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Can I retire at 61 with 500k pension?

133 replies

haveienoughmoney · 06/11/2021 11:36

There’s a bit of a back story involving the relocation of the company I work for meaning I’d have to commute for 3 hours a day 3 days a week - they will give an allowance to cover some costs for 2 years, after that you’re on your own. They have declined my request for a WFH contract, even though Occupational Health have recommended it, the team I’m in is all remote anyway so there’s little point in my commuting to sit with people who have nothing to do with my role.

So - do I suck it up for 2 years and then retire at 63 or do I go now? My pension pot (DC) is just under 500k which sounds like an awful lot of money, but it could have to last until I’m 90+!

My intention in retirement is to sell my house for about 370k - no mortgage - and move closer to my sons in North Yorkshire where I’d be looking to buy for about 300k. This would enable me to upsize! - I have a tiny but very pretty cottage in Hampshire, I’d be looking to buy a 3 bed town house up North.

I’d value some opinions as once I’ve made the decision there’s no turning back. For what it’s worth I don’t particularly enjoy the job now that we have new owners, both my sons are keen for me to move nearer to them. I really like the area where I’d be looking to buy so if my boys moved away (I don’t think they will, but who knows)? - I think I’d be happy there.

I’m not a big spender and am happy with a reasonably simple life, I need to maintain a decent 2nd hand car, I’d like a few European trips and some meals out.

All thoughts welcome and thank you!

OP posts:
BackBackBack · 06/11/2021 17:11

@haveienoughmoney

Cocomarine - the new owners are very proud of their equality, diversity and inclusion policy. I said to HR making middle aged women commute up to 3 hours a day did not reflect upon them well (I’m not the only person affected by this, several colleagues are thinking about leaving too). They said at takeover they didn’t want to lose anybody as they valued the workforce - well, they’re going about it in the wrong way!
As someone that's a year into a 'brave new world' post-takeover I can assure you that what you were told at the point of takeover, and what happens once the money's hit the account, are two very different things! I would add a healthy dose of salt to anything you were told/promised/assured at the time, because if it ain't in writing then it's worthless.
TakeYourFinalPosition · 06/11/2021 17:15

You’ve had some great advice, and it sounds like you’ve made a decision!

My only advice would be to either think about if your sons currently stay often, or ask them if they would, before you buy somewhere bigger with the intention of them staying. DH & I have stayed at my in-laws twice in six years… we both prefer to come home. We’d definitely come home now we’re having a baby… it’s just so much easier at home, with our things and our schedule. For us, it’d be a poor investment for them to keep their house so that there’s room for us to stay - we’d rather not, anyway. We don’t stay at any family, really.

But a house somewhere you like, that’s future proofed, and let’s you enjoy life… that sounds pretty lovely! I’d just make sure it’s chosen to suit you, rather than hosting, especially if your sons and their families don’t currently stay often.

Oneforthemoneytwo · 06/11/2021 17:15

I suggest you look for a bungalow all on one level, exterior door wheel-chair accessible. Space for a walk-in accessible shower with a seat, usable by a personal assistant helping you to shower. A manageable garden with sitting out space, where you can potter, keep a pet and dry laundry or park a car

She’s 61 not 81!!!!

Bunnycat101 · 06/11/2021 17:18

I’d leave. They are being incredibly inflexible so I think it would be better to have the guaranteed £15k redundancy than risk a miserable time and you quitting with no pay off. Your pot feels healthy and with the state pension on top you could front-load your spending. I’d plan on the basis of not getting another job but if you can it would be a bonus and a good thing to top you up.

