Feeling lost and stupid with money

[muttimalzwei]

There's a lot to cover but basically I have amassed about 8000 in credit card debt over 3 cards. I don't earn very well and I have been using them towards the end of the month, bits here and there and when on holiday for things that I wanted to do with the kids while there (hire bikes, amusement parks etc). I've lied to my husband (he knew I'd used credit cards in the past and got into a big mess. This was paid off using some of my inheritance money) and told him I used one again a few years back to pay for a camping holiday abroad (couldn't afford to go really but desperately needed a break). I told him I would pay it off but then just carried on spending and transferring to zero interest and getting into more of a mess. We have seperate accounts but he pays the utilities, runs the family car, does 2 big shops a month and keeps the house maintained. He also pays for holidays in the UK (youth hostels, nights away) and family meals out. Holidays abroad we go halves. He has always saved into an ISA for repairs to house/car/rainy day etc. I do the entertainment / everyday side of things (all phones, TV subscriptions, school meals, clothes for kids). My husband has always lived frugally so sees some of my spending as frivolous (do you really need a new pair of shoes etc) but honest, I hardly spend anything on myself. So sometimes I've just bought things on credit because I know he would question it or maybe think I was extravagant.
He is due to inherit money and I've told him today about my debt. I've been hiding it from him. I'm hoping he might help me to pay off some of the debt. Is this unreasonable of me? I'm thinking while I've been using credit for things that are essentially for our children and been on low wage due to family responsibilities he's still kept in the black? Am I being unreasonable here? Or am I missing something?

Suggest you go to cab and work out a sensible budget to enable paying it down. You need to accept that you cannot afford holidays, trips, treats etc.

So do you buy unnecessary things or having you just been buying what you need, on the credit card?
(Holiday as an exception?)

People are so quick to jump on the "you have an addiction" bandwagon.

To the pp who lumped bitcoin in the same boat as matched betting - they are absolutely not the same thing. You don't understand matched betting if you think you they are. BUT I do know what you mean about it maybe not being quite right for OP. It's what I used to clear up some debt so just quickly put it out there.

OP get yourself on Martin Lewis money saving expert forum. There's a forum specifically for this kind of debt. Lots of useful advice with very knowledgeable people who can guide you through your options, you have many. Ignore any PP who want to belittle you, you've acknowledged a problem and you're reaching out for help. People on MN are unlikely to give you the best advice. Money saving expert forum has specialist advice, good luck!

I think you’re getting an unfairly hard time here OP. The situation you find yourself in is not uncommon after all.

BUT obviously you need to sort this problem out. To do so, you and DH need to work properly as a team. If you cut up your credit cards ( you really should) he will need to step in towards the end of the month etc. So budget and plan together, and agree this is the last chance saloon: no more unplanned spending!

The issue is you have hidden it from your DH, I would be really annoyed. You need to come clean and you need to get rid of those cards.

The issue of holidays and shoes is sadly you just cannot have them if you can’t afford them. It is shit being poor, I was raised poor and hated every single second of it. People have been quite harsh but it’s a mindset that does need a change. DH sister had 20 years being a very high earner, offshore and no tax paid, but she is appalling with money and is facing a bleak retirement. She should be very well off.

Do not try any alleged quick fixes, no bit coin or matched betting or anything like that. It’s risky for anyone but for someone who is bad with money it’s just no way.

You and DH need to work out what your family NEEDS are (so that includes bills and food and school uniform but excludes holidays and days out). You then need to agree a sensible amount for "luxuries" e.g. those holidays. You both need to understand what you, as a couple can afford.

Once you've agreed these things, make sure your current split of payments is fair. If it isn't, then change it. And in the short term, you'll need to throw as much as you can at the debt. If you're married, then it makes no difference whether it's yours or DH's money. But if I was your DH, I would want you to demonstrate that you could stick to a strict budget.

I have fewer than 6 pairs of shoes. And I can afford more. So that does sound extravagent. Especially if they are mostly work shoes i.e. not shoes for different purposes. Maybe you are looking at your life through the lens of a more affluent mindset?

