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Wrong size Mooncup - who's right?

24 replies

mamhaf · 19/11/2007 19:01

Doing my bit to save the planet, I ordered a Mooncup from here:
stores.ebay.co.uk/Mother-Natures-Goodies
There are two sizes, and I ordered the size A which is recommended for women who've given birth vaginally.
When it arrived, I opened the box and followed the instructions to use it.
This involves boiling the Mooncup to sterilise it, and then trimming off the end.
Only after doing that - when I realised it didn't feel 100% comfortable - did I notice that they'd sent the size B, which is too small.
I contacted the seller to tell her, and basically she's refusing to refund or replace, saying it was my responsibility to check the goods were as ordered before using (despite the fact that it was their responsibility to send me the size I'd ordered).
The size is in very small print on the box, and not printed on the Mooncup itself at all.
I've left negative feedback - but is it worth pursuing via trading standards do you reckon?

OP posts:
dd666 · 19/11/2007 19:04

have you got receipt and box? check mooncup site as they have returns policy if you dont like it hth and bumps for you

mamhaf · 19/11/2007 19:10

Yes, I've got the receipt and box - but basically she's saying because I boiled it and trimmed it, it's my fault for not checking and I can't get a refund.
If anyone can be bothered to read through, here's the full email exchange (read from bottom up:

MNG:
There are sadly also plenty of customers who think that they can try and
take advantage of other people on the basis that they are the customer and
are therefore always right. It's a small box and so the writing is small but
it is there quite clearly and thousands of other people have managed to read
it perfectly well.

Mistakes do happen - we are only human after all. I have apologised for the
mistake and told you that it would have been rectified immediatley had you
checked the item before using it.

I would suggest that if you want a company who can throw away money based on
their customers own mistakes then yougo to a large multinational like Boots
instead of a small family run concern where every penny we waste is one more
penny that comes out of our pay packets and away from our children.

We are of course always sad to loose potential customers but I can't simply
throw away money based on somebody else's mistakes.

Please take care in the future to check your order whoever it comes from -
as you seem to have realised it is your place to do this and failing to do
it then demainding refunds takes money away from innocent parties and puts
up the prices for everyone else who is able to take those few moments of
their time to check.

As I have said before, your feedback response is entirey your choice. I have
left what I feel to be an accurate and fair rebuttal. I have also barred you
from purchasing goods from our shop as clearly you would prefer to trade
with huge faceless indistrials rather than small family run companies and I
would hate for you to purchase from us mistakenly

I consider the matter closed. Unless there is anything further you need to
contact me with regarding using the item then further emails will be classed
as spam and reported to ebay

Me:

Ok, if that's your last word I'll go ahead and post my feedback.

I have to say I'm disappointed at your lack of regard for customers.

The sizing is not clear on the box - it's in small print and the fact
remains that if you had fulfilled the order correctly and despatched the
correct size we would not be in this situation and I would not be out of
pocket.

I would also have considered ordering items from you again - but if you're
prepared to jeopardise future trade from myself and other customers who look
at your eBay feedback then that's entirely up to you.

I wouldn't have thought it was great business practice from your
perspective, but then lots of businesses cease trading for lack of customer
care so your approach wouldn't be any different.

MNG:

I can understand your frustration in this matter. Without doubt it is
absolutely not your fauly that the wrong item was sent, however it is your
responsibility as the customer to check that the item is correct and not
damaged when the packet arrives.

As you say the Mooncup is sent in its original packaging with the size
very
clearly printed on the outside of the box so it would have taken only
moments to just check it was correct.

Had you found the mistake before using the item I would have of course
accepted it back for an exchange, however now that you have damaged the
item
by cutting it there is nothing I can do to help you as the item cannot now
be used for anybody else.

