Landlord right or wrong please?

[3kidsandmore]

Please be gentle with me! Happy to be told I'm in the wrong but kindly would be appreciated. Feeling fragile and stressed.

Advice wanted please about my private rental situation...

To summarise- marriage ended in 2020 and we sold our family home and moved kids to new schools.

I took on a 12 month rental contract last November, to give the kids some stability whilst we all adjust.

I don't like my landlords because of the way they've behaved towards me. If only I'd known the letting agent played no part in anything after finding them a tenant (me).

We have agreed me leaving early in July and I gave them 3 months written notice of this. My question is, is it reasonable for them to demand 2 months rent payments after my departure in July?

Points to note about me and this is totally honest:

• I am a police officer, so a professional tenant- trustworthy & no drama.

-I have paid my rent on time each month. -I have treated the home with care & respect. I keep it immaculate and they know this. -I have been polite in all communication with them. All of it is by text message and I have kept the conversation on my phone.

Points to note about them / the house:
-They are a married couple who live in the village so 'pass by' often.
-Within my first 2 weeks here, the windows began leaking condensation was on all ceilings. Mr Landlord came around without a mask, barged in to tell me it must be the way I live, very aggressively. Mrs Landlord then confessed the windows don't have any vents and it's been an ongoing issue over the years.
-Mr Landlord begins harassing me by phone to tell me a window fitter will be around to measure up at a specific time.
I explained I work shifts and juggle 3 young children, all of whom are adapting to a very different homelife. I offered alternative times but he wasn't willing to arrange it for a mutually convenient time.
-I cleaned the condensation and mould myself and said I wasn't bothered about new windows and have found a way to manage it by having them all ajar 24/7.
-A few weeks later, the 25 year old boiler stopped working. I informed them and they said a gas man would be around to look at it in the next couple of days.
-Gas man came 2 days later, identified the problem but didn't have the part required to fix it. We had no heating or water during 4 days of snow, whilst the part was ordered.
-Boiler was repaired 5 days after it breaking, causing us huge discomfort and inconvenience but I did not complain. I am low maintenance and prefer to just find a way around things and not cause trouble.
-Mr & Mrs Landlord have repeatedly found spurious reasons to get themselves in here during lockdown, yet all they've ever seen is a clean and tidy home. I asked them to just leave us be unless there is an emergency, because I like to live a private life and am paying them a lot of money to live here.
-Mr Landlord then sends a barrage of verbal abuse saying they have always been friendly with tenants and don't understand why I'm being difficult and that he wants me out of his house ASAP.
-I text back telling him that's most unpleasant and unlawful, but that I will find somewhere else to live because I don't need this upset.
-A week later he asks whether I have found somewhere yet as he wants his house back. I say no but perhaps I could buy it from him (they had mentioned me being their last tenant before selling up). He says yes, gets it valued and I explore a mortgage possibility.
-I couldn't borrow enough, so a few weeks later, let him know that buying isn't an option for me but I do now have somewhere else to go, so will be gone in July.
-Mr Landlord by text message and Mrs Landlord by email (they both come at me separately by various means of communication) to say if I'm leaving in July, they want rent paid until September.
-I begin to fear they are totally unscrupulous landlords, out to grab every penny and wonder where my deposit was secured. I phone the letting agent and they remind me they don't 'manage' this property but confirmed my deposit has not been protected and to seek legal advice.
-I text Mr Landlord to check my deposit really hasn't been placed in a protected scheme at any point between November and now. It hasn't but suddenly, it was that day.

Should I pay 2 months rent on my exit or would you argue the case not to?

Sorry for the waffle and TIA.

Urgh. They’re shitlords! They have breached the tenancy by failing to put your deposit in a deposit protection scheme within 30 days of your tenancy beginning! You need to speak to shelter and tell them all of this and have them look at your contract. You may be liable for the remaining months’ rent.

You are a Police Officer, start acting like one! Would you put up with verbal abuse and harassment on the job? No! So do not accept it here!

Is it a 12 month fixed term? Is there a break clause in the tenancy agreement? You may well be liable for the rent for the full 12 months

The other stuff isn't really relevant to whether you have to pay the rent or not

Lash back hard.

If your landlord has not protected your deposit he is up SHIT CREEK. Leave at the date you want to leave. If he tries to get you to pay for extra months refuse. If he takes you to court counter sue for deposit not placed in approved scheme. Get a no fee no win lawyer.

Should I pay 2 months rent on my exit or would you argue the case not to?
No. Don't even dream of doing so.

Thank you so much for your replies so far. I am mortified at how much I waffled- it's easy to get carried away in this little box!

Dave (sorry, useless at quoting names as I normally just lurk and occasionally post for advice) you make a good point! I've by no means been a pushover but I'm always mindful not be a police officer in my personal life when dealing with personal matters. I have been assertive with them both, but diplomatically in writing rather than getting verbally abusive back at them.

The response to one message I sent assuring them that their property is in good hands and I wish to be left alone and not harassed by them for unnecessary visits, was 'are you ok hun?'. Impressively juvenile for a couple in their 50s!