Boo hoo Imelda fucking Marcos.
6 pairs of shoes is plenty, especially when you're hiding thousands of debt.
Stop making excuses and give the finances to your husband, you can't be trusted.

Op how much money do you have available to you each month? You need to separate out what is necessary spending - kids clothes and shoes, school meals, kids activities, clothes etc for yourself v excessive spending on luxury items and holidays and experiences.

Your DH pays all the bills etc, but you should budget as a family so that all your family’s needs (and wants, if you can afford them) are met together.

I've been in debt before, not loads but paying it back bit by bit is a slog and then avoiding getting in to debt again feels miserable because of all the hard work and lack of 'treats'. The reality is for you and anyone else who gets into debt that you are living beyond your means....and it doesn't matter if it is mostly to buy things for the kids or you aren't even spending much. You need to work on that aspect. I do think you are being a but unreasonable expecting your dh to use his inheritance to pay back your secret debt which you hid from him. If you needed money to spend on the kids and he had enough to put into savings then you should've spoken to him. You also say that you used your inheritance to pay it back before as if it's only fair he takes the hit this time.....that would be fair if you'd accrued this debt mutually but you haven't, you've done it behind his back...and I suspect spent a bit frivolously and not gone to him to ask for money to pay for these things because you know he would've questioned the need for some of them. I think you need to pay it back yourself and stop all the secret spending.

I think your husband is the unreasonable one. If, as a family, you can afford holidays abroad then you should go on them. It’s for the benefit of everyone in the family. You are only in debt as he makes you pay half and you are a low earner compared to him. It’s absolute nonsense.
Entertaining kids costs a small fortune esp in school holidays - why is this your job to pay for all of this?
I think your husband sounds controlling with money. Does he not want his kids to have the childhood the family can afford? Rather the childhood the lowest earner in the family can afford?

Don't do that someone has to lose and it looks like it would be you.

Update: been in touch with Stepchange and they have been very helpful. I'll be paying debts off at 500 a month. My creditors are agreeing to freeze the interest. It will take me just over a year. Thank you for the support and ideas.

What a great update 🥳, well done.

Sounds like you've come up with a plan OP, but just a thought going forward.

The way you're doing things is quite lopsided, it may be that he ends up paying for more things than you at the moment, but you're putting things like bike hire on holiday and things for the kids on credit cards because you can't afford them then it's just not adding up, anything for the kids should be paid by both of you jointly surely? Paying bits and bobs separately and on your personal account can soon add up.

We have a system where we have separate finances but a joint account that we both pay in to, all bills and utilities, food shopping, anything that the dogs need, vet bills, or anything for DD, holidays, holiday expenses, subscriptions to tv services, meals out, takeaways basically anything that is used by the family or jointly comes out of that account and we try and float it at £1000.

The only things we pay for personal is our cars & related expenses, phones, any subscriptions that are our own, life insurance etc, purely stuff that is just for ourselves. It's a good system for us because we know once the monthly amount has gone out everything else is our own to spend or save how we wish.

You can choose to pay half into the joint account monthly or work out a percentage based on a proportion of your earnings, but it may help you be more cautious as to what you spend on the family as you know your DH can see what you're buying.

I think you've had a hard time on here OP, and I don't think your DP is being fair. He earns a lot more than you, and this is largely due to childcare responsibilities on you, and did you say lack of suitable employment opportunities in your local area? Stuff for the children should not just be paid by you of course not.

It is unfortunate that you have run up debts (a bit daft of you, yes) and didn't tell him, were you afraid of his reaction?

I would say that you both need to be honest and open with each other and sit down and draw up a family budget. Separate finances where each person is responsible for different things often leads to problems. You should each pay proportionately to what you each earn. You're a family, not housemates. Together I am sure you can work things out, and then I am sure the getting into debt situation would not reoccur.

Turn this around - what would mumsnetters' advice be if this post had been "I earn more than my DH but live frugally. He's just admitted to me that hidden from me he has racked up £8,000 of credit card debt, and wonders if I can use an inheritance to pay it off". I suspect that the DH would not get much sympathy.

