My employer is scamming me!! HELP

[BellaSing1607]

When corona virus started, my employer decided to close before the lockdown happened and before the Furlough scheme came out. When they announced the scheme, i asked my employer via whatsapp what will happen from now on, she said that "she will pay me up until the 17th of march which is up to when i have worked, and from there on the government will pay 80% of my salary."
I assumed this is her way of telling me i have now been furloughed. I checked in with her a few days later again, and asked her if the government will pay 80% of my salary, to which she responded "yes, I told you about this before and the accountants are working on it" so its a pretty clear agreement. I had no idea she was meant to send me a formal letter to announce that i have been furloughed.
Days come and go and whenever i would ask her for my payment, she would say the government hasn't paid her yet so she can't pay me, that there is a very long qeue and everyone is waiting, that we are all in this together and i should be patient bla bla. May came and i still hadn't gotten paid for march, not even the days i had actually worked. I asked all my friends and they all said they had gotten paid on the furlough scheme. (I only have one colleague and she is self employed)

I messaged the employer again to tell her everyone i know had gotten paid on the furlough scheme except me, what the problem is, and that the issue is wirh her not the government. She then replied and said we are not able to pay you because her accountants hadn't put me on the payroll by the deadline which was 19TH OF MARCH !! I had been working there since SEPTEMBER!!!.

when i asked her to send me an email to confirm that i had been furloughed she denied that we had any kind of agreement of me being furloughed, saying that she only sent these text based on an assumption. I am going crazy as now i am already minus 3 months in salary and i dont think i can do anyrhing about it.

I have been working for this woman since september last year, haven't received any of my payslips until mid april. I haven't asked for them as i never needed one, and thought if she is messing around with my taxes that would be her problem. Ofcourse now looking back i feel stupid for not asking for them.

In my last payslip that she sent me, it includes furlough payment although she didnt end up paying the amount as there was a mistake with the amount. Do you think this is enoigh proof to confirm we did have an agreement of furloughing me ?

What can i do to get my money ??? Please help

@TheSmelliestHouse @fascinated perhaps her accountant has calculated the taxes and everything before, and then backdated them when she provided me the payslips ? Or can you only calculate the taxes if you already have access to the PAYE reference and this whole thing is a coverup?? Honestly i am so confused and wish i knew more about this whole topic

Have you looked on the government GATEWAY to see if your NI has been paid?

https://www.gov.uk/check-national-insurance-record

Wow, what a mess.

Firstly, she did calculate the 80% correctly. If you work regular hours on a set salary then it’s 80% of that salary on either 28th Feb or 20th March. It’s only an average of the last 12 months/time you were employed if your hours vary week to week. Your change was a permanent change.

But - to say you were not on the payroll despite having worked there since September is fraudulent. The Real Time Information rules state that employers have to report pay & deductions to HMRC on or before the day the employee is paid. I was 1 day late reporting it during lockdown due to transferring software onto a laptop at home and I had to fill in a thing to give my excuse.

The accountant also sounds incompetent.

From reading your texts she seems to be under the misapprehension that the government will pay you 80% of your salary. What actually happens is the employer is meant to calculate the 80%, pAy it as usual then from whatever date it was in April the employer claims that amount, plus employer NI & pension contributions back.

Talking of which, I bet you’ve not been sent a letter about auto enrolment pension?

I run a payroll. You have to report monthly, that's the RTI information you send. I then pay HMRC what the company owes monthly as well as paying pension contributions to the pension provider.

The payroll software calculates who joins the pension scheme due to auto enrolment, people can also opt in or out. Specific letters need to be sent for this.

I can furlough my employees because they were listed on the RTI I sent on 28th February.

I have no idea how she's got away without doing this, to not even have a reference number.

@BellaSing1607 Hey, just to let you know there are two identifying names in your screenshots up there ☝🏻One of them yours? Best of luck with this

God I hate this woman for you. Don’t let this rest she’s doing something dodgy.

So she's been deducting tax and national insurance from your salary since September but there is no PAYE scheme set up for the company? Therefore off the radar with hmrc. What has she been doing with the money that's been deducted? The whole thing sounds dodgy.

Definitely sounds dodgy! I hope you get what you are owed quickly

Is the accountant actually an accountant and where had your money been going?

