so bad that DC has had to take a gap year and recover before heading back to university next September. So this means that the issues currently are not the same - but they will be by next September. Can we go to appeal, or will they object on the basis that PIP is not needed at home as family provide care?

Please note, I don't want to go into the issues of the disabilities or how buying in help would work, that would get too specific and personal. Needless to say DC needs extra support to live independently, which is what PIP is supposed to help with.

Thank you

I think you need to describe the need even if you are meeting it. For example if your adult child could not make a hot meal or shop for food but you do it you can still say they cannot provide a hot meal/shop for food.

If they could not catch a bus due to anxiety but you give them lifts in the car you can still describe that they cannot catch a bus.

That's my understanding. The fact you are meeting the need or working around it doesn't make the need or difference disappear.

Thanks Winter that makes sense. And excellent examples. Thank you

PIP is about the activities the claimant cannot do and awards are based on scoring against descriptors for each activity:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria#daily-living-activities

It doesn't matter if somebody cooks for you, manages your meds and helps you with washing & dressing. What counts is what you can do for yourself.

It doesn't matter who provides the care.

It matters what you need supervision and support to achieve.

Just because they are home (for example) and having meals cooked for them it doesn't mean they don't need support with this - if they didn't they'd be doing it themselves at home too.

Basically anything they should be able to do at 16 and over they can't so is a need. Regardless of if you are meeting that need as a parent or not.

Thank you. That's interesting, one of the initial comments by them was that staying on the phone to Mum whilst waiting for a bus and on the journey was "a good coping mechanism".. (it's really not when Mum is supposed to be working but is preventing a complete autistic meltdown when the bus hasn't arrived and so a different bus has to be taken...) so it seemed to us that if family could provide the care then that was disregarded.

We've approached a specialist service to help with the appeal but they've not come back to us. I guess I need to really swat up, does anyone have any suggested resources?

Don't forget the 3 month rule though - the needs claimed for must have been the case for 3 months before an award can be made.

So if their needs have got worse recently, that's difficult for the tribunal to take into account.

Have a look at citizens advice website lots of information there. You also need to get hold of the points system so you can see where your son fits. Also you need to disregard help you give him or rather they should. If for example he needs prompting to do an activity that should award him points. Also he must be able to do the activity reliably otherwise he should be awarded the points - reliability means i think safely, in good time, repeatedly as needed and one other that I always forget. I’m not sure about changes of circumstances though get some help from an advice agency would be my recommendation.

my understanding is that the tribunal will make a decision on the initial applications and the need of the applicant when you applied. If new needs arose AFTER you made the application , this will not be considered.

A change in circumstances is only relevant if you have been awarded. You may be better off leaving it all and making a new claim.

It might be easier to start a new claim. That way it would be up to date with what is happening with your Son. Seek advice.