PIP Mandatory Review

[swallowedAfly]

I've been awarded the lower rate of mobility and nothing for daily living. The report has flagrant lies ie X eats every day when it is clearly audible on the recordings I had to chase for weeks that when I asked I hadn't eaten for nearly 3 days. The assessor felt the need to report to safeguarding that my son was a young carer because of the levels of support he had to give in daily living yet she awarded zero points which I find bizarre. She's put zero for toilet stuff despite knowing and repeatedly being told and empathising (again clearly audible) that I had to use incontinence pads and have spare clothing etc.

I feel like it's a mistake like she hasn't listened to the second recording or pressed send without filling in all the fields or something but I know in reality they do just lie and try to award nothing. I had nearly 3 hours on the phone and had to take a break.

I've only given a couple of examples here to give you an idea of how contradictory things are.

I'm currently doing my mandatory review application.

I'm wondering is mandatory review just a tick box exercise that never achieves anything but is meant to discourage you further or do decisions ever/often get changed based on them?

I've made clear on the form that if it is turned down I will be going to appeal and will seek support and collate further evidence etc so they know I'm not going to be bullied out of continuing.

I confess I've been a bit devastated by the whole thing. I was incredibly distressed in the lead up to the call, had put off applying for a long time because of how humiliating the whole process seemed to be and I had to reveal deeply personal things during the process and be reported to doctors and ss because she classified my son as a young carer.

A friend has reassured me that the fact they've awarded anything ie. the lower rate for mobility (which I actually thought I had less chance of getting than the daily living amount which I without doubt even to the meanest interpretation qualify for the lower amount of and I would argue possibly even the higher rate but I would have accepted the lower) means I have a strong claim as they try to get away with awarding nothing. I just can't comprehend how she has awarded zero points of all of that side.

Any advice on whether mandatory review ever achieves anything or I should just start preparing myself for appeal, support and encouragement or anything else is welcome. I have found it hellish so far.

The section I'm referring to is ability to prepare food which your condition wouldn't impair. The other one on food is about whether you can physically transport food from the plate to your mouth so neither would be covered by your oral issues. It has to relate to specific descriptors.

Have I maybe posted this in the wrong area? Is there an area for disability for example that would have better understanding of eg. mental health as a proper disability. I have bipolar and a panic disorder rather than just feeling a bit sad if that really needs saying.

Some of the assessors are, frankly, evil government shills who seem to think it's a game where they get bonus brownie points and a pat on their mean little heads every time they make it harder for someone to get a pittance to buy bread and water. You'd think it was their own money half the time.

There are some good ones but they're few and far between, I have friends who are nurses and other qualified healthcare professionals who applied for those jobs more than once but we're turned down despite excellent CVs and an apparent desperate need for them. We came to the conclusion they probably came across as much too sympathetic.

I had the misfortune to encounter one particularly bitchy one in a west country coastal town when I was ill several years ago. I'm sure she'd have taken pleasure in my ending up on the street. Friends with chronic degenerative diseases have had the same experience. My condition was temporary and sorted out to a manageable level with meds eventually so I could go back to work but we're now having to go through it again for another family member and I am dreading it.

Meanwhile we have a so called government that is beyond selfish and corrupt, raking in huge amounts of money and God knows what subsidies and backhanders for destroying the country and no one ever seems to question it. Some "news" outlets even hold them up as examples to aspire to.

I really hope it goes as it should for you, good luck.

I’ve n/c for this but I applied for a MR because everything was understated on my PiP award. I went through everything line by line and wrote down what I said, how it affected me and corrected any mistakes I thought the assessor had made and they were many. Some I considered to be lies.

I had applied on both physical and mental health but they completely minimised the latter. So I laid out quite clearly what I had said in the original application, pointed out that this wasn’t addressed and I was awarded no points for. I also told them how many points I thought I should have been awarded based on what I said. I was awarded higher rates for mobility and daily living. It’s well worth doing even though it is incredibly hard and upsetting to do. I also included copies of things that I had sent for the original assessment, just in case they’d ‘overlooked’ them.

I would go through your original application line by line and address anything that has been either overlooked, minimised or is patently incorrect. Be firm and clear. I wish you well with it.

My dh has bipolar and severe depression and my son has complex autism. I want to apologise if I’ve made it seem that I’m in any way minimising or misunderstanding your issues. That wasn’t my intention at all. Plenty of people do claim PIP for these issues, of course. My son is on high rate dla. I completely understand the need to meet specific criteria and get the points you need. It can be really difficult with mental health issues. The forms aren’t built for these types of issues so much of it does depend on whose desk it lands on which is completely wrong.