I really do appreciate your input as I've not rented before and tenancy laws are not something I'm familiar with, but am researching.

To clarify- 12 month fixed contract with no break clause but lots of text messages from the landlord ordering me to leave ASAP in February / March.

They asked you to leave so you shouldn't have to pay.

You really need someone like shelter to look over your contract and their messages ordering you to leave to see if that counts as notice from them.

@Dutchesss

They asked you to leave so you shouldn't have to pay.

I pointed this out to them and they said 'it wasn't an ongoing offer'.

It wasn't an offer?! It was a demand, or at the very least, a request. No timing deadlines were put on it, but he was quick enough to forget the 12 month fixed contract, when he was in a huff about me not wanting my home to feel like Picadilly Circus.

Ex landlord here.
You have an absolute right to "quiet enjoyment" and they have no right at all to enter the property other than in an emergency. (This applies regardless of anything in the tenancy contract.)
I second contacting Shelter for advice.

@UhtredRagnarson

You really need someone like shelter to look over your contract and their messages ordering you to leave to see if that counts as notice from them.

Thank you. I will phone Shelter first thing.

Just didn't want to waste my time if I got majority replies voting 'you gave them the runaround with buying it then not buying it, so it's fair they want 2 months rent on your early departure'

It's a lovely house and would be snapped up tomorrow, for rent or sale and they know that. Very frustrating because life is too short for this nonsense.

Unless I misunderstood, if both parties mutually agreed for you to leave the rental in July and you had given 3 months notice, I don’t see how the landlord can then ask for 2 months rental after you leave even if you signed a 12 month contract. I’m surprised there’s no break clause in your contract.

If landlord hasn’t registered your deposit, he doesn’t have much of a leg to stand on either if he tries to sue you etc.

I’m a landlord and I certainly wouldn’t expect my tenants to pay once they have given the required notice period. He sounds like a muppet.

If your deposit wasn't put in a protection scheme within a month of you paying it, you can get compensation of up to 3 x the amount of the deposit. That could be a useful bargaining chip.

Is there any evidence that he told you he wanted you out, OP? Texts or emails or anything? It's pretty rich that he told you to go, but expects you to keep paying after you've left because it's before the end of the tenancy. I don't see how he could pursue you for the money if you can prove he told you to leave.

Some landlords really are complete shits. Far too many of them, tbh.

@ICouldHaveCheckedFirst

Ex landlord here. You have an absolute right to "quiet enjoyment" and they have no right at all to enter the property other than in an emergency. (This applies regardless of anything in the tenancy contract.) I second contacting Shelter for advice.

Thank you. It's reassuring to know some landlords / ex LLs respect the rights of tenants. I got unlucky with my first and last ever rental experience!

Do you know whether the same stands for tradespeople coming in to carry out non-emergency work that I've not requested? I should note Mr Landlord always tells me, rather than asks, what time they are coming and exactly 24 hours beforehand. Mr Landlord also insists on chaperoning them around.

When I tell Mr Landlord that as the occupier, I can show the tradesperson around, he tells me it has to be himself not me.

Gives me the creeps that every tradesperson knows Mr & Mrs Landlord from the village, so even then, I have no privacy. I have nothing to hide, but it's very intrusive to have strangers walking through your home.

All the trades visits have been to 'measure up this' or 'check on that'. No actual money has been spent here since circa 1999. It's a lovely little house but tired and dated.

As has been mentioned, the fact that your landlord has not protected your deposit is VERY serious. Read up on this at the DPS website.

Secondly, we're you given this - it's a legal requirement:

www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent/how-to-rent-the-checklist-for-renting-in-england

I also wonder whether your rental agreement (which should be an AST/Assured Shorthold Tenancy) complies with current legislation. The above document plus Shelter should help you determine this.

Also, were you given the following certificates - again, if not, your landlord is in serious trouble:

• gas safety
• electricity
• EPS

Lastly, are there smoke alarms and a carbon monoxide monitor, and are they working?

Hey OP, they really are an unpleasant pair & I am being polite. Firstly your contract should say that if you wish to end your tenancy how much notice you need to give & the same applies to them, secondly yes you can be liable for the remaining months left including council tax & utilities however if you can show that you have given them ample notice & they have been hounding you to leave I would be smart and write to them. Tell them that you are leaving as per the date you told them initially and as they have given you no other option (state the dates & the wording of the texts) because they have told you that they want you out and sufficient notice has been given by you in order for them to find a new tenant. Ask to meet for a final inspection a month before you leave so you have time to deal with whatever they throw at you because they will. Remember the hse must be handed back in the same state as when you checked in. This is why the check in report is important here. Always be reasonable and show you have tried to come to a compromise. (Important if you need to take them to small claims court) Pls read the attached for detailed info www.citizensadvice.org.uk/housing/renting-privately/ending-your-tenancy/ending-your-tenancy/ Thirdly, I am afraid that they do seem like the sort who will try to say that you have damaged the property and try to claim off your deposit from TDS (tenancy deposit scheme) so take pictures of everything. You also have the check in report that you would have been given by the agent on the first day. Get this out & go through it with a fine tooth comb. Compare then & now and you will be able to tell if you need to do anything ie reseal bath if it’s mouldy now but was pristine then. Also when they completed their 3 monthly checks did they ever provide you with a report?? Or even an email to follow up on issues/concerns? This will be your evidence if they try to claim for damage etc. Remember they cannot claim for fair wear & tear. All this ‘evidence’ you will need if they put in a claim with TDS. Pls dm me if you need any help.

