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second interview under caution

21 replies

Tromsogirl · 31/03/2018 08:32

we are really frightened. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. My partner was interviewed by DWP as they claim he has not declared receiving a pension. He has a stroke in 2011 which left him disabled and unable to work. There was a gap until he received his occupational pension as the employer investigated his health and made his pension up a couple of years. At this time his father down south became terminally ill and he was busy going up and down on the train to visit, find care and a hospice. My partner thought that during this chaotic and emotional time he informed the DWP by phone that he was in receipt of his occupational pension when it came through. He can’t prove it. Last year my partner wrote to DWP listing his income and the result was an interview under caution as they claim he’s been fraudulently claiming payments from them because he did not inform them of receiving his occupational pension. He was interviewed and told them he thought he had informed them during the time he was dealing with his father. They now want to interview him again under caution about the phone calls. We are worried sick. He never intended to be fraudulent. His emotional circumstances at the time and lack of cognition after his stroke are all we can think of as the reason if he didn’t inform them but he thinks he possibly did but has no record of making the phone call to DWP.

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SusanneLinder · 31/03/2018 10:38

I would contact your nearest Welfare Rights Service for advice.

Tromsogirl · 31/03/2018 11:24

Thank you x

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Babyroobs · 31/03/2018 11:59

If he is receiving ESA then an occupational pension would need to be taken into account. DLA/ PIP are not affected by other income or capital. I think he just has to be honest as to what happened and hope they understand. There may be a large overpayment to pay back. Was it contributions based ESA he was getting or Income related ?

Tromsogirl · 31/03/2018 13:59

Thank ypu for reading my post. Yes. It was contribution based ESA.

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Babyroobs · 31/03/2018 14:19

Have the ESA payments been lowered now that they know about the pension ?

hmmwhatatodo · 31/03/2018 16:14

Doesn’t the fact that he added it to his list of income last year show that he didn’t mean to not tell them? Yes, go to the citizens advice and see what they suggest. I’m sure it will just be a case of paying money back. If it was that big a deal why would they let it drag on for so long.

Tromsogirl · 31/03/2018 20:05

Yes they have. Thanks.

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Tromsogirl · 31/03/2018 20:08

I know. He never intended to fraud anyone. He so follows rules. We can hardly believe it and we're very upset. I thought the same about our waiting 8 weeks to hear they want another interview under caution. We're totally devastated and feel like we're in a bad nightmare. He would never take a penny that wasn't meant for him. Thanks x

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hmmwhatatodo · 31/03/2018 21:23

When did he have his first interview? 8 weeks ago? And now they want him to come back and say that he thought he had called them but it seems he hadn’t? What a waste of time. Can you gather info about when he was visiting his dad and so on to show the stress he was under? Are they still paying him whatever money it is they give him (but reduced I imagine?) I wonder if your mp could help you. My friends dad had issues with the housing people wanting him t pay back thousands of pounds due to him forgetting to tell them about a change, because he had been under lots of stress (death in the family, illness and so on) they managed to make it so he didn’t have to pay it down, I know the mp gave them support but I don’t know the details. Did they tell him at his other interview they would need to speak to him again?

Tromsogirl · 01/04/2018 00:35

Yes his 1st interview was 8 weeks ago. I could get copies of bank statements with records of buying train tickets. Thanks. His payments are now reduced. Never thought of using MP. Thank you x

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EskiVodkaCranberry · 01/04/2018 00:40

I'd make sure every contact was in writing and suggest the burden of proof lies with them to prove he did not phone them. If he can give them rough dates they can check their presumably faultless records...
If he had no intention of any wrongdoing it should work out, wish you all the best

swingofthings · 01/04/2018 07:17

If it is a genuine error and indeed, he informed them last time and that's probably what triggered the review, there's no point of panicking. He'll have to go through the motion, pay the money back and that will be it.

Not nice to have to pay it back, but remember it is money he wasn't entitled to in the first place, so if you see more like you got a loan you now need to repay, then it doesn't feel so unfair.

Oblomov18 · 01/04/2018 07:49

I have had lots of dealings with DWP and HMRC and WTC etc for my job (I do accounts) and also my own personal affairs.

Don't let them bully you. Sometimes you get a rude jobsworth, next time you get someone perfectly pleasant and helpful.

Just be polite, firm, factual, take the name of every person you speak to, note it down.

Send a recorded letter, so you have a paper trail.

I enjoy saying things like : 'oh I spoke to Sarah on 23rd march at 9.30am and she said...... presumably you can see that from the notes'....WinkGrin
It lets them know you aren't going to be messed around.

Good luck.

Tromsogirl · 01/04/2018 08:57

EskiVodkaCranberry- Thank you. I have applied to our phone company for copies of phone bills for a year around that time. I’m waiting for them to arrive. We’ll see if the DWP phone number comes up and we can ask DWP for a transcript of that phone call. Thank you X
Swingofthings- yes. That’s right. We have no problem paying it back if we weren’t entitled to it. Thanks X
Oblomov18- Thank you. Sound advice. X
I’m so grateful for everyone’s support here. Thank you XXXX

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NotSuchASmugMarriedNow1 · 01/04/2018 21:07

All phone calls to Dwp are recorded so they should have a transcript of that conversation

BettyBaggins · 01/04/2018 21:14

Hope you find the details op, good luck.

Tromsogirl · 01/04/2018 22:06

BettyBaggins and NotSuchASmugMarriedNow1: thank you very much x

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Ilovecamping · 07/04/2018 01:03

DWP can trace phone calls from a given telephone number and arrange to transcribe calls. I know this as had lot of trouble with ESA claim and in the end had to put in a complaint. We were vindicated by the transcribed phone calls as they proved we had been misinformed by advisers.

Tromsogirl · 07/04/2018 14:10

Thank you all very much for your help and words of encouragement. Ilovecamping- how wonderful. It must have been a HUGE weight of your mind and allowed you to sleep at night. I am very pleased for you.

I have applied to the DWP for transcripts of phone calls. I used a SARS form available easily on the internet from a recognised site. My husband completed it as a Word document and we took it to the local job centre. A very kind lady faxed it to the correct department. It was such a relief. The DWP phoned back to say they had received it and they would supply the information within 40 days. However, the SARS form only allows you to request clerical or computer information, not specifically phone call transcripts so we wrote our request for phone call transcripts specifically on the form in the most appropriate box. Here's hoping. Also, I have applied to BT for our bills from that period but because they are all archived, it will take up to 25 working days to find them and then they will send them in the post. I was hoping for an electronic copy (as we have our bills online) so I could do an electronic search. Going through 12 months of phone call numbers will keep me busy. This means that the second interview under caution will be adjourned until I have the relevant evidence of a phone call and possible transcript. Thank you all for your support. I am really, really grateful X

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LadyLapsang · 07/04/2018 14:54

Well now he knows he should have declared it, can he not write to them recorded delivery requesting to repay anything he claimed in error? Does your DP just think he informed them of the pension or does he remember making a call and states they gave him some advice / told him what was going to happen next? In terms of his mental capacity at the time, was he arranging the care home etc. or did that have to be handled by another family member because he lacked capacity? If the latter, I would think he is in a stronger position, but if there is a clear difference - for example he wrote clear letters about the hospice or any legacy / tax for example, it may beg the question why he did not write to inform DWP about the pension.

Tromsogirl · 07/04/2018 19:39

Thank you for your post LadyLapsang. He is already in the process of investigation and has told them he is happy to pay back anything he should not have. Good points about his capacity. He did the arranging with a family member. We are looking at his capacity with theGP next week. Thank you X

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