If you feel you would like to contact trading standards regarding this
then
I am happy for you to do so but I can assure you that we are acting
absolutely within the trading laws by asking that if an item is incorrect
in
any way it is returned unused and undamaged to us. I am sure you would not
expect to buy a pair of trousers from a shop, shorten them, and then go
backdemanding a refund because they were the wrong size.

Where an item is faulty we will always replace or refund. Where a mistake
is
made on an order we will always accept it back unused for an exchange or
refund. Where an item is simply not wanted we will again accept back
unused
for a return or refund. However we cannot accept back an item that has
been
used and 'damaged' by the customer but is not faulty.

With regards feedback it is of course entirely up to you what you choose
to
say. Our own comments will only be made once the transaction is fully
complete and will reflect the full situation. Any bad feedback received
regarding this item will be challenged through square trade as we are
acting
completely within rights in this instance

Me:

I'm sorry but I do not accept your reply and I would either like a refund
or
a replacement which is the size I ordered.

I ordered it in good faith and the sizing on the order form is very clear

It's not my fault that you then sent the wrong item when I was very
careful
to ensure I ordered the correct size. That is entirely your responsiblity
and you should accept that.

The size is in small print on the box; not stated on the item itself (or
if
it is it's so small to be unreadable to the naked eye) and I only noticed
the wrong sizing when I looked again at the box as it was on the bathroom
shelf.

Please reconsider my request for a replacement or refund before I put my
feedback on eBay and contact Trading Standards

MNG

I am sorry that the wrong size was sent to you but it

does
fall to you to check the contents of your package when it arrives. We
cannot
exchange it now that you have used and cut the item. Any items have to be
returned in completely unused condition

I am sorry that this has happened but there really is nothing I can do
for
you now that you have used the Mooncup

Me: (Ist email)

I've just received the Mooncup I bought from you via eBay and it's not
the
size I ordered.

As you can see from the attached screenshot, I bid on a size A, but the
one
you sent is a B.

Unfortunately I'd already opened it, boiled it and trimmed the stem and
tried using it before I noticed the size on the box.

Could you send me the correct size I've ordered please? (I'll send the
wrong
one back if you like, although it's obviously not suitable for resale
because of the reasons I've given above)

OP posts:
stripeymama · 19/11/2007 19:14

at their response!

Do they think being a small company absolves them of their responsibility to send out what you ordered?

Make more fuss!

Kathyisa6incheshighmummy2007 · 19/11/2007 19:21

I'm not sure what the legal situation is, but I think they're arseholes. Does that help?

Kathyisa6incheshighmummy2007 · 19/11/2007 19:23

Anyway, whether they're legally right or wrong, you are at perfect liberty to leave comments all over the web that accurately describe what happened, and I think most people would agree that whatever the legal situation, they were morally in the wrong, and not want to do business with them. They've shot themselves in the foot IMO.

whomovedmychocolate · 19/11/2007 19:28

What a horrid vendor, she's basically accusing you of lying. Yes you should have checked the box but if you order chicken in a restaurant and they bring you turkey and you take a bite and realise their mistake and send it back, you aren't asked to pay for the turkey are you (sorry crap metaphor but I'm tired).

I can see from her PoV she is out of pocket but she made the mistake, not you. Did you pay by paypal? If so you could make a claim as 'item significantly different from description'.

mamhaf · 19/11/2007 19:31

That's a thought - yes, I did pay by Paypal.

OP posts:
whomovedmychocolate · 19/11/2007 19:36

Right, well FILE A CLAIM. She then has to prove that the mistake is yours. If she admits she sent you the wrong item they will refund you, especially if you offer to return it and state you did not notice till too late that it was the wrong size. Will take a month or so though to go through their claims process.

SoupDragon · 19/11/2007 19:52

She does have one good point though: would a company refund you on a pair of trousers you'd shortened but then noticed were a 16 and not a 14?

yurt1 · 19/11/2007 20:10

The mooncup people themselves let you send them back if you don't like them- you can try for 3 months, so I think the whole thing is a bit weird tbh. She's not competing very well (is she much cheaper?)