Clearly this poster has made some big misjudgements in spending. It's good that she has now come clean to her DH but I think they do indeed need to urgently discuss it and work it out together, and not go into that conversation assuming that DH has an obligation to to bail her out without batting an eyelid.

@snowlaser Yes she shouldn't have hidden her debts from him and allowed the situation to escalate but I think that their problems are at least partly caused by not treating all income as family income. She is in debt largely for child related expenses, and doesn't spend much on herself I think she said.

Why, especially as she's on a lower income, do you think it's OK for most of the child related expenses to be on her? They're supposed to be a family.

The OP says "he pays the utilities, runs the family car, does 2 big shops a month and keeps the house maintained. He also pays for holidays in the UK (youth hostels, nights away) and family meals out." So whilst he may not pay child-related expenses specifically he clearly pays a lot of big expenses that she doesn't. We don't have the information to know in total how what each person pays relative to what they earn, but it certainly sounds like they've sat down and discussed it and come up with a split, so if that split wasn't working step 1 should be to say "this split is working because....." rather than rack up £8,000 of hidden debt.

That said - that is the past, and it is done now. The future needs to be sit down and work out together how to deal with the £8,000 and future expenses.

I’m glad you have a plan in place OP.

I hope you’ve worked out a budget to include

1. Monthly fixed expenses (rent/mortgage, insurance, gas, car payment, etc)
2. Variable expenses (groceries, clothes, school uniform, etc). These expenses are variable because you can make reductions if required.
3. Whatever you have left can be sorted into ‘luxuries’—streaming services (do you need multiple subscriptions, or can you go down to one and rotate every 3-6 months?), takeaways/meals out/coffee/etc, holidays, etc. Sorry, but these need to be significantly cut if you don’t have the cash to fund them. Holidays should NOT be funded via credit card debt.

I have some concerns about overspending. A family death got you out of debt last time and you continued with your usual behaviours, which has landed you back in debt. The root cause needs to be addressed, particularly building holiday debt and comparing yourself to others—other Mumsnetters may well have 6+ pairs of shoes, but their financial goals and priorities aren’t the same as your financial goals and priorities. Paige Pritchard is a fantastic financial coach—I listen to her weekly podcast called Money Love and follow her on Instagram. Her message is about overcoming overspending. You may want to check her out.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CyuPVdsROS8/?igsh=ZDhsOHYwMmRndnc5

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-money-love-podcast/id1526181226

This.

You are not the problem OP. Your husband and his tight approach to family finances is the issue.

All expenses for the household and children should be met from your joint income, and you should have equal personal spending money at the end of the month.

Anything other than this is unfair. No wonder you're in debt. But he's the issue.

I will never understand married couples with children having separate finances.

A family holiday putting one person into debt while the other can afford it is ridiculous. One part of the couple going to debt agencies while the other has savings shows either someone who is severely out of control with spending or someone who is bordering on financial abuse.

I do not understand how you can successfully be a couple in a family unit without resentment festering if you are individually living different financial lifestyles.

All money going into a single pot will perhaps resolve some issues, but it won't resolve the issue when a couple has different attitudes to finance and spending and are financially incompatible.

To resolve that you still need to pool finances so you are living the same lifestyle, but you need to sit down together, agree mutual goals, agree/compromise on how you will manage them, and be completely transparent on spending.

I’ve been married for 16 years and we have separate finances (with children). We are clear on which categories/expenses come out if my pay, and which come out if his. We regularly align on finances. I’m crystal clear on what is coming in and out if my bank account, as is he. There is no tit-for-tat going on. Can we please stop shaming married women who prefer separate bank accounts? If it works, and their financial goals are being met, then their ‘system’ works for them, and they shouldn’t be told that what they are doing is ‘wrong’.

For OP, there is clearly a misalignment if loans are being taken in secret, and that’s a different issue—their communication needs to be more transparent. Please stop telling those of us who have a system that works for us, that we are wrong.

You have already not learned from your mistake in the past and won’t learn from it again if he bails you out. Lots of us a desperate for holidays or new shoes but aren’t bunging them on credit cards without our partners knowing.