She sounds dodgy and / or doesn’t understand the furlough scheme . The government pays her the employer the 80 percent - she still needs to pay you . It sounds like she thinks that the government will directly pay you ?? Or she wants you to think that while pocketing you’re furlough money !

Did she make you redundant and then change her mind when she realized about the furlough scheme ?

It wasn't registered with HMRC as an employer?

Have you searched company house for this firm?

Why did they close early? Were there signs the business was in difficulty?

I would message her on Monday and say she’s got 48 hours to sort it or you’re going to HMRC. You want your money and all your outstanding payslips, plus you’ll probably be for a p60 by now. Don’t be overly polite, but don’t be rude either - just matter of fact. Don’t pick up the phone if she tries to call you (she’ll only do that so it’s off the record). If she does call, fire off a follow up email and say thanks for the call, but you want everything in writing from now on.

And if she doesn’t come through, I would ring HMRC on Wednesday. She is up to no good and it will hurt her a lot more than it hurts you (and she’ll know that).

So that email basically says that this was a new PAYE scheme set up & the reference numbers weren't received until after the 19th March, your employer can't submit RTI's until they receive these numbers - I've spoken to HMRC a lot about this issue & if this is the case then the company doesn't qualify for the CJRS for any employees as none would have been included on an RTI received by HMRC on or before 19th March due to not having PAYE reference numbers.

Hi op if you worked & were being paid then you are on their records. Unless you have agreed otherwise with your employer you're entitled to be paid full pay is my understanding of the furlough arrangement. It's pretty easy to prove employment if you've been paid. I don't know how you could not be if that makes sense?

I would give acas helpline a ring if I was you. They'll probably be able to help you sort this one out.

If the PAYE Scheme wasn’t set up & an initial RTI including the OP sent in or before 19th March then she won’t qualify - it’s very easy to issue payslips & actually pay people without sending the relevant RTI (you just tick the reasonable excuse box when you eventually get around to sending them) or even having the PAYE reference numbers.

OP I have sent you a PM

Oh shit. This isn't good.

At the very least, hmrc do not know of this employment and she's stealing deductions money..and the accountant isn't a real accountant. Probably a basic bookkeeper. and incompetent
At worst, she's stolen the furlough payments from gov. Suspect it's the first.

Report.

And run a mile. This woman doesn't know how to run a business much less employ anyone. What a joke.

It would be a reasonable excuse if the OP started work in February. But the OP started last September. It doesn’t take 6 months to set up a PAYE scheme.

Comefromaway no it shouldn’t take 6 months but I have clients I have been trying to get information out of since November to get their payroll set up with no luck - until the start of April when funnily enough they started replying to my emails & returning my calls

Are your clients employers? Do they not set it up themselves with HMRC? I guess they don’t care they are breaking the law by not setting up a PAYE scheme before paying someone.

And the OP should have either Been auto enrolled or given the option to join a pension by now even if deferred (depending whether she’s an eligible or entitled jobholder)

You can use a simple salary calculator to calculate the tax and ni you would have paid, so she didn't "need" to have you set up correctly to pay you. This all sounds dodgy as fuck. If I were you, I'd be looking for another job or to claim benefits.

You also need to check directly with HMRC on if any tax or NI has been paid for you as, unfortunately, you are the one liable.

And in the future, always make sure you get a payslip every month, it's a legal requirement.

Yes but they pay my company to set up & process their payroll for them - the most difficult part for us is getting the original information to get them set up with HMRC & even with established payrolls we often get told of a new employee that started a few months ago.

HMRC don’t really care as long as the RTI’s are sent & the PAYE liabilities are paid once the systems update showing what is due - we’ve yet to have anyone issues with a penalty & it stand on appeal.

As for the pension until HMRC advise the Pension Regulator that the employer has registered with them there are no obligations as they’re not on the PR’s radar.

What the law says about PAYE & pensions & how it works in practice are very different things.

Looks like the accountant has backdated you and now put you on the payroll and give you payslips. Check your tax code as you probably have been over paying as you haven't had a tax number.

They have failed to put you on the payroll until after the furlough deadline even though you've been working there since sep. Looks like you'll have to claim universal credit. Apply today online as you'll loose money each day you wait as it's not back dated.

Ask your employer to pay you the 80% from her pocket as its her responsibility to provide payslips. I'd take her to the small claims court for loss of earnings. You have the messages and bank transfers to prove that you are an employee. Good luck