Poor customer service on her part.

Kathyisa6incheshighmummy2007 · 19/11/2007 20:12

But re the trousers, the shortening is a direct response to them being too long, so you'd be a bit silly not to check the size at that point. Whereas trimming the Mooncup stem is what you do to fit the Mooncup even if it's the right size.

melpomene · 19/11/2007 20:15

Well, just to play devil's advocate, the seller could point to section 35(1)(b) of the Sale of Goods Act 1979 to back up their position:

"35. Acceptance

(1) The buyer is deemed to have accepted the goods subject to subsection (2) below?

(a) when he intimates to the seller that he has accepted them, or

(b) when the goods have been delivered to him and he does any act in relation to them which is inconsistent with the ownership of the seller."

However, morally I think you are in the right. Having recently bought a Mooncup myself, I know that the sizing isn't obvious on the box or on the product. The seller was clearly in breach of the contract by sending you goods that weren't as described. She is just trying to emotionally blackmail you by harping on about how they are a small company and you are taking money away from her children, and those matters aren't relevant at all.

I think the Paypal route is a good suggestion.

Dior · 19/11/2007 20:17

Message withdrawn

Isawbumperkissingsantaclaus · 19/11/2007 20:47

What about the money taken out of your pay packet and away from your children? [guilt trip emoticon]

Whatever the law says she hasn't dealt with it very well. And wrt the trousers example it would be questionable if the trousers had been picked for you and sent to you, not if you picked them yourself.

Dior · 19/11/2007 20:51

Message withdrawn

southeastastra · 19/11/2007 20:55

i'd just forget about it tbh. she has lots of negs, didn't that put you off in the first place?

mamhaf · 19/11/2007 21:58

I've just filled in the Paypal dispute resolution form.
This goes to the seller in the first instance, so I'm not expecting very much - but, we'll see.
She has asked me to mutually withdraw the negative feedback I left, which I'm not going to do - she's the one trying to run a business (into the ground if she carries on imo)

OP posts:
CarGirl · 19/11/2007 22:04

If I were her I would have sent a replacement as a goodwill gesture because she did send you the wrong item and you wouldn't know it was the wrong size received if you've never seen one in real life before, perhaps you should mention your visual impairment that prevented you from being able to notice the tiny writing on the size of the box........

MARGOsBeenPlayingWithMyNooNoo · 19/11/2007 22:12

I can't believe the reaction of the vendor.

Their mistake, their problem and their loss if they're not willing to try to compromise.

mamhaf · 20/11/2007 13:06

An update - after submitted the Paypal complaint I phoned the Government's consumer direct helpline this morning - details here:
www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/
They were really helpful and basically confirmed I'm in the right.
They've told me to send a recorded delivery letter, quoting the Sale of Goods Act and giving the seller 14 days to put it right.
If that doesn't rectify it, they said to call them back.
I've got the bit between my teeth now, especially as most people here agreed the seller's being unreasonable.

OP posts:
Dior · 20/11/2007 13:08

Message withdrawn

Flame · 20/11/2007 13:18

I would have thought that legally they were right (although apparently not going by your claim response ), but as a small business myself, I would give a full refund/exchange regardless of my legal position. It would have been my mistake.

I would like my product back, but that is because nappies can be sold used! (Obviously not on my shop...)

mamhaf · 10/01/2008 13:54

Update on this.

Paypal turned down my complaint and the vendor didn't reply to my recorded delivery letter, which I sent after talking to Consumer Direct.

Rather than go to the small claims court, I emailed the Mooncup manufacturers directly asking if they could help.

They were brilliant - apologised, sent me one in the correct size and said they would be speaking to their supplier (i.e the vendor). I hope they stop supplying her!

And I have to say I find the Mooncup is great now I have the right size. I won't be going back to tampons.

OP posts:
nannyL · 10/01/2008 19:43

wahoo! result

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