Cocomarine · 06/11/2021 17:49

@haveienoughmoney

Cocomarine - the new owners are very proud of their equality, diversity and inclusion policy. I said to HR making middle aged women commute up to 3 hours a day did not reflect upon them well (I’m not the only person affected by this, several colleagues are thinking about leaving too). They said at takeover they didn’t want to lose anybody as they valued the workforce - well, they’re going about it in the wrong way!
You need “record” not “policy” 😉
BackBackBack · 06/11/2021 17:51

@Bunnycat101

I’d leave. They are being incredibly inflexible so I think it would be better to have the guaranteed £15k redundancy than risk a miserable time and you quitting with no pay off. Your pot feels healthy and with the state pension on top you could front-load your spending. I’d plan on the basis of not getting another job but if you can it would be a bonus and a good thing to top you up.
Very good point and I have seen it happen. Redundancy is taken off the table and instead they just wait you out, because the working environment gets more and more unbearable.
PigletJohn · 06/11/2021 17:53

IIRC the flat annuity rate for a single life man of 65 is about 6%

although yours will be different

so £500,000 might bring around £30k a year, which is rather a good pension, round about average earnings with no commuting costs and no office suits to buy.

But as you intend to live for 30 years you must allow for rises in line with inflation, so not a flat scheme.

However, an annuity is unlikely to be your best option.

You could look at income drawdown or annual partial encashments while leaving your fund for future growth. I am doing that. You can calculate how long a pension in drawdown would last using various assumptions for growth, inflation, and withdrawals www.which.co.uk/money/pensions-and-retirement/options-for-cashing-in-your-pensions/income-drawdown/income-drawdown-calculator-making-your-money-last-awvp49g8uq6l

You ought to take professional advice from someone who has no axe to grind (i.e. they will not earn commission or other inducements from directing you down a particular route). In UK, the term "Independent Financial Adviser" has a legally defined meaning and is officially regulated. Many people are not so qualified.

start by getting all the free information you can.

try www.moneyhelper.org.uk/en/pensions-and-retirement/pension-wise?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIi8bXlrj18wIVHertCh2tbgD8EAAYASAAEgJEXfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

best if you get hold of your latest pension plan statement beforehand.

Also
have you got 35 years qualifying employment years of NI contributions? Very few people actually get the so-called "flat rate pension" of £179.60 per week www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get

Request a copy of your State Pension forecast from www.gov.uk/check-state-pension

beware of scammers, and only use the gov.uk sources.

avoid giving your real name, address, NI number etc to people who hope to harvest your details and sell them to salesmen. Some of these scammers use a "get a free quote of your annuity/pension (etc)" hook but don't actually give you one (you can test these by putting in false contact details and seeing what the page then tells you)

If you want to be frightened, look up "welsh steel pensions" for crooks who looted funds from pensioners.

SinoohXaenaHide · 06/11/2021 18:01

I would go with the early retirement plan but once you have relocated and settled into the new place see what you can do to bring in a bit of consultancy income or in some way earn something extra part time for a few years while you still have the energy. Retirement doesn't have to be all-or-nothing, it can be a gradual process.

WhipMaWhopMa · 06/11/2021 18:11

OP, you definitely need proper financial advice (and I'm not even going to think of contributing to any discussion about pensions, as mine went down the pan when I had children).

However, I can say that the house prices in the nice bits of North Yorkshire are on a par with Hampshire - especially houses within walking distance of shops, theatres etc - so you might need to ask for advice on this, too, when you get to that stage!

CherryRipe1 · 06/11/2021 18:35

@AlbertBridge

Town houses have a LOT of stairs, don't they? It wouldn't be my ideal retirement home.
Lots of Stannah stairlifts!
haveienoughmoney · 06/11/2021 18:39

Sorry to confuse with ‘town house’ - I meant a house ‘in town’ where I could walk to shops restaurants etc! ‘Town houses’ look lovely but no, I don’t fancy 3 flights of stairs!

OP posts:
YoungGiftedPlump · 06/11/2021 18:52

You need to have a good look at N Yorkshire house prices- not sure what you want is affordable at that price.

haveienoughmoney · 06/11/2021 19:03

YoungGifted I know N. Yorkshire is not particularly cheap but yes, I can afford the type of house I’d like there. DS1 has just bought a lovely 3 bed semi for 220k, I’d be very happy with similar. Considering I’d get circa 370k for my house (identical house next door (semi detached) I’d have a bit of wriggle room.

