difference between dismissal and termination of contract

[preschoolproblems]

I am Chair of a preschool and we've had a cnumber of complaints re the manager.

After seeking osme legal advice, we have been told that her actions are not severeenough to dismiss her.

As a committee we are not happy with her remaining as manager.
It has been suggested that we can termintae her contract with us.

Anyone know about this?

I think dismissing is sacking on the grounds of gross misconduct.

And I think termination is all other resons to sack someone, ie, job performance not up to scratch.

You could pay her off early (if she agrees to go) if you can't dismiss for her misconduct or capability (ie her (poor) timekeeping, excessive sick leave or not obeying the set procedures for claiming holidays/sick pay or not carrying out her duties in a professional manner etc). You will probably have to negotiate a settlement figure though. Do take proper legal advice before you do anything though.

So not following policies and having the complaints made could be reason to terminate contract?

Who decides what gross misconduct is?

Dismissal isn't always for a derogatory reason - you can dismiss someone on grounds of their ill-health if they're not up to doing the job, it doesn't mean that they're useless at doing the job iyswim. It can be just a term used.

details of gross misconduct should be written in the contract.

I am trying to get legal advice through lawcall, but there have been no advisors available all day.

ACAS have given the idea of termintaion rather than dismissal, but need ot be clear about it all.

According to advice we've had, she can't be dismissed for gross misconduct, even though I wouldn't be happy with her continuing at the preschool.

Would putting her through a disiplinary procedure be an option?

Gross misconduct is usually something that would bring the company into disrepute or reflect badly on the company and it's often a fairly summary procedure - they can be asked to leave the premises instantly. Have you got a staff handbook which lists the disciplinary stages?

It sounds as though you may want to ask her to resign with a negotiated settlement for doing so. You may be able to get away without paying her though - I'm not a legal expert btw so don't get out the chequebook just yet!

I sit in the meetings and generate tons of stuff to do with disciplinaries though .

As it stands, we are having a discipliniary meeting this week.

3 of the ocmplaints have been form staff. It is a team of 5, so I can't see how they can work together again. The staff involved have made ot clear that they don't trust her within the preschool.

I don't believe she would resign, as she'd have done it already. She is studying for her EYFS whilst with us, so needs ot be in employment ot carry on.

I truley believe that if parents were aware of the allegations made against her then they would pull their children out of preschool. Is that enougt o prove disrepute?

Help!!!!!

Anyone....

Do she have a contract with you. Has she previously had verbal and written warnings for her conduct.

Have you got a disciplinary procedure in the staff handbook and has it been exhausted?

Where I work, they have verbal, first written, second written warnings and then you're out (but with the right of appeal at every stage). It may be just my particular company but it's very hard to actually get rid of someone. Even if they don't turn up to work for months on end, we have to write to them three times inviting them to contact us before we can assume they're not coming back - ven if we know that they've left the country! What are the particular issues with this person? Do you think that they're not suited to childcare related work or more of a square peg in a round hole in your organisation but they could do brilliantly elsewhere? It does happen

Yes, she has a contract with us. In there it staes that sh emust follow the policies and procedures of the preschool. It also states amonths notice for ewither party.

She hasn't had any other warnings form us, but we have had a couple of informal chats re conduct and management.

The discipliniary proceduer os standard, and sets out verbal, written, final and dismissal.

The complaints are re her manner/conduct with the children, also with the other staff. There are other issues, not as major, re her professionalism and time management. One of the staff members has asaid that she doesn't trust that the manager won't "snap" at the children.

I have actually spoken wiht lawcall again, and as she has been with us of rless than a yera, then we could termintae her contract, for the above reasons, with no backlash, I believe....

you really need proper advice on employment law.
i am not a lawyer, but i would have thought that you would be on shaky grounds to dismiss someone unless you have some evidence

just because three people have made an allegation does not make it fact

someone saying that they don't trust someone not to "snap" at the children is not gross misconduct

you need to show that you have carried out all the proper procedures as laid down by law. if you don't she can take you to an employment tribunal

i am not dismissing or minimising your concerns. i understand that they are very real. But you must act within the law