This group in particular is very good - they have a number of files about completing forms etc / appeals etc

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@swallowedAfly I totally agree, mental health issues can be so debilitating. My husband wouldn't dress, wash, eat, take meds etc without prompting. He also cannot hold down a job any longer (was a teacher for over 30 years) as the thoughts constantly in his head stop him from concentrating. Without me filling in all the relevant forms he'd have nothing. I feel so sorry for people who have to struggle to complete them by themselves. Surely the fact you need to be prompted to eat will earn you points? How can the assessor prove you don't need prompting when they aren't in your home at mealtimes? Also, job wise, my dh worked while suffering from psychosis, until he could carry on no longer. There comes a point when it all gets too much doesn't there and you have my sympathies. You are bound to be sick of it all after this knock back. Don't let them put you off, I think that's what they rely on, people giving up
Try and get someone to help you with the forms and make sure you apply for everything you are entitled to. The person who came to the house and did my husbands social care assessment checked he is getting everything he's entitled to. Don't be afraid to ask for help.

Thank you so much Dawn. Teaching is my profession too. I just cannot do it anymore. As I say I've had the seriously VAST majority of the last year off. Was only back a couple of days before having a massive melt down on my senior manager then my direct line manager and that was on an inset day, not even teaching. I just can't.

Not quite the same, but my DH had a work capability assessment overturned by mandatory reconsideration. The report was a pack of lies, and included stupid things like 'denies wearing socks', when I'd helped him to put on his socks as I do everyday. I went through the report and pointed out everything that they had got wrong. I wrote 6 typed pages and referred to any evidence, and enclosed it.
I believe if they think they can get away with denying you are benefit, they will try, and hope that you just give up. I did also put at the end that we would be taking it to the appeal stage if the MR wasn't successful, just to let them know we weren't going to give up.

Paperwhite I've done similar - the heading for each area I think I qualify for, the descriptor that fits and explanation and details of what was actually said on the recorded assessment and what the report says (sometimes like you, what seems like outright lies because there's no other logical explanation). Given she's based decisions on what I didn't say then they should base decisions on what I did say.

If it is turned down I will do the same again in even more detail plus get lots more evidence.

Thanks for recognising how exhausting and distressing it is to have to go through it all AGAIN with a fine tooth comb. Having to listen to the recordings, including where I was crying and and struggling to put sentences together because I was exhausted after hours of interrogation, was really awful even before having to write about it all again.

The build up to the assessment and the aftermath of the decision was a mess.

Thanks Cay and well done for fighting your DH's corner like that.

You poor soul it's a vile and stressful situation to be in. In Feb this year I had a pip review,I had 12 points and the assessment was over the phone. Like yours the assessor lied,blatant inaccuracies, she stripped all my points to zero.
I fell into a spiral and felt invalidated and even suicidal.
Luckily I received fantastic support from cab and under my MR was awarded all my previous points plus five more.

I got no apology for the three months of hell with no pip and all the stress and impact on my health. Just here are your points. It's a barbaric system.
I'd recommend cab to help. I handed over all my evidence and he did all the work. I can't thank cab enough. Good luck and sending you love and support xxx

Thank you, unfortunately dealing with benefits seems to involve a lot of fighting. This week I've had to tell the council tax benefits section exactly where their calculations have gone wrong after they sent us an unexpected bill for £700!
Good luck with your MR, I hope it goes well for you.

@swallowedAfly Teachers are under so much pressure and stress these days. My SIL, a headteacher has also had a breakdown because of the pressures of her job. It literally nearly killed my dh (he made numerous suicide attempts, nearly killed me accidentally in the process). He did have quite a few physical heath problems too but, because of the pressures of the teaching job, everything became too much and he just broke. He has never recovered. He taught at a private school for challenging children, was spat on, kicked, accused of all sorts with no support from management. Best thing that ever happened to him was having his contract terminated, although we didn't think so at the time. We lost everything material, house, car etc We don't have much money these days and live in a tiny house but at least all that stress has gone. Mental health problems are real and can make you physically ill. You are not alone!

@SarahC50 So sorry to read what you have been put through. It's enough to make you ill if you weren't already!

Thank you so much Sarah, Cay and Dawn. I'm sorry for all you've been through!

It's so inhumane.

I noticed today after typing up my form for MR that there is no way to submit it online. You have to print it out and post it. It feels like that's another deliberate barrier put in. Lots of people don't have printers and plenty of disabled people can't leave the house.

Luckily I bought a printer a while back and ds can post it if I can't make it to the post box. Honestly the whole system is so transparently deliberately about creating obstacles and discouraging people to the point of giving up.

Dawn when I tried to go back in September I was literally balling my eyes out every morning trying to get ready. A couple of weeks in I'd made it to the side of the school trying to breath and hold back tears and a decent member of staff (sadly very few now at my school - not that everyone means to be unpleasant but so many are burnt out and on self preservation mode or snappy and exhausted too) saw I wasn't right and asked if I was ok. Cue total meltdown and having to be taken in the side gate and hidden in an old office to have a panic attack and ball my eyes out and be given a sweet cup of tea before I could calm down enough to go home. That was my last day.

Last year before I went off sick I was feeling suicidal for months and somehow just plodding on despite having next to no sleep, not eating and spending every evening and weekend crying and trying to work out ways that my son would be taken care of so I could commit suicide. I felt utterly trapped trying to keep a roof over his head but knowing I couldn't keep going as I was and I started thinking about how at least he'd get my in service death grant worth about £130,000.

Oh and I and I had 7 months off last year, returned for a very gentle and very phased return for the last month of summer term (first 2 weeks only having to be in half a day, no teaching first week and a half then only 1 lesson and never teaching more than 3 in that whole month) then within a couple of weeks in returning properly in September was signed off long term sick again.

Still the assessor wrote X goes to work most days. Like?!? How can I not see that as a deliberate outright lie?

@swallowedAfly You poor thing, my heart bleeds for you. Such similar symptoms to my dh, panic attacks at school etc. It might be a stupid question but do you get contribution based ESA? I don't even know if it still exists but my dh was awarded it 4 years ago. If it doesn't exist anymore, is there anything else, as well as the bluddy PIP, that you can claim? I understand what you mean about the life policy. I actually had to lie to my dh and tell him that life policies don't pay out on suicide as he was having exactly the same thoughts as you.

@swallowedAfly it is inhumane and it's designed to make you give up. The whole system is against you. It's abhorrent the way it treats I'll and disabled people. No wonder you hit rock bottom. I am full of admiration for you for not giving up and trying to get the benefits you are fully entitled to.

All the worse in my case was that it was a nurse that assessed me. Supposed caring profession. She coldly lied and wrote a spiel of inaccuracies about me. Luckily my DH sat with me throughout the phonecall otherwise I'd have felt I was losing my mind.

You feel invalidated,like a fraud and a faker. But please believe me keep fighting and on the other side you will feel such relief and so much better.

I was prepared to go to tribunal, I knew my neurological condition hadn't changed at all to justify a loss of 12 points. They are utter heartless bastards.

Stay strong we are all rooting for you xx

I looked it up and checked there wasn't a non payment for suicide clause! Well done you for lying.

I'm still employed and being paid sick pay for now so can't apply for esa and I think they just deduct the same amount you get from your Universal Credit. I already get UC as top up benefit because I worked part time due to health. I have been looking at when my next OH appointment is, when they'll schedule meeting after that, how long they have to consider things and when they'll likely inform me of dismissal plan and how much notice they have to give. I think it's likely to be after Christmas they move to dismiss me and then you get on average two months notice so unlikely to be officially employed till end of Feb.

@swallowedAfly Apologies, just realised you are still on long term sick? My dh had his contract terminated by the school in the end as, after putting him through hell, they said he wasn't fit to teach, which was correct. Unfortunately, he hadn't been there long as he'd left another school to work there thinking it would change our lives (it was round the corner from our house and I'd just started fostering process) Sadly, it did change our lives but not in the way we expected! Good luck with the MR. Don't give up, it's only what you deserve. You've paid into the system all these years and now you need some help you deserve to get it.

@swallowedAfly I worked for the NHS and was long term sick, it went down the capability route which was horrible as I was ill not incapable. I ended up being medically retired from the NHS and receive a small NHS pension. I also receive ESA and pip.

What was invaluable to me during the process was a union rep. Are you in a union? She came to all the meetings,liaised with occ health and guided me through it all.

It was all very scary for months as I was losing my income and it took 3-6months for my pension award to be sorted and benefits etc.

Please look after yourself and take any help you can. I replied heavily on sleeping tablets at the time. It is a period of excruciating stress that nobody really understands. But it will pass and it will get better. Msg here any time you are struggling as we understand the hell you are currently in x

@Dawn17 much love to your husband sounds like he's been through hell. I hope he is keeping a bit better now. The system is so wrong, all of it xx

@SarahC50 thank you xx

officially unemployed that should say!

Thanks Sarah. I can't afford not to fight. Full universal credit would only cover rent, bills and part of the food bill. Ok if you're short term unemployed maybe but long term it's impossible and would drive me over the edge I think.

There is, if I'm understanding it right, an extra amount you can have added to your UC for disability too (after another bloody assessment) but trying to find out and understand what you should get and how you even apply for it is like some kind of mensa test so I may be wrong. If I understand recent announcements tories are planning on removing this payment soon but those already on it (well done them for passing the mensa test) will keep it for a bridging period.

Yes I have a case worker from the regional union who has been on my case for a year. Work was awful at first and flagrantly ignoring disability law. She has attended meetings with me, advised on phased return and not abandoned me when that was finished and is now dealing with the school again whilst I'm sick as they kept contacting me so she asked them to do all communication through her. Thank God for her!