@FlowerArranger

As has been mentioned, the fact that your landlord has not protected your deposit is VERY serious. Read up on this at the DPS website.

Secondly, we're you given this - it's a legal requirement:

www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent/how-to-rent-the-checklist-for-renting-in-england

I also wonder whether your rental agreement (which should be an AST/Assured Shorthold Tenancy) complies with current legislation. The above document plus Shelter should help you determine this.

Also, were you given the following certificates - again, if not, your landlord is in serious trouble:

• gas safety
• electricity
• EPS

Lastly, are there smoke alarms and a carbon monoxide monitor, and are they working?

Thank you so much for your advice. I was given the EPC, gas & electricity certificates by the letting agent. The landlords paid for a tenant find only service which included the legal bits initially.

I will however, get Shelter to look over my contract.

@DutifulDaughterWifeMother your reply is so kind & informative. I am so grateful for you taking the time to reply with all of that advice because this is really stressing me out.

I like your suggestion of having them come around to inspect the property. I really look after the house but it worries me that they could come in on moving out day, throw paint on the carpets and graffiti the walls, and accuse me of having done it.

I will ask my (ex) DH to be present when I do videos of how I'm leaving it so that I have a witness. We are on good terms and he is also annoyed with Mr & Mrs Landlord.

I might well DM you if you really don't mind. Thanks again.

@LakieLady sorry, I got so much helpful advice last night that I failed to acknowledge it all. Thank you for your advice- I will definitely make a counter claim for 3 x my deposit if they continue to pursue rent once I've gone.

Isn't it rich indeed? I have text messages from him telling me he wants me out of his house and the sooner, the better. Their argument is that this was said in February and it wasn't an ongoing 'offer'.

Unfortunately it can take longer than a few days or weeks to find somewhere else to live! I am now relocating and buying a property on my own but can't pay them rent and my mortgage once moved in July.

they also have to give you the current booklet (can't remember its exact name!) about renting advice (check shelter they have the name) if you have email/text of them giving you notice they are screwed
But - re boiler repairs - that is not something that is easy to control to be honest, you are at the mercy of the repair system. BUT they should have given a small heater for the time being at least

If your tenancy is the the standard shorthold tenancy agreement there is a clause about notice. It's reasonable for them to expect payment until the end of the rental month(say your rent is from the 1st-30th each month but you move on on the 20th) but not 2 months! They are just chancing it.

Sadly OP, legally, you are not in a good position. They had no right to tell you to go at anytime during your fixed term unless under Section 8. They didn't. Their correspondence was therefore useless and you could have just completely ignored it.

What is correct is that as you signed fixed term for 12 months, you are indeed liable for rent until that date. You can only get out of it by mutual agreement and clearly, their agreement is that you can end the tenancy after September.

Have you already signed an agreement for a new place?

As for the deposit, did you find out that it wasn't protected within 30 days in one of the schemes?

In terms of having work people coming in, no they cant force anything that isn't essential but in this instance, it sounds like you were complaining about the windows so they were responding to your complaint. It's hard to get tradespeople and very often, they dictate the time and date if you want something done quite quickly, tenant or owner. 5 days for a boiler repair in the winter was actually quite good going. Its unlikely you'd have got a better service as a homeowner.

You are entitled to peace and quiet and as such, you have a right to change the locks and refuse entry. You also can ignore texts etc...

@vivainsomnia - can you please quote the relevant legislation that allows tenants to change the locks and refuse entry and ignore texts etc... from their landlord?

Your tenancy was for 12 months. Unless it has a break clause you are committed for 12 months rent. Even if you decide to move out sooner, you are still liable for the rent. That is what you agreed to and signed for. If the LL has followed all of the legal obligations, you could reasonably be held to what you signed.

Assuming the LL meets their obligations(and I know they haven’t here) I’m not sure why people think a tenant who signs a contract for a certain period, thinks they should be able to give notice whenever they like and move out without paying rent for the full period they signed for. If this were the case, tenants would sign contracts and move in and give notice within a week or two and only stay a couple of months. That cannot be acceptable.

Contracts have clear terms and conditions. They give BOTH LLs and tenants legal responsibilities and entitlements.

Here it might well be that the LL has lost their rights by not meeting their legal responsibilities to register the deposit etc. However, the OP should know for future reference, that is she signs a contract for a certain period, she should expect to have to pay rent for the full period unless there is a specific break clause written in.

@mumwon

they also have to give you the current booklet (can't remember its exact name!) about renting advice (check shelter they have the name) if you have email/text of them giving you notice they are screwed But - re boiler repairs - that is not something that is easy to control to be honest, you are at the mercy of the repair system. BUT they should have given a small heater for the time being at least

It's called "How To Rent", I believe.