OP posts:
ForensicAccountant · 06/11/2021 19:05

@ Sandunesandseashells GAR are Guaranteed Annuity Rates and some of them were close to 10%. A GAR of 3% would be pointless. If you have a GAR you would be best not to dismiss buying an annuity with that pot.

haveienoughmoney · 06/11/2021 19:20

Identical house next door has just sold for 370k, that is!

OP posts:
TitsInAbsentia · 06/11/2021 19:27

I'd go now. I also think getting something part time work wise would be good and would help you settle in to a new area - yes you have family there but have a network outside of family would be a good move.

WhipMaWhopMa · 06/11/2021 19:31
Hmm

I would definitely do some research into areas before buying, OP.

TheChild · 06/11/2021 19:44

@2bazookas

I've been a bank customer long enough to have outlasted several bank managers (at two different banks) and during those decades have repeatedly had to have a polite calm conversation (by appointment with the new BM) that goes along these lines
  " I am the client, you are the service provider.  The money held in this bank belongs to me.  I like to operate my accounts to suit myself, thankyou.  

Sometimes I need advice and assistance from my bank. If you are unable to provide it, I will move my money to a bank which can. Here is what I want you to do/ help me with, please. ".

  It has never yet failed to produce an entirely satisfactory result.</div></div>

From someone who works in a bank, you sound like one of those customers the staff inwardly groan at when they see you walk through the doors.

OxanaVorontsova · 06/11/2021 19:51

I suggest you look for a bungalow all on one level, exterior door wheel-chair accessible. Space for a walk-in accessible shower with a seat, usable by a personal assistant helping you to shower. A manageable garden with sitting out space, where you can potter, keep a pet and dry laundry or park a car.

OMG this is ridiculous! My parents (80) live in a 3 storey town house, it’s kept them fit for the last 20 years since they moved in. I’m 51 and hope no one writes me off 10 years from now Confused

Sandunesandseashells · 06/11/2021 19:55

@ForensicAccountant

@ Sandunesandseashells GAR are Guaranteed Annuity Rates and some of them were close to 10%. A GAR of 3% would be pointless. If you have a GAR you would be best not to dismiss buying an annuity with that pot.
Wow, thank you! Just goes to show we all need proper advice. I’d describe mine as a legacy policy, it was NPI; after many company buyouts is now Phoenix. I can’t alter it, or increase contributions and if I stop paying in I can’t restart and I can only buy an annuity or transfer out. I’ve never paid more than £80/month and it’s worth over £100k. I learned enough from MSE to not transfer and tip into my other pension. Sorry for derail haveienoughmoney 💐
Rainbowshit · 06/11/2021 20:05

ugh no way would I be doing that commute! It's be a no brainer for me.

You have a pretty healthy pension pot so think you'd be fine to retire now. Whatever you do don't buy an annuity at the moment. They're really poor value.

I'd be off like a shot.

Rainbowshit · 06/11/2021 20:08

But yes as others have said best to get some decent financial advice.

Gladioli23 · 06/11/2021 20:23

Moving to a bungalow does your knees in because you don't use them.

I think I'd want to live somewhere fairly future proof e.g. downstairs loo, preferably bathroom and preferably with a dining room that I could convert to a downstairs bedroom if required. Hopefully it wouldn't be but I'd like the peace of mind of knowing I could manage if anything happened.

Money wise I would read some F.I.R.E blogs and consider the following:

I don't think you'll want an annuity because you'll likely want to draw down more while you're younger and a lot less once you have your state pension and then less again once you can no longer get about etc until you then need care and may want to draw down more.

A safe draw down rate is usually put at about 4%, which would give £20k a year. Without NI on that, that would be around £18k net which feels comfortable without a mortgage.

I think I would be tempted to see if I could even get a 2 day a week job for a few years to supplement that until the state pension came in if I wanted? Just to fund some extra travelling etc in the first few years. Even minimum wage at £9.50 an hour would be £6k s year take home on top of a £20k pension.

C8H10N4O2 · 06/11/2021 21:10

Agree with the comments re independent financial advice. Annuities are certainly not the only option you should consider either. Do consider keeping cash for the attic aka future repairs and maintenance on the house.

Laughing like a drain at needing adapted accommodation if you are other was fine. Nothing wrong with checking future adaptability for a house if its a life time house but as others say - plenty of people move quite happily in their 70s and 80s.

However from your original post:
"They have declined my request for a WFH contract, even though Occupational Health have recommended it, the team I’m in is all remote anyway so there’s little point in my commuting to sit with people who have nothing to do with my role."

This sounds like actively pushing you to redundancy. You mentioned its an OH recommendation, do you have a condition classified as relevant under the disability discrimination act? If so and if your team are remote and they won't even consider eg one of the three days from home then I'd also take advice on the employment situation in case you have a case for constructive dismissal. Sounds a bit like they want to sweep out some old timers and replace them with people who are cheaper or fit some kit of identikit.

WombatChocolate · 07/11/2021 13:44

I’m of the view, that lots of people who don’t like work, work for longer than they need to, because of fear and a lack of knowledge about what they will need/will have in retirement.

You need to work out what you will need to live per year. This is your NUMBER. You have to look at your spending very carefully from the last normal years and see how much that is, factoring in essentials and the lifestyle you want. A recent study said a single person on average needed just under £20k for a decent retirement to include some holidays, assuming they had no mortgage or rent. It is different for everyone though, but often less than people think because huge chunks won’t be going on pension contributions, NI and far less on tax, as well as no mortgage payments, if you’re still paying but close to finishing.

Then the key is to work out what your pot will deliver. You can have an annuity which is using the pit to buy a guaranteed income for life. This is what people used to do but fewer do now. These can be index linked so inflation proofed. In my mind, £30k buys about £1k of annuity. So I don’t think you’d get a £30k annuity, which someone mentioned unthread, but more like £17k. But you will get the £9.5k state pension later. Remember, the earlier you buy an annuity, the more expensive it is, becaue it has to pay out for longer.

Or you can do draw down as mentioned. You can take a chunk out to bridge the gap to state retirement, giving you £20k per year, and then drawn down a smaller amount per year of what is left, because you’ll be getting the £9.5k.

With an extra £15k you could receive to go, and any savings you already have, I think it’s not beyond the realms of possibility for you at all, assuming you’re not looking for a grandiose retirement.

Yes to seeing an advisor to crunch the numbers, but definitely start working out how much you need to live.

If you can go, I would. No e if kniw how much time we have left and our older years are likely to be the less healthy ones. I’m seeing our parents in late 70s starting to get frail now. Fortunately they retired in their 50s, so managed 20 years of active and brilliant retirement. If they’d waited until 67, they would have been lucky to get 10 years of active retirement in. Yes, they’d have a bit more money, but to be honest, the years of being able to spend it would be behind them. Live for now, when you can and stop work if you can afford to.

We all hear if people who die in their later 60s, or who are incapacitated in their early 70s. We hope it’s not us, but if it is and we could have had an enjoyable retirement before that, but instead chose to keep working to boost the pot, when it was already big enough, I think we and our families looking on would be sorry about our choices. We can never know how much time there is, so unless you are loving your work and prefer it as an option to not working, if you’re over 60 and can afford to stop, I certainly would. For anyone else reading, I’d also be look g seriously at this too if I were over 55 and could afford it.

So many people have no choice as they can’t afford to stop work, well, that’s the situation they find themselves in. But also, lots have a good pension pot or a good defined benefit pension which will give a guaranteed pay out, and often there are ways to make an early retirement work. It’s often a case ofworking back from state retirement age when the extra £9.5k will pay out, and finding ways to plug the gap to then. If you’re looking at plugging a gap of 5 or 7 or 12 years, chunks of money can do that for lots of people, and then from 67 they can take significantly less per year. Those calculations can be